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One of our SLQ‘s is jokingly called a pharmacy.
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I‘d be a little concerned if I were ever out on the field in enemy territory and my comrad, a stoner, says to me "don‘t worry, I got your back".
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When I was oversea‘s in 2000 we where told that after the R22nds left some guys found a little party palace in a out of the way place with drug parafinilia (sp) and used condoms all over.
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I fully agree with you there, I definately did not mean to insinuate that those tested represented the whole battalion.
I realise that they would specifically choose the induviduals to test based on the information that they received. Thats why not every single member was tested.
However I think it would be naive to assume that they managed to tag everyone who uses drugs. There will undoubtedly be a few fish who escape the net. Hopefully those induviduals will seize this opportunity to smarten up.
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What is sad here is all the bad press that we are getting. Everyone in Canada will think we are all drug users. Who leaked this out to the press in the first place? And if there was a problem why wait till they are almost on the plane, shame on the MP's.
I am reading more about this in the paper than almost a months news on what is going on in Afghanistan or a year of news from the Balkans.
On a other point lets not paint everyone with the same paintbrush, how many members are in the R22R. 17 tested positive for drugs, what drugs, and how many in the end will be told that they are sorry but you tested positive but it was a mistake. I wonder how many officers where tested.
If there was a drug problem it was there before, shame on the person who thought of this plan to raid just before they went on tour and shame on them who leaked it to the press, the vultures of the news industry who take the words of the brass that our Iltis jeeps are fine vehicles for driving over land mines but the driver had better not ever smoked pot.
On a last point, I do not do drugs nor do I approve of it but lets get out priorities right.
I am reading more about this in the paper than almost a months news on what is going on in Afghanistan or a year of news from the Balkans.
On a other point lets not paint everyone with the same paintbrush, how many members are in the R22R. 17 tested positive for drugs, what drugs, and how many in the end will be told that they are sorry but you tested positive but it was a mistake. I wonder how many officers where tested.
If there was a drug problem it was there before, shame on the person who thought of this plan to raid just before they went on tour and shame on them who leaked it to the press, the vultures of the news industry who take the words of the brass that our Iltis jeeps are fine vehicles for driving over land mines but the driver had better not ever smoked pot.
On a last point, I do not do drugs nor do I approve of it but lets get out priorities right.
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Jungle: It came down in an O-group that I was sitting in on so I assume its fact.
D
dwild40
Guest
Generally Marijuana the most benign of the illicit substances remains in the the urine for up to 2 weeks after smoking however it remains in the blood and hair for up to 4 - 6 months. Does this mean that 3 weeks after smoking a joint one is still stoned? Of course not. It just means that the body takes a long time to metabolize these salts. A positive urine test for marijuana means that some one had smokes in the past 2 weeks. HOWEVER other much more harder and dangerous drugs like heroin, cocaine, ecstacy, speed, meth etc..., all metabolize out of the urine within 3 days. Thats right only 3 days.
My point you ask? Just playing devils advocate here. Now did one test positive for opiates or did they just have a poppy seed bagel at Starbucks yesterday. The human brain also produces its own cannabinoids under stress situations i.e. runner‘s high. Do these cannabinoids make it to the urine tract? I doubt it. There are also products in the marketplace that assist in passing urine tests. Which are essentially vitamin B blasts to the systems.
I agree that intoxicants legal or otherwise have no place in a military formation. As I have said in a previous post "if I could do it all again I‘d do it sober". But we have to realize that certain drugs have been apart of human culture for thousands of years and are not just going to go away. When entering into a contract for employment with the CF one should willing submit to regular urine samples to ensure this does not happen as a condition of that employment. When you violate the rules you are out DISHONOURABLE DISCHARGE. Do not Pass Go. Do not Collect Your Pension. BUH BYE
Thanks
My point you ask? Just playing devils advocate here. Now did one test positive for opiates or did they just have a poppy seed bagel at Starbucks yesterday. The human brain also produces its own cannabinoids under stress situations i.e. runner‘s high. Do these cannabinoids make it to the urine tract? I doubt it. There are also products in the marketplace that assist in passing urine tests. Which are essentially vitamin B blasts to the systems.
I agree that intoxicants legal or otherwise have no place in a military formation. As I have said in a previous post "if I could do it all again I‘d do it sober". But we have to realize that certain drugs have been apart of human culture for thousands of years and are not just going to go away. When entering into a contract for employment with the CF one should willing submit to regular urine samples to ensure this does not happen as a condition of that employment. When you violate the rules you are out DISHONOURABLE DISCHARGE. Do not Pass Go. Do not Collect Your Pension. BUH BYE
Thanks
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Im not to suprised because its something that the CF has to enforce more it happens but like i think unrin tests should be done every 6 months or so, i mean come on flip ur tillie over thats like practicly a weed pouch there :blotto: lol :mg:
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I think if they do that and 5F all the positive cases we are going to be even more seriously undermanned.
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One comment - a poppy seed bagel WILL NOT produce a positive test for opiates, or anything else. I administer the Drug Testing program at my workplace and had to sit through a couple of days of classes on this stuff. This included the test methods, and debunking the zillion or so urban legends concerning false positives.
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Full Article
19 soldiers test positive for drug use
Will no longer be off to Afghanistan
Military cites `security reasons‘
CFB VALCARTIER, Que.â â€Seventeen soldiers who tested positive for illicit drug use won‘t be bound for the war on terror in Afghanistan, the Canadian Forces said yesterday.
