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U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)

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Kat Stevens said:
One trick pony. Alec Baldwin shows up, does his little Trump shtick, heavily biased crowd laughs uproariously, musical act, closing monologue, roll credits.  Hasn't been funny since Mike Myers left.

In my mind Kat, SNL stopped being funny when Bulushi died and the rest, Chase, Akroid, Curtin, et al quit. The unfunny idiots since have pretty well fucked it. Alex Baldwin is one of the worst actors today. He now hosts an over rated game show.

FJAG said:
I agree in part with your observation and it's quite clear there is a large faction in the US that thinks that way. The problem is that we have two factions here who are each quite confident that the other one is the tone deaf party and that only they themselves have staked out the moral high-ground.

Where I disagree is that neither of these two factions are in the majority of the population because a large part of the population does not get involved in the elections. What we, in fact, have are minority groups that band together to raise enough votes to get someone elected. After an election we could argue forever (without anyone winning since no one trusts the polls anymore) about whether the elected official has the support of the majority of the people or just of the 'less than majority' faction that got him into power. Sadly, Nixon was right when he said that there is a "silent majority".

I also think it behoves us to remember that the "majority" have not been "told that they are wrong" for very long. Since WW2 the presidents were: Dem 8 yrs (Truman); Rep 8 yrs (Eisenhower); Dem 8 yrs (Kennedy, Johnson); Rep 8 yrs (Nixon, Ford); Dem 4 yrs (Carter); Rep 12 yrs (Reagan, Bush 1); Dem 8 yrs (Clinton); Rep 8 yrs (Bush 2); Dem 8 yrs (Obama).

It seems that every eight years or so the "majority" seems to flip so I guess they can only stomach one particular philosophy for eight years before they demand that the swamp be drained. It will be interesting to see if Trump will become the "Carter of the Republican Party" and be ousted after 4 years. ;D

:cheers:
Chris Pook said:
Sadly, the problem is not with the name of the party sitting in the Whitehouse.  The problem lies with 94% of Washington voting for one party.  The problem lies with civil servants actively campaigning against the government of the day and then cheering the replacement to the rafters.  The problem lies with civil servants actively working against the wishes of the populace as voiced in a referendum.  The problem lies with civil servants ignoring the wishes of their populations as expressed in referenda and imposing new constitutions on them.  The problem lies with the transfer of power from laws enacted by sovereign elected parliaments to regulatory bodies staffed by careerists protected from democratic supervision.

And that, I am afraid, leads us to the courts that interpret those regulations.

Your good health, Sir. 

:cheers:

Same problem here Chris . 39% voted for  Maggie's acid baby. And because Canadians are too disinterested, lazy, politically ìgnorant and, frankly, just plain stupid idiots. Not many look past that teensy particular issue that is affecting  them at the time. They will vote for a guy that promises that he will stop dogs from barking, while ignoring the dog that has a deathlock on their anķle and whenTrudeau has become a dictator, and not a single politician, lobbyist, or those that profess hope and change within the system will challenge him on his agenda. He has said Soros is his a close friend of his and a mentor. Why is it the rest of the world's MSM, demonizing Trump?  He's fighting Soros for the survival of a democratic society.

I don't have as much time in front of  'Your Honour' as I have in front of 'Your Worship. Neither has impressed me much . Ironically, the JPs seemed to be better versed in labour law than their peers who've been called to the bar.
 
'One of Saturday Night Live's most legendary openings featured the show's executive producer Lorne Michaels asking then-mayor Rudy Giuliani, "Can we be funny?" about three weeks after the September 11th, 2001 attacks. Giuliani responded "Why start now?" '

:)
 
The S hit the fan Today...It looks like Democrats and many Republicans are up in arms, ironically no shoe throwing across the floor, in consensus appalled by Trumps comments while being interviewed by FOX’s O’Reilly.

Putin most probably contacted his BFF Trump demanding an apology from FOX, and O’Reilly for calling him a Killer, while clearly Trump hastily defended Putin, while kicking America smack between her legs!

Russia Demands Apology From Fox News Over ‘Putin’s a Killer’ Remark.

The Russian government has demanded an apology from Fox News after anchor Bill O'Reilly called President Vladimir Putin "a killer" during an interview with U.S. President Donald Trump.

"We think such words a Fox News correspondent are unacceptable, insulting," Kremlin spokesman Dimitri Peskov told reporters, according to Russia's state-run RIA news agency.

