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Logistics Officer - Sea [Merged]

Hello, I have just finished my application process for CEOTP Artillery Officer, my work in progress degree is in Business Administration and I am an Accounting major.
I am adamant in becoming a Combat Arms Officer, but during my interview the recruiter told me eventually, because of my education in Accounting the CF would want me to possibly transfer to Logistics. Right now the combat arms is what I really have my heart set on and has been my whole reason to volunteer.

My question is if one day I want a new challenge and think of going into Logistics, is it possible to earn your professional accounting designation specifically the Chartered Accountant designation (CA) in the Logistics section of our Military?

I have searched the forums as best I could, but couldn't find an answer for this, I just want to make sure the recruiter gave me correct information when he said yes I could in fact earn in it while in the forces (I am one of those people who likes to double check info).

Regards,

Deebs
 
???

CEOTP Arty Officer...check.  The thread title is Accouting in Logistics....

2+2=B here so far.  ;D
 
Sorry guys technical difficulties with my Laptop. Post was submitted before I finished it.

Modified to reflect what I intended.
 
The only sponsored CA positions are for logistics officers.  There are certain sponsored post grad positions for MBAs and related fields for Cbt Arms officers.  But as an Arty officer you would not be streamed into financial management positions.
 
Knowing I am not in my own lane here, but...is this something that falls under CFAO 9-33, specifically in Para 2?

2. In this order, "post-graduate training" (PGT) means special courses conducted at a recognized university or institution for which a baccalaureate degree, or similar qualification acceptable to the university or institution concerned, is a prerequisite; but limited to those courses that will qualify an officer to meet an established Canadian Forces (CF) requirement for specific knowledge and skills and which may lead to a higher academic qualification. Such training may be provided to an officer:
a. to satisfy a requirement for an officer occupation or sub-occupation specification;
b. to satisfy the validated requirement of one or more established positions in the CF; or
c. to develop the knowledge, skills and experience of selected officers so that they may assume more responsible and complex duties.


 
Deebs said:
My question is if one day I want a new challenge and think of going into Logistics, is it possible to earn your professional accounting designation specifically the Chartered Accountant designation (CA) in the Logistics section of our Military?

I have searched the forums as best I could, but couldn't find an answer for this, I just want to make sure the recruiter gave me correct information when he said yes I could in fact earn in it while in the forces (I am one of those people who likes to double check info).

As a CEOTP entrant regardless of occupation, you could finish your degree (in fact you have to finish) and even in accounting, but it would mostly be on your own time and with some reimbursement of the cost.  However, to finish the other requirements of a CA while in the CF is another matter.  It would not happen as a combat arms officer, though a lucky few are selected for postgraduate training (generally in subjects that have relevance to their occupation or a specific position that they would fill following completion of the post-grad).  Some (a very small some) logisticians may be authorized (and fully subsidized) to complete a Chartered Accountancy.  The selection would be on a competitive basis and would be to meet the needs of the CF not the educational aspirations of a member.  The recruiter may have only been confirming that finishing your accounting degree was possible; he may not have been aware of the other requirements to obtain a CA.

http://www.icao.on.ca/Public/AboutCAProfession/1009page3376.aspx
Qualifications

Chartered Accountants must meet the highest standards of financial expertise, strategic thinking, business insight and leadership. The CA profession’s commitment to excellence and the public interest provides the crucial foundation for this trust. In fact, Canadian CAs are recognized around the world for high professional standards and expertise. Becoming a CA requires:

A university degree including 17 specified courses
30 months of practical employment experience with an Institute-approved training office
Completion of the Institute’s Professional Program
Passing the national Uniform Evaluation (UFE) – one of the most demanding professional examinations in the world
 
Blackadder1916 thanks for your input.

I know all about the CA process it is quite demanding. my Audit teacher mentioned the way to do it regarding the military would be with the auditor general, and frankly I don't see that happening.

Artillery is my desire regardless, but concerning this matter I figured it would be best to have correct information for useful decision making.

 
Deebs,

My undergrad is in commerce with my major being accounting.

From my understanding, to earn your CA your articling period must be completed at an approved public firm OR in some capacity at CRA.

Accounting within the military in my opinion would be geared more towards a CMA designation, as it more commonly involves management applications of accounting vice the audit nature (at first anyway) of what you would see in the CA world. The type of experience you would get in the military in an accounting setting would allow you to work towards a CGA or a CMA, not a CA.

