Pics from Op Athena

[Gunner]

There is so much wrong with the last two post I just have to respond.

I also had the honor of spending a month into 1 Bde's tour, witnessing the handover and change of command as well as attitudes.   I have to honestly say I was embarrassed to be from 1 Bde.   After telling my new found friends that Kandahar didn't go to anyones head and that they will send only the best, I was mortified to see that most people introduced themselves to 5 Bde as "well this sure isn't Kandahar". You don't say...Come on guys stop living in the past.   I was there too, I didn't run around bragging about it to the Vandoos.   Different mission, different goal.  

Most members of Roto 2 (upwards of 95%) probably weren't on Op APOLLO so I don't know who was saying this (it certainly wasn't the majority).   I have spoken with members of 3 PPCLI who had served in both location and guess what, this isn't Kandahar!   It's Kabul a totally different mission.   ATHENA is a very comfortable mission compared to my two previous ones.   Moreover, do you really want me to start posting stories of your buddies from 5 Bde?   They didn't do us many favours either.  

I was also shocked to here a PPCLI WO say we are at war, why don' t we have the full support of blah blah.   WAR!!!!!   In case I missed the news article this is a peace mission.   Security Assistance. To many people lose focus and go off on their own agendas.

Geez, I'm glad to see you have never been misquoted or been misinterpreted.   Be careful how you through around the terms "peace mission" and "security assistance".   Look up the UN mandate, it is a Chapter VII peace enforcement mission and it has very robust ROE.

So after all that my point is don't assume that all CSS are wogs.

  I will agree with you there.   You really haven't impressed me with your holier than thou post.   5 GMBC soldiers were tired and wanted to get out, 1 CMBG soldiers were keen to get going on the mission.   Soldiers say things in passing as a way of establishing their turf. I wouldn't worry that much about it.

Kevin:

The TF RSM is a Trucker - and unfortunately the RSM does dictate kit.

  TF RSM is a Strathcona not a trucker.   Unless you are thinking of the NSE RSM.   He doesn't have any say over you now.  

Now the kit rule only seems to apply to the 031's and 011's - for several other groups who seem to think they are JTF (but aren't close) are running odds and sods kit.

I don't know why people automatically feelt they can wear whatever they want and they get up in arms when someone questions them on it.   We have some of the best kit in the world right now.   If you don't like something, but in a UCR.

This is a Chapter VII mission - so it is theoretically a warfighting mandate - unlike Bosnia/Crotia or Cyprus (and I miss that tour) we have some very robust ROE's that allow us to go get bad guys.

I'll assume you mean UNPROFOR days?   SFOR is a chapter 7 mandated mission and has slightly less robust ROE than we currently have.

 

[Northern Touch]

nice pics Kevin, those are ones you don't see everyday.

I'm curious tho, has there been any talk of getting the arid pattern on the tac vests?  From far away they must look like a green blob floating around in a sandy desert.

 

[KevinB]

Gunner,

My understanding is the TF RSM was our old RQ -- Maybe the message got garballed - either way not happy with the kit sit. 

We are submitting a UCR on the TV and the Bianchi UM-84 pistol holster...

Yes on the UNPROFOR issue.


CSS types - the EME SEAL comment is not meant to paint all with a broad brush - I am precluded (should be our word of the week) for explaining some of the reasons for it...


More photo's coming (maybe)

 

[Soleman]

Gunner,

So I guess I have been misinterpreted.  Talk about taking things out of context.  My main point was the difference in attitude between the two brigades.  How things were done differently and how I think Kandahar went to some pers heads. It was very evident watching the transition. You may not have seen being part of the incoming crew. And as far as the bragging of Op Apollo, you can call me a lier, but I heard it myself more than once and people that new I was there asked if i new this person or that person because they were spouting off at the mouth. It may not have been the majority but from the number of times i heard it it seemed like the majority.  No doubt people want to assert their position, sand boxes are in school, we are all one army.  I read a post here that was telling people to stop using rank and posting their UER's as if they were bragging about what they have done.  I am in no way bragging and have learned alot from a variety of different MOC's.  Whenever you deploy to a new mission, YES use you past experiences as a guide but bend them and shape them to apply to your current mission.  Don't assume just because you have been there before it will be the same.  I know a few people that did and they were extremely disappointed once they got on ground.