"We would prefer to receive apologies to our president from such a respectable television company," he added.
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/russia-demands-apology-fox-news-over-putin-s-killer-remark-n717226


Trump defends Putin: 'You think our country's so innocent?'
News' Bill O'Reilly, saying he respected his Russian counterpart.
"But he's a killer," O'Reilly said to Trump.
"There are a lot of killers. You think our country's so innocent?" Trump replied.
A clip of the exchange was released Saturday and the full interview aired Sunday before the Super Bowl. http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/04/politics/donald-trump-vladimir-putin/

PREVIEW: Trump Tells O'Reilly He 'Respects' Putin in Super Bowl Interview.
http://insider.foxnews.com/2017/02/04/preview-bill-oreilly-donald-trump-super-bowl-interview

US-China war would be a disaster for the world, says Communist party.
http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/us-china-war-would-be-a-disaster-for-the-world-says-communist-party/ar-AAmEJvY?li=AAggNb9

Trump's belligerence towards Iran plays into the hands of Tehran's hardliners.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/feb/03/trumps-belligerence-towards-iran-plays-into-the-hands-of-tehrans-hardliners


Speaker Bercow: Trump should not speak in Parliament.

House of Commons Speaker John Bercow has said he would be "strongly opposed" to US President Donald Trump addressing the Houses of Parliament during his state visit to the UK.

Mr Bercow told MPs "opposition to racism and sexism" were "hugely important considerations".

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-38884604\


C.U.
 
FJAG said:
I don't quite buy that bit about the DC vote. Dc is in a strange situation in that there are more jobs there (728k of which 213k are Federal govt) then residents(618k+ of which 307k are employed). (I'm using 2011 statistics here and acknowledge the the numbers have changed a bit but not significantly https://www.doleta.gov/performance/results/AnnualReports/2011_economic_reports/dc_economic_report_py2011.pdf)

I've looked very hard to find an exact number for how many DC residents (and thereby voters) work for the Fed Govt but have been unable to find a statistic. By parsing various articles it seems to me to be less than 20% of those living in DC, and who are employed, work for the Feds. Up until very recently the majority of the population of DC was black (50.7% as at 2011) and there is still a significant percentage.

Considering that the residential parts of DC are generally much less affluent then those of its surrounding suburbs in Virginia and Maryland I think one can safely say that the vast majority of the civil servants that work for the Feds in DC and who have a high enough position in government where they might actually be able to interfere with initiatives live and vote outside of the DC area.

There is no doubt that the electorate in DC has a higher percentage of liberals than elsewhere but I tend to believe that DC's voting Democrat has much more to do with it's large percentage of black voters and the fact that it is a pure urban area (with no rural component) both of which lean Democrat.

I too have watched "Yes, Minister" and have seen how lethargic the civil service can be when it wants to be but in the end the various departments of government are run by their elected (or politically appointed) secretaries/ministers using laws enacted by an elected legislature and for the most part they do as they are told. (I really wish the civil service in Ontario would undermine a lot of the crap that comes out of the Liberals)

:cheers:

Josiah Burchett began his career as one of Pepys’s clerks; appointed secretary of the Admiralty in 1694, he remained in office until 1742.  His successor had served almost three decades in the Admiralty, as well eleven years at sea.  Philip Stephens then took the office in 1763 and held it for the next thirty years. Two generations of civil servants, and two only, would link the navy of Pepys and Monck with the navy of Nelson.

Arthur Herman: "To Rule The Waves", 2005 - p.241

Applying the same logic to the US in the modern world would suggest that in the halls of Foggy Bottom you will find linear antecedents who worked directly for Woodrow Wilson's State Department and that members of the OSS shaped the thinking of the current CIA.  The people that select their replacements and mentor them wish to ensure their strongly held beliefs are reflected in their institutions.  This isn't abnormal, nor is it malign.  It does however result in the inertia which makes institutions slow to react to changing situations.  Strangely enough it also means that over time institutions can become something different than what they were even as the outside world continues to perceive it as it was.

After WW2 had been won by "the liberal democracies", much to the consternation of authoritarians everywhere, the race was on to recover from the chaos. The authoritarians detested chaos and they detested liberal democracy as the harbinger of that chaos.  Not all the authoritarians had been defeated.  Authoritarians of socialist and christian stripes existed in Europe.  They equally existed in Britain, America and Canada.  They strove for "Peace, Order and Good Governance".  They achieved this by establishing new governing entities which over time became entrenched and became institutions.  Those entities, by and large, were populated by people that sought order, and sought to ensure it was their order.  That order voiced the principles of liberalism.  And demanded that everyone be liberal.