For more detailed info. I'd reference the CICA's website. They explain the requirements of the program in further detail...
 
Hi All,

I was wondering how easy it is to transfer your skills and knowledge learned from a reservist log officer career to the private sector. Also, it probably depends on your log speciality and the type of civil job, but I am curious to know from your experience how the private sector evaluates a candidate that has learned log in CF?

Regards,
 
Antoine said:
Hi All,

I was wondering how easy it is to transfer your skills and knowledge learned from a reservist log officer career to the private sector. Also, it probably depends on your log speciality and the type of civil job, but I am curious to know from your experience how the private sector evaluates a candidate that has learned log in CF?

Regards,

No personal experience here, but lots of what you learn as a log officer is transferrable to the private sector. Supply chain management, vehicle life cycle management, financial management and administration...the list goes on. If you want a CF officer job where you can easily move into a related civvy position, log is one of the better ones.
 
Antoine said:
Hi All,

I was wondering how easy it is to transfer your skills and knowledge learned from a reservist log officer career to the private sector. Also, it probably depends on your log speciality and the type of civil job, but I am curious to know from your experience how the private sector evaluates a candidate that has learned log in CF?

Regards,

Not to be ignorant, but why would this be any different from any other job application you may make in your lifetime?  You do up a CV/Resume and list all your qualifications and experience.  You list all of your skills acquired from the CF, Courses, other jobs, etc.  This would be no different than had you been in any other job.  It all boils down to how good you are at "selling yourself".
 
I say also that often we are hired for what we know and we are kept or fired for who we are  ;D

In my field (R&D, pharma, biotech,...), many but not all managers are reluctant to hire people that have worked at universities or for governmental agencies. Sad too say that they fall in the trap of reductionism and stereotyping.

I was wondering how much this twisted tendency was also found in logistic/administrative area about CF and private sector.

However, I agree 100% that whatever the circumstance, the responsibility of success is on the shoulder of individual unless extreme situation. If someone is smart enough to target the right place at the right time or even better to create opportunities then sky is the limit !

Cheers,
 
George Wallace said:
Not to be ignorant, but why would this be any different from any other job application you may make in your lifetime?  You do up a CV/Resume and list all your qualifications and experience.  You list all of your skills acquired from the CF, Courses, other jobs, etc.  This would be no different than had you been in any other job.  It all boils down to how good you are at "selling yourself".

George I don't see what relation your post has to the original question?

It seems to me he was inquiring as to what type of experience one would attain as a LOG-O in the CF. Any semi-intelligent person can match experience with actual job requirements.
 
zorro said:
George I don't see what relation your post has to the original question?

It seems to me he was inquiring as to what type of experience one would attain as a LOG-O in the CF. Any semi-intelligent person can match experience with actual job requirements.

???

Did you even read my post?  Did you read what I was replying to?  If you miss the relevance, then I may suggest you pay a little more attention to detail.
 
Ok here goes.  I know little to nothing about what a Navy Log Officer is all about.  If there are any of you out there (I know I know, its the army.ca site!) could you please enlighten me.  I had previously ruled it out but I am (maybe) coming around to the idea.

1.  What are the primary employment areas for junior officers?

2.  How often am I away on training, at sea, just not able to come home at the end of the day?

3.  How does promotion work?  How do I move up?  Can I defer promotion in order to stay in Halifax/Esquimalt/Wherever and not uproot the family repeatedly?

4.  Is the naval side of log officer in any greater demand than green or blue?  Or is it really all the same in the beginning?

5.  How extensive are cross-postings?  Might I find myself as a QM at 2 RCR for example as a navy slt?

Thanks!
 
Let me try to answer your questions.

1.  What are the primary employment areas for junior officers?

The primary employment for junior Naval Logistics Officers is in support to naval operations, be it on a support base, in headquarters or in a ship.  All of your initial training (after basic and second language training) is focused on the duties and responsibilities of a Ship's Logistics Officer (AKA Supply Officer or SYO although responsibilities are not limited to supply).  In the ship, you are responsible for all logistics support, which includes supply, food services, finance (both public and non-public) and transport.  You are also responsible for the RMS Clerks in the Ship's Office who are in your Department, but they largely work for the Executive Officer.  Employment in HQ and on the support base is generally in the same areas except for transport and food services (unless you are also specifically qualified as food services officer).