I do not doubt that most pers had a crappy handover.  I also have no doubt that 1 Bde did a crappy Strategic Recce.  Most of this is also probably linked to the fact that the mission was announced at the last minute and pieced together.  I never said the Vandoos were perfect but they definately changed my attitude on how I view them.  

As far as your point about OPSEC,  It is great you have access to the DIN to get information to research on people. What does that prove?  But what have you been taught about OPSEC?  

Operations Security: [The] process denying to potential adversaries information about capabilities and/or intentions by identifying, controlling and protecting generally unclassified evidence of the planning and execution of sensitive activities.

I have not given away any information on how or what tactics are employed or how missions are executed.  

To put inmy two cents on the whole CHAPTER VII thing,

Right on the homepage of the ISAF website tells us why ISAF is there.  I know the ROE's; same as the one's I had.  Again just saying certain people should look at this website to confirm why they are there.  Going into a mission with the wrong attitude, misinformation and not understanding what the endstate is supposed to be gets people injured or worse...killed.

http://www.afnorth.nato.int/ISAF/
http://www.un.org/aboutun/charter/chapter7.htm    
Chapter VII
ACTION WITH RESPECT TO THREATS TO THE PEACE, BREACHES OF THE PEACE, AND ACTS OF AGGRESSION

ISAF was established, to assist the Afghan Transitional Authority (Afghan TA) in maintaining security within the ISAF Area of Responsibility (AOR) so that the Afghan TA, as well as the personnel of the United Nations (UN), can operate in a secure environment in order to enable the Afghan TA the build up of security structures in Afghanistan in accordance with the Bonn Agreement and as agreed in the Military Technical Agreement (MTA).

ISAF has a peacekeeping mandate. NATO peacekeepers are permitted to protect their own lives, taking aimed shots and using the minimum force required.  And this is not an OPSEC breach it is posted on the ISAF web site.  Chapter 7 dictates what kind of force can be used, the mandate definately influences this. ROE's do not allow you to go get "the bad guys", they tell you how to protect yourself if you run into the bad guys.  

Anyways, I was not trying to impress anyone with a HOLIER THAN THOU POST only offer up my opinion on others thoughts.  It gets pretty tiring to hear log wogs know nothing and always get their way and I am sure the same goes for the combat arms units.

KevinB

WRT kit, what are you trying to put in your vest?  Granted I never had a M203 or C9 to worry about extra ancillerary stuff.  But between the two front bottom pouches and the two large side pouches I was able to carry enough.  Are you mounted or dismounted?  Also start getting picky about what you really need when you are dismounted. If you are mounted then take advantage of the wheels and bring a bug out bag.  I agree with Gunner, we do have some of the best kit in the world right now. Go take a look at the Belgians.  
As far as the holster goes, yes it was required. The Bianci has no anti tampering mechanism, not good when you are in crowds of people.  Canada does need a new pistol holster.

 

[Gunner]

Soleman, maybe I was a little hard on you.       It drives me batty when people complain about this unit or that unit, reg vs reserve, offr vs NCM, etc. You and I both know that 3 PPCLI BGs deployment on Op APOLLO went to some of their heads but you don't label the entire Task Force under that brush.   Like I mentioned, most of us are here in Afghanistan for the first time.   Most of the amenities we have in Julien are over and above what we have experienced in the past (APOLLO or no APOLLO).   Christ, I had a French Vanilla Cappachino this afternoon.  

With regards to the Chapter 7 information. I think you will find that Op APOLLO was conducted under a Chapter 7 mandate same as all the rest of recent missions, but the mission was different.