But that inherently denies the essence of liberalism. You can't demand that somebody be liberal.  Any more than the French can demand that you not be religious.  Liberalism is inherently chaotic.  It is chaotic because it is tolerant.  It permits anybody to believe anything they like.  It permits anybody to say anything they like.  It permits anybody to publish anything they like.  It permits anybody to associate with whomever they like.  In liberalism there is no "Truth".  There is only debate and freedom to act as you will with the single caveat - you will not harm your neighbour unless you are willing to accept the consequences.  Those consequences are determined not by higher authority but by your peers.

Unfortunately this Calvinist, Presbyterian, Congregationalist view of relations is not popular among those seeking Peace, Order and Good Governance.  So they adopted the forms of liberalism and determined to manage them.    They created a liberal order by declaring that the old church parties were now democrats - christian democrats,  that the old communist parties were now democrats - social democrats, some even declared themselves to be liberals, but managed liberals or liberal democrats.  The problem is, again, that liberalism does not permit of order - any ordering of liberalism will always be illiberal.

For a long while those that sought order carried on as they would while being ignored by those who could ignore them.  Those that could moved away or just disengaged from the system or tried to stay under the radar.    Anything for an easy life.

But eventually, when the jobs run out, when the mortgage can't get paid, there is little incentive to stay quiet.  The US and Canada have reached the point where the 30% of the population that didn't vote, the 20 to 40% that used to pay taxes but have dropped out of the labour pool early, find it easier to come forward and say "I disagree".

I am no big believer in Truth or Justice (or the American Way for that matter).  I believe in toleration - and keeping your fist out of my face.  I find toleration to be increasingly hard to come by.  I find a disconcerting tendency for people to raise fists in my face.

I can't find the reference just now but I just read an article yesterday with a quote that sums it all up for me. It was a Kansan farmer: "I don't mind them coming here and being Muslim.  So long as they don't mind me being Christian."
 
Further to my last on the DC vote.

Here are the votes in the suburbs of DC, Clinton/Trump

Washington        93/04
Pr Georges        89/08
Baltimore City    85/11
Alexandria City    77/18
Arlington            77/17
Montgomery        76/20
Fairfax                65/29
Howard              64/30
Charles              64/33
Fairfax City          62/31
Pr William            57/37
Baltimore            57/39
Manassas            55/39
Loudoun            55/39

Washinton and its suburbs are reliably Blue.  So I don't think you can start arguing that DC is an aberration in its vote or that the issue is a preponderance of black voters.  DC is simply the heart of a trend that starts within commuting distance of the capital.  The closer you get to the seat of power the more reliably blue the district becomes.

And the Republic begins 60 km from the Capitol.  In any direction.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2016/nov/08/us-election-2016-results-live-clinton-trump?view=map&type=presidential

 
Ikea is trying to cash in on the Trump border wall.

Now maybe Mexico would be willing to pay for that f'ing wall.

https://www.cnet.com/news/ikea-border-wall-president-trump-the-postillon/
 
Chris Pook said:
Further to my last on the DC vote.

Here are the votes in the suburbs of DC, Clinton/Trump

Washington        93/04
Pr Georges        89/08
Baltimore City    85/11
Alexandria City    77/18
Arlington            77/17
Montgomery        76/20
Fairfax                65/29
Howard              64/30
Charles              64/33
Fairfax City          62/31
Pr William            57/37
Baltimore            57/39
Manassas            55/39
Loudoun            55/39

Washinton and its suburbs are reliably Blue.  So I don't think you can start arguing that DC is an aberration in its vote or that the issue is a preponderance of black voters.  DC is simply the heart of a trend that starts within commuting distance of the capital.  The closer you get to the seat of power the more reliably blue the district becomes.

And the Republic begins 60 km from the Capitol.  In any direction.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2016/nov/08/us-election-2016-results-live-clinton-trump?view=map&type=presidential

The Falcons won the popular vote at the Superbowl, right? :)
 
Food for thought: sorry it's a bit long.

Trump’s lies are not the problem. It’s the millions who swallow them who really matter. Nick Cohen

Compulsive liars shouldn’t frighten you. They can harm no one, if no one listens to them. Compulsive believers, on the other hand: they should terrify you. Believers are the liars’ enablers. Their votes give the demagogue his power. Their trust turns the charlatan into the president. Their credulity ensures that the propaganda of half-calculating and half-mad fanatics has the power to change the world.