2.  How often am I away on training, at sea, just not able to come home at the end of the day?

It really depends on your circumstances.  All the training that has to take place before you get to your first ship can take upwards of two years from the point where you're sworn in.  After Basic and Second Language Training, you will have to do a common logistics course with your Army and Air Force brethren.  Then you will have to do the actual Sea Log course.  You will also have to do a sea environmental course (damage control, firefighting, difference between the sharp end and the blunt end, etc) and a naval operations course.  After all the courses are done, you are finally ready to go to sea at which point you will be posted to either Halifax or Esquimalt, if you're not there already.  You will then be employed somewhere until a training billet becomes available in a ship.  Up to this point, after basic, you are essentially home every night.  If your family is with you, life is good as long as they don't interfere with your studying.  Often times however, your family will be on one of the coasts and you will be in Borden on course for several weeks at a time (last time I checked, the Sea Log course was either 10 or 16 weeks).

Once you get to the ship, you start an "apprenticeship" of approximately 10 months where you act as the "baby" to the SYO.  You can expect a number of trips over this period, sometimes for a week or two, but you can usually count on at least two trips of up to two months.  You can also end up in a ship that will do a six month deployment.  The reality is that you want to sail as much as possible in order to get the experience.  Over the course of the next ten months, you will work in all the different Divisions of the Department  and you will have a list of requirements which you will have to complete.  Finally, if the SYO and the Captain feel you're ready, you will sit a board where a bunch of senior Naval Logistics Officers will grill you for two to three hours on what you have learned.  It's actually not as bad as it sounds - plenty of us have survived.  Once you pass the Board, you are then considered fully qualified and employable.  You have also joined a pretty exclusive club.  Your next appointment will likely be ashore while you await the opportunity to go back to sea as a Head of Department (HOD).


3.  How does promotion work?  How do I move up?  Can I defer promotion in order to stay in Halifax/Esquimalt/Wherever and not uproot the family repeatedly?

Once you get all the ticks in the box, promotion to Lt(N) is automatic and will come at the appropriate time.  It usually coincides with completion of your Board.  Promotion to LCdr is on merit and generally won't happen until after you have served a tour as a HOD in a frigate.  Some LCdrs return to sea as HODs in destroyers or AORs, but this is by no means universal.  Some Lt(N)s never get a HOD tour.  Deferring a promotion to stay in a location doesn't work.  They will post you anyway.  On the bright side, sailors don't move very often.  You can pretty much guarantee that you will end up in Ottawa at some point.  Over half the Logistics Branch is located there.

4.  Is the naval side of log officer in any greater demand than green or blue?  Or is it really all the same in the beginning?

Last I checked, it was the Army that had the highest demand.  The intake of Naval Logistics Officers is the lowest.  The biggest problem we are going to face over the next few years will be the lack of training billets at sea as our Fleet goes in for major refit.

5.  How extensive are cross-postings?  Might I find myself as a QM at 2 RCR for example as a navy slt?

Cross postings between elements are pretty much non-existent.  Although the NCMs are not restricted by uniform (ie you will find leading seamen in service batallions), we don't do this with Log officers.  A Naval Log Officer will NEVER be the QM at 2RCR any more than you would find an Air Force Captain as the SYO in a ship.

Having said this, there are purple jobs throughout the entire CF.  Postings to CEFCOM, CANSOFCOM and the other dot coms are all possible.  Deployments to what one would largely consider army (although really they are "joint") jobs such as Afghanistan and elsewhere are also possible.

Hope this helps.
 
Pusser said:
Often times however, your family will be on one of the coasts and you will be in Borden on course for several weeks at a time (last time I checked, the Sea Log course was either 10 or 16 weeks).

16 weeks long. My next door neighbour/smoking buddy (who has been here since 5 Aug - who also happened to be my next door neighbour on our ILQ course), just deserted me last week upon his SLogO completion.  :'(

20 weeks down for me ... 29 to go!!
 
I'm a Certified Management Accountant and I earned my degree in business administration about 8 years ago. I'm looking into joining as a Logistics Officer. What is the minimum contract length that I can sign for? A page on the CF website says 9 years but doing a search on this website references 5 years. What exactly are my options?
 
First off: Are you joining the Regular Force or the Primary Reserves?

Second:  Have you made up you mind yet whether you want to be a Vehicle Mechanic, an Armour officer, or a Logistics officer?  You are bouncing all over the grid with your questions.

Perhaps you should pay the CFRC a visit and sort out what options you may have.
 
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