Anyways, I was not trying to impress anyone with a HOLIER THAN THOU POST only offer up my opinion on others thoughts.   It gets pretty tiring to hear log wogs know nothing and always get their way and I am sure the same goes for the combat arms units.

My apologies if I jumped on you.   Take the comments about log, etc, with a grain of salt.   Most people complaining don't know the whole story all of the time.

I hope you continue to visit the site.

Cheers,

 

[Highland Laddie]

A/N PAS-13 Thermal Weapon Sight - it is the sh*t (and lighter than the C79...)

Just for clarification - is the kit crap, or good? Those of us in the Reserves get to see this stuff once in a blue moon, so we don't get the " hand's on kit intell " that the Regs do. As we all know, what the PAM / docs say about the kit, and what it actually is like is often very different. For my own info / PD, please advise. Cheers.

 

[KevinB]

The TWS is a great piece of kit - however it suffers from the same problem all of over other dedicated Weapons NV has - the RTZO issues with the removal of it and the day sight.


Soleman - the C9 Gunner cannot fit his basic load in the TV...
            With a C8 I am out of room with no water.
The 031 kit list is a little different than others.

I am still wearing my CADPAT AR Chest rig and Safairland holster  Any good assisting officers out there?

 

[Highland Laddie]

The TWS is a great piece of kit - however it suffers from the same problem all of over other dedicated Weapons NV has - the RTZO issues with the removal of it and the day sight.

Thanks Kevin B. Keep up the good posts.

 

[scm77]

I am still wearing my CADPAT AR Chest rig and Safairland holster Any good assisting officers out there?

Kevin, do you recce guys get to wear/use pretty much whatever you want over there?

 

[KevinB]

Unfortunately 1VP did not contribute to the Recce element - we (1VP) are all force protection assets.

We were wearing what we wanted to (read what works) but the Chain has gotten invovled and we are now mandated to wear CF kit (even if it kills us) - we have tabled numerous UCR's (Unserviceable Condition Reports) on items of kit (Holster, TACVEST etc.) and are waiting for Ottawa (cause TF is not) to let us go back to wearing suitable items.
- This kit restriction is on all TF troops (Strats as well as 3VP and us)

anyway so here are more pics

 

[MJP]

Hmm I resemble one of the guys in that picture.......weird how that works.

TOO bad there is no pic of an unnamed person almost falling on his @ss while firing....eh Kev? 

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Could you elaborate on the UCR's esp about the tac vest.

 

[MikeM]

Firing the C6 from the shoulder?! Damn!  ;D

Awesome pictures, thanks for posting them.

 

[KevinB]

MJP, Thankfully Brian missed that pic...

- I should admit MJP is a lot better with the C6 than me - my "group" was more of a pattern...

 

[KevinB]

CFL - when it is done I will post it  ;D

 

[MJP]

LOL Kev....Granted tight groupings with the C6 is usually not needed though.

How does that saying go Kev.....more time at the gym rather than on Jim?

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Thanks

 

[foerestedwarrior]

Awesome pics guys.

question- how do the AR CADPAT's were compared to the TW ones(ie. fading)

 

[MJP]

The fading problem that most people encountered with their TW combats was due to a flaw in the manufacturing of the material itself.  It has been corrected and well there is some fading(any piece of clothing that is subjected to harsh wear will fade), it is not as pronounced as it was when CADPAT was first introduced.

 

[MikeM]

I've noticed that a lot more photos from OP Athena show our soldiers in the Arid CADPAT, as opposed to them being in their greens for the majority of their tours such as on ROTO 0 when the dress of the day was primarily the TW Cadpat, from what I've been told by soldiers who were there. I believe it was something to do about looking aggressive and that the Arid combats were primarily used by those outside of the city. I might be wrong, if someone could clarify that would be greatly appreciated.

I'm just curious since I've seen more photo's of soldiers in the Arid Combats. 8)

Again, awesome pics!