How you see the believers determines how you fight them and seek to protect liberal society from its enemies. And I don’t just mean how you fight that object of liberal despair and conservative fantasies, the alternately despised and patronised white working class. Compulsive believers are not just rednecks. They include figures as elevated as the British prime minister and her cabinet. Before the EU referendum, a May administration would have responded to the hitherto unthinkable arrival of a US president who threatened Nato and indulged Putin by hugging Britain’s European allies close. But Brexit has thrown Britain’s European alliance into crisis. So English Conservative politicians must crush their doubts and believe with a desperate compulsion that the alleged “pragmatism” of Donald Trump will triumph over his undoubted extremism, a belief that to date has as much basis in fact as creationism.

Mainstream journalists are almost as credulous. After decades of imitating Jeremy Paxman and seizing on the trivial gaffes and small lies of largely harmless politicians, they are unable to cope with the fantastic lies of the new authoritarian movements. When confronted with men who lie so instinctively they believe their lies as they tell them, they can only insist on a fair hearing for the sake of “balance”. Their acceptance signals to the audience the unbelievable is worthy of belief.

“Rednecks” are also embarrassingly evident among Britain’s expensively educated conservative commentators, who cannot see how the world has changed. They say that of course they don’t support everything Trump does. Their throats cleared and backs covered, they insist that the real enemy is his “foaming” and “hysterical” critics whose opposition to the alt-right is not a legitimate protest by democratic citizens but an “elitist” denial of democracy itself.

Brecht wrote against the dangers of inertia in 1935 as Hitler was changing Germany beyond recognition : Even in fabled Atlantis, the night that the ocean engulfed it, The drowning still cried out for their slaves.

As their old world is engulfed now, the sluggish reflexes and limited minds of too many conservatives compel them to cry out against liberal hypocrisy, as if it were all that mattered. There is more than enough hypocrisy to go round. I must confess to wondering about the sincerity of those who protest against the collective punishment of Trump’s ban on visitors from Muslim countries but remain silent when Arab countries deny all Israeli Jews admission. I too would like to know why there was so little protest when Obama gave Iran funds to spend on the devastation of Syria. But the greatest hypocrisy is always to divert attention from what is staring you in the face today and may be kicking you in the teeth tomorrow.

The temptation to think it a new totalitarianism is too strong for many to resist. Despite readers reaching for Hannah Arendt and George Orwell, strictly speaking, the comparison with fascism and communism isn’t true. When I floated it with the great historian of Nazism, Sir Richard Evans, he almost sighed. It’s not just that there aren’t the death camps and torture chambers, he said. The street violence that brought fascists to power in Italy and Germany and the communists to power in Russia is absent today.

The 21st-century’s model for a strongman is a leader who makes opposition as hard as possible, as Orbán is trying to do in Hungary, but does not actually declare a dictatorship, for not even Putin has done that.

To my mind, that does not make comparisons with the past fruitless, particularly in the case of the nihilistic and voraciously aggressive Trump. There are very few new ideas in politics. Parallels always illuminate. Aristotle warned of the “intemperance of demagogues”. Thucydides had the strutting Athenians sneer at the vanquished Melians that “the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must”. Both the warning and the threat from classical Greece are as contemporary as ever. Hannah Arendt described leaders who knew their followers would “believe the most fantastic statements one day, and trust that if the next day they were given irrefutable proof of their falsehood, they would take refuge in cynicism”. She was describing Mussolini, Hitler and Stalin. But her words apply as well to today’s Trump supporters, who gulp down incredible falsehoods and then dismiss the “crooked media” when the stories collapse.

We are not reliving the 20th century, for how could we? Rather, ideas from the past have melted and reformed into a postmodern fascistic style; a fascism with a wink in its eye and a bad-boy smirk on its face.

Conventional politicians and commentators are stranded because they were wholly unprepared for the new breed of leader who lies as a matter of policy as well as a matter of course. They are flailing around, and inventing phrases like “fake news” and “post-truth politics” to capture a state of affairs they think is entirely novel. Instead of saying that we are seeing something new, it is better to accept that something old and malignant has returned like foul water bubbling up from a drain.

Comparisons with 20th-century totalitarianism are not wholly exaggerated. With Trump, the lies are a dictatorial assertion of his will to power. “I am in control,” he says, in effect, as he conjures imaginary crowds at his inauguration or invents millions of illegal voters so he can pretend he won the popular vote. “You may know I am lying. But if you contradict me, I will make you pay.”

No one in the west has seen Trump’s kind of triumph in politics since the age of the dictators. But look around your workplace and perhaps you won’t be so surprised by their victories. If you are unlucky, you will see an authoritarian standing over you. The radical economist Chris Dillow once wrote that, while the fall of communism discredited the centrally planned economy, the centrally planned corporation, with the autocratic leader who tolerated no dissent, not only survived 1989, but blossomed.

Dillow is not alone in worrying about the harm the little Hitlers of the corporation might bring. Since the crash, economists have looked as a matter of urgency at how hierarchies encourage petty tyrants to brag their way to the top. They exhibit all the symptoms of narcissistic personality disorder: a desire to dominate, overconfidence, a sense of entitlement, an inability to listen to others or allow others to speak and a passion for glory. If you want to know how they can win the votes of those around them, remember Fred Goodwin’s vainglorious decision to takeover ABN Amro. Perhaps the single worst decision in UK business history, whose consequences we are still paying for, was not opposed by a single member of the RBS board.

In the right circumstances, compulsive liars can create compulsive believers, as Trump has done
Narcissists in business are more likely to seek macho takeovers and less likely to engage in the hard work of innovating and creating profitable firms, the researchers found. They are more likely to cook the books to feed their cults of the personality and make, if not America, then themselves look great again. Academics from the University of California have asked the obvious question: why would rational companies let the fascism of the firm survive? Surely they ought to be protecting their businesses, as free market theory dictates, rather than allow dangerous and grasping men and women to risk their destruction.

They found what most of us instinctively know to be true: in the right circumstances, compulsive liars can create compulsive believers, as Trump has done. “Overconfident individuals attained status” because their peers believed the stories they told about themselves. It should not be a surprise that Donald Trump, Arron Banks and oligarchs backing the Russian and east European strongmen come from business. The age of the dictators never came to an end in the workplace.

The unrepentant liar: Donald Trump and the Central Park Five

Long before anyone worried about the death of truth, Trump was showing that he might have based his career on the Don DeLillo character in Underworld, who says: “Some people fake their death, I’m faking my life.” (A motto that applies as well to Boris Johnson.) Of all his lies, none to my mind is more revelatory or more ominous for the future than the lies he told when people assumed he was just another loudmouthed tycoon.

In 1989, a white investment banker called Trisha Meili was horribly beaten and raped in New York’s Central Park. She had lost three-quarters of her blood and gone into a coma by the time the police found her. The authorities arrested five juveniles, four black and one Hispanic. In one of his first moves from business into politics, Trump said death was the only punishment they deserved. He took out adverts in the New York press declaring: “Mayor Koch has stated that hate and rancour should be removed from our hearts. I do not think so. I want to hate these muggers and murderers. They should be forced to suffer and, when they kill, they should be executed for their crimes. CIVIL LIBERTIES END WHEN AN ATTACK ON OUR SAFETY BEGINS!”

Trump dealt with the accusations of racist scaremongering by rehearsing a self-pitying line that would serve him well in the future. Whites were the true underprivileged in American society, he told NBC television. “A well-educated black enjoys tremendous advantages over a well-educated white in terms of the job market. If I were starting off today, I would love to be a well-educated black.”

You may oppose the death penalty. You may find Trump’s language reeked of the Munich beer hall. Cynical New Yorkers noted at the time that Trump was feuding with city bosses over tax abatements for his developments and was using the rape to attack a mayor who had damned him as “greedy”. For all that, you could think that this was still a legitimate response to a foul crime.

But mark the sequel. In 2002, a career criminal admitted to the rape and DNA evidence proved he was telling the truth. The police, it turned out, had forced confessions from their teenage suspects. The boys, now men, were released. But Trump refused to concede an inch of ground. He would not accept new evidence had put him in the wrong and the five were innocent. Even in 2014, when New York finally reached a compensation settlement with the victims of police abuse, Trump was still insisting that “settling doesn’t mean innocence” and the taxpayers of New York had been fleeced.

“It shows his character,” said Raymond Santana, one of the five Trump had smeared. So it does and, after that, nothing should surprise you. Connoisseurs of Don DeLillo’s American underworld will learn all they need to know about his character when they hear that Trump’s first lawyer was Roy Cohn, a grotesque figure from the McCarthy era of the 1950s. He persecuted real and imagined gays in public life who he claimed could be blackmailed. As so often with obsessive homophobes, Cohn gave every appearance of being a closet case and died of Aids in 1986. Before denying the human race the pleasure of his company, however, Cohn taught the young Trump to always attack and never conciliate. Whether Trump needed teaching is open to doubt.

This vision of life as a perpetual war you see so clearly in the Trisha Meili case is authentically totalitarian. Truth, reason, evidence, decency must all be sacrificed to the greater good of keeping the strongman looking strong. The weapons 21st-century technology provide for political warfare make me doubt that stopping Trump and his imitators will be easy. Just as Britain’s isolated Brexit government has no choice but to compulsively believe that Trump’s pragmatism will overwhelm his extremism, so Americans must hope that the checks and balances of the constitution will cage him. No one can see the future and both may be right. But, as I said, there is no evidence that they are. One reason for pessimism is that Trump’s character may make him worthless as a man but a success as a politician in our time of cyber-charlatanism.

After Trump’s victory, Hillary Clinton’s aide Ronald A Klain reflected with understandable shock on an election his candidate should never have lost. Trump tore up the rules of politics, Klain said, but still finished in the White House. The old wisdom was to apologise if you were in the wrong and move the conversation on with as much speed as you could manage. “If you’re explaining, you’re losing,” Ronald Reagan said, as he stated the commonsensical proposition that politicians should not dwell on their embarrassments.

Public relations in the Trump era:
brand all media outlets as ‘fake’


But Trump understood that Twitter, Facebook and 24/7 news had changed the world. The modern chancer needed to stay with the scandal and arm his supporters with instant explanations. The Trump campaign would not apologise. When caught in a scandal, it doubled down within minutes. It knew its supporters wouldn’t care if the experts they despised as thoroughly as Michael Gove dismissed Trump’s explanations for refusing to release his tax returns or feminists said his advocacy of sexual assaults was something more than “locker-room talk”. “The point is,” Klain said, “Trump supporters were armed with an explanation that they accepted and could use to defend their candidate” on social media.

The same need to instil a party line and protect his supporters from reasonable doubt leads Trump and his sidekicks once again to imitate dictators and attack the whole of the free press. Not just opposition journalists, mark you, but the entire media. The reasoning is obvious. Every one of the many financial and political scandals Trump will surely generate will emerge in the media. Every media organisation must therefore be branded as lying and fake before they publish. Journalists need to learn, if they have not learned already, that no accommodation is possible with the alt-right because its ideology and tactics preclude it from wanting an accommodation. You cannot “balance” or appease such people – you can only expose them.

Unless Twitter bans him, which it should if Trump incites violence, the same tactics can be used against politicians. Republican legislators will think hard about exercising their constitutional right to check a president if they know that Trump can use social media to provoke their supporters back home to denounce and harry them.

I am sorry if I am being “hysterical”, but I cannot see how conservatives can argue in conscience that there is nothing monstrous about the 45th President of the United States. The Ku Klux Klan has endorsed him. He has brought Steve Bannon, a true postmodern fascist, to the centre of power. Bannon exemplifies the Nazi jurist Carl Schmitt’s sinister ideal of a political leader who unites his supporters by creating enemies for them to hate. Bannon and the alt-right have made Islam – not al-Qaeda, Islamic State, or the Shia theocrats in Tehran but all Muslims – their enemy of choice. They unite their supporters on racial lines against blacks, Jews and Latinos too. As a former journalist on his Breitbart site explained, Bannon believes “in a nutshell that western culture is inseparable from European ethnicity”.

Nor, and even when all due deference has been paid to the learned objections of Richard Evans and other historians, is it a sign of hysteria to say that western democracies are seeing an increase in the indulgence of political violence that echoes the 1930s. Once, the apologetics were confined to the worst elements in the liberal-left. In the last decade, I could feel the thrill of satisfaction as they decided that the latest terrorist massacre was a just and righteous punishment for the wars of Tony Blair and George W Bush.

As late as 2015, an article for Jeremy Corbyn’s Stop the War was saying that the slaughter of civilians in Paris was “the result of deliberate policies and actions undertaken by the United States and its allies”, while the National Union of Students was deciding that it would be “Islamophobic” to criticise Islamic State. (A genuinely racist notion, incidentally, that implies, Bannon-style, that all followers of Islam welcome the mass murder of unbelievers and the sexual enslavement of captured women.)

Reacting with violence against Trump? That’s exactly what he wants…

Just as the far-left has moved from the fringe to take over the once mainstream British Labour party, so the far-right has moved in to take over America’s Republicans. Violence and fear are its fellow travellers. Look at Trump telling his supporters to “knock the crap” out of protesters at his rallies, or at the contempt with which the Daily Mail greeted the verdict and sentencing handed to the murderer of Jo Cox, or the loathing with which Nigel Farage treated her widower. Try, then, to put yourself in the place of a black or Muslim American and imagine how they feel about what is to come.

There are few reasons to be cheerful. But amid the despair, I hope I am not being naive in sensing new forces stirring and the will to fight back hardening. We are now at the beginnings of a new opposition movement, a liberal version of backlash politics, which feels the urgent need to drive the right from power.

It could all go wrong. Trump, Bannon, Farage and the Tory right want to polarise societies. They can look to the example of Bashar al-Assad and see a path to victory. The dictator won by shooting down the peaceful demonstrators of the Arab Spring and targeting moderate forces in the civil war that followed. By the time he was finished, there was no middle ground left. Assad could turn to the brutalised survivors and say: “See, it’s either me or Islamic State now. That’s your only choice. What’s it going to be?”

Understand the logic of polarisation and you will understand that Trump wants a violent reaction. He wants to be able to tell white Americans that his opponents are “professional anarchists”, as he said last week. He wants liberals to treat all his supporters as if they are as debased as he is. He can then turn to his base and say liberals hate them because they are white; that they see them as nothing more than stupid, deplorable bigots. Force me from power, he will conclude, and these hate-filled enemies will come for you and give the “tremendous advantages” he was pretending blacks enjoyed in the 1980s to their favoured minorities.

The alternative, and not only in America, is to go back to the despised and patronised working-class followers of the right. You should try to win them over in elections rather than march with the already converted at rallies. You should cordon off the true racists and fascists and listen to and argue with the rest with a modicum of respect. If that can happen, then perhaps the world will learn that the best way to end the power of compulsive liars is to break the compulsion of their followers to believe.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/feb/05/donald-trump-lies-belief-totalitarianism

:cheers:
 
FJAG said:
Food for thought: sorry it's a bit long.

Trump’s lies are not the problem. It’s the millions who swallow them who really matter. Nick Cohen

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/feb/05/donald-trump-lies-belief-totalitarianism

:cheers:

See you and raise you.

Andrew Coyne: It’s not the Liberals’ fault for lying about electoral reform, it’s yours for believing them

Andrew Coyne | February 1, 2017 8:08 PM ET

It’s your fault, Canadians. You failed to live up to the standards your prime minister expected of you. You had your chance and you blew it.

It isn’t that the Liberals promised something they had no intention of ever delivering. The fault is yours, for not making it possible for them to deliver it. When the Liberal platform said the 2015 election would be “the last federal election conducted under the first-past-the-post voting system,” when the Liberal leader repeated this vow 10, 20, 100 times since, you did not, as you should have done, attach a giant asterisk that read: “Assuming we don’t change our mind.”  You took them at their word.

But that is not your worst failing. It is how you have behaved since the election that really marks you out for blame. Put plainly, you let your government down. It isn’t the Liberals’ fault, for wasting seven months before even launching the committee on electoral reform, leaving it with an impossibly short time-frame to report. Neither can the Liberals be held to account, when the committee reported back, on deadline, with a recommendation that a proposal for proportional representation be put to the people in a referendum, for dismissing its findings with a claim that they had failed to furnish the government with a specific model of reform: more specific, that is, than that it should be proportional.

It wasn’t the Liberals who put a rookie minister with no judgment, ability or interpersonal skills in charge of the file, or who cooked up a biased and insultingly off-topic online survey with which to muddy the committee’s findings. Or rather it was, but they are not to be blamed for the delay, confusion and general sense of drift surrounding the file. Rather, it was you. You are to blame. Or, more precisely, you are being blamed.

For, as the prime minister explained in his mandate letter to the new Minister of Democratic Institutions, also a rookie, “a clear preference for a new electoral system, let alone a consensus, has not emerged.” So you see: You didn’t step up. You failed to show leadership. You left the hard work of governing to the government. Like the committee, which did not do a job it was not assigned, you did not answer a question you were never asked.


Now, you may wish to protest that this is untrue: that the overwhelming majority of those who presented testimony before the committee, whether experts or laymen, argued for some form of proportional representation, and that this, rather than the details of design, was the fundamental question before Canadians.

Further, you may point to the results of that online questionnaire that hundreds of thousands of Canadians dutifully filled out, which for all the skewed questions and tendentious summaries showed a clear willingness to entertain the idea of multi-party governments, of a kind that critics of proportional representation warn will bring disaster.

Finally, you may object that, even now, even after all the government’s dithering and manipulation and lies, there is nothing whatever to prevent it from proceeding with reform if it had any desire to: with or without a referendum, on any model or models it cared to propose. But this simply shows that you have not been listening.

For as the prime minister patiently explained — not to you, but to his minister — “without a clear preference or a clear question, a referendum would not be in Canada’s interest.” Perhaps you think framing a clear question is the government’s job. Perhaps you imagine that the point of a referendum is to find out what people prefer, that to object to a referendum on the grounds that there was no clear preference in advance is to object to ordering a meal on the grounds that the waiter should have already brought it to you.

But that is because you are still, even at this late date, investing some literal meaning in the prime minister’s words, as if what he said and what he intended bore any relationship to each other. But if there is anything that you should have learned by now, after the two deficits of $10 billion that turned into 40 years of deficits as high as $30 billion — and the non-combat mission against ISIS that turned into troops on the ground firing and being fired upon; and the open competition to replace the F-35 that turned into another sole source contract; and the Saudi arms deal and the “revenue neutral” tax cut and all the rest  — it is that you have no business believing a word that comes out of this prime minister’s mouth; that the most solemn promises, however unequivocal and however often repeated, are to him and the people around him mere bait for the gullible; and that if you ever believe anything they tell you ever again, on any matter large or small, if you ever trust them to keep their word from this day forward, then you deserve everything you have coming to you.

It is not their fault for lying to you. It is your fault for believing them.

http://news.nationalpost.com/full-comment/andrew-coyne-its-not-the-liberals-fault-for-lying-about-electoral-reform-its-yours-for-believing-them

in-god-we-trust-all-other-pay-cash7.jpg


:cheers:

 
Chris Pook said:
See you and raise you.

http://news.nationalpost.com/full-comment/andrew-coyne-its-not-the-liberals-fault-for-lying-about-electoral-reform-its-yours-for-believing-them

:cheers:

Good One.

Actually, while I despise the Liberals I can't feel the outrage that others do about their abandoning this platform promise.

I think I'm going to go on listening watch on this thread for a bit.

It's starting to feel like it's the same small group of us hashing out the same points over and over again.

I know it's a fertile field and every day brings a new outrage from one side or the other that needs addressing but I think I'll let others chatter for a while.

Have a good one.

:cheers:
 
cupper said:
Obviously you did not watch SNL last night, or you would have seen defifitive proof that satan is running the White House.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/arts-and-entertainment/wp/2017/02/05/alec-baldwin-returns-as-snls-trump-where-an-evil-stephen-k-bannon-is-actually-president/?utm_term=.cb3e95141d87

February 7, 2017

"If you’re wondering why President Donald Trump hasn’t tweeted about “Saturday Night Live’s” terrible ratings, here’s one likely theory: The NBC sketch-comedy series is having its most-viewed season in 22 years."
http://pagesix.com/2017/02/07/trump-spoofs-drive-snl-ratings-to-22-year-high/
 
Melissa McCarthy's impression of Spicer had me in stitches.  Took me a few seconds to realise it was her and even then I wasn't sure I believed it.
 
The current topic of interest is the silencing of Sen. Warren for impugning a fellow member Sen. Sessions. The story as told by her and others is that she was silenced because of her reading of Coretta Scott King's letter from 30 years ago. But it was long before that when she said

“He made derogatory and racist comments that should have no place in our justice system.”
“To put Sen. Sessions in charge of the Department of Justice is an insult to African-Americans.”

http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-action/senate/318422-senate-votes-to-silence-warren-after-sessions-speech

The above quote was before she read the letter. Now she is twisting the facts to try to make herself look like a hero. As well she wants to make the GOP look evil in not letting the letter be read even though they shut her down before that. She is trying to use this to raise some funds for her very tough reelection campaign in 2 years. Of course social media has grabbed a hold of this and is going crazy. Even Sen. Booker got in on the act. You can see he is setting up for a run in 2020 for president.

http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-action/senate/318431-booker-warren-vote-tantamount-to-censure

 
Remember Senator Warren claimed to be a native american - when she wasnt.
 
Let's see who wins this one with 52 Republicans vs. 46 Democrats + 2 Independent in the Senate -- in the interests of balance, I've mixed up the sources a bit ...
Even for fake newsers, something approximating the truth's gotta be in the middle there somewhere ...
 
FJAG said:

Sorry to burst your bubble but the 9th Circus er Circuit is over turned 80% of the time.Both Judge Robard and the appellate court ignored existing law which grants the President the authority to decide who can enter the US.Its a national security issue. I think we shall see a full court press to get Judge Gorsuch approved by the Senate. I have to say that this stumble is due to inexperience.

Experts think Trump should redraft his EO adding the number of terrorist acts committed by immigrants from the 7 countries cited in the EO. Basically the strategy should be to amend the EO rather than go to the Supreme Court where he might well lose. Anyway National Review has an excellent analysis of the ruling.

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/444785/ninth-circuit-travel-ban-donald-trump-ruling
 
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