"The reason why we didn‘t want to deploy them is for security reasons," said Capt. Mario Couture, a military spokesman.
"We can‘t afford to have people under the influence of illicit substances while they‘re conducting patrols."
A Canadian soldier was recently killed in a suicide bomb attack.
A total of 19 soldiers in a unit headed to Afghanistan have tested positive. The other two were not scheduled to go to the strife-torn area, Couture said.
Twenty-nine soldiers were tested for drugs.
The tests followed searches of the base, near Quebec City, by military police and drug-detecting dogs earlier this week after they received a tip.
The military couldn‘t immediately say which drugs had been detected and were awaiting results on tests of drugs seized.
A small quantity of drugs was found during the search of several offices and lockers belonging to the 3rd Battalion of the Royal 22nd Regiment at Valcartier, said the National Investigation Service, the investigative arm of the military police.
The 3rd Battalion, which comprises 600 soldiers, will be shipping soldiers to Afghanistan until mid-month and some have already arrived. None of those is under suspicion, Couture said.
"Nobody that was targeted or nobody that was looked into had deployed so the problem was not transferred over to Afghanistan already."
Couture said the military takes a hard line when it comes to drug use.
"It‘s clear: it‘s zero tolerance. We don‘t mess with drugs and all the members know that. They know that when they join the forces and they‘re reminded during their career. There‘s no surprise there for them."
He said the military did not take the action just because the troops are being deployed to Afghanistan, known as one of the world‘s major drug producing regions. "It‘s a spot where drugs are available but we just can‘t afford to have people undermined by illicit substances. They pose a threat to themselves and one to their colleagues."
In Afghanistan, Maj. Jurden Rice, social worker for the Canadian contingent, said he has not had to deal with drug use.
"I‘ve had nobody brought to me suspected of using it (drugs), caught using it," he said. "There were no performance deficiencies that someone suspected was linked to drug use."
Canadian soldiers in Afghanistan are limited to two beers a day, he added.
The 19 could face reprimands or discharge from the forces, the military said in a statement.
"The chain of command is now taking appropriate preventative measures to ensure the safety of troops deployed in Afghanistan," said Lt.-Col. Bernard Ouellette, acting commander of 5 Canadian Mechanized Brigade Group.
Meanwhile, Prime Minister Paul Martin admitted yesterday in Ottawa that Canada‘s troops are "stretched very, very thin," but he offered to keep 500 troops in Afghanistan after Canada‘s current commitment to the country ends this summer.
Canadian troops now make up 40 per cent of the NATO-led security force patrolling Kabul.
Canadian Press, With files from Bruce Campion-Smith
--------------------------------------------------
19 Soldiers??? Me being a civilian, and also someone in the process of joining the forces, I can‘t say I find this a morale booster.
19 soldiers test positive for drug use
Will no longer be off to Afghanistan
Military cites `security reasons‘
CFB VALCARTIER, Que.â â€Seventeen soldiers who tested positive for illicit drug use won‘t be bound for the war on terror in Afghanistan, the Canadian Forces said yesterday.
"The reason why we didn‘t want to deploy them is for security reasons," said Capt. Mario Couture, a military spokesman.
"We can‘t afford to have people under the influence of illicit substances while they‘re conducting patrols."
A Canadian soldier was recently killed in a suicide bomb attack.
A total of 19 soldiers in a unit headed to Afghanistan have tested positive. The other two were not scheduled to go to the strife-torn area, Couture said.
Twenty-nine soldiers were tested for drugs.
The tests followed searches of the base, near Quebec City, by military police and drug-detecting dogs earlier this week after they received a tip.
The military couldn‘t immediately say which drugs had been detected and were awaiting results on tests of drugs seized.
A small quantity of drugs was found during the search of several offices and lockers belonging to the 3rd Battalion of the Royal 22nd Regiment at Valcartier, said the National Investigation Service, the investigative arm of the military police.
The 3rd Battalion, which comprises 600 soldiers, will be shipping soldiers to Afghanistan until mid-month and some have already arrived. None of those is under suspicion, Couture said.
"Nobody that was targeted or nobody that was looked into had deployed so the problem was not transferred over to Afghanistan already."
Couture said the military takes a hard line when it comes to drug use.
"It‘s clear: it‘s zero tolerance. We don‘t mess with drugs and all the members know that. They know that when they join the forces and they‘re reminded during their career. There‘s no surprise there for them."
He said the military did not take the action just because the troops are being deployed to Afghanistan, known as one of the world‘s major drug producing regions. "It‘s a spot where drugs are available but we just can‘t afford to have people undermined by illicit substances. They pose a threat to themselves and one to their colleagues."
In Afghanistan, Maj. Jurden Rice, social worker for the Canadian contingent, said he has not had to deal with drug use.
"I‘ve had nobody brought to me suspected of using it (drugs), caught using it," he said. "There were no performance deficiencies that someone suspected was linked to drug use."
Canadian soldiers in Afghanistan are limited to two beers a day, he added.
The 19 could face reprimands or discharge from the forces, the military said in a statement.
"The chain of command is now taking appropriate preventative measures to ensure the safety of troops deployed in Afghanistan," said Lt.-Col. Bernard Ouellette, acting commander of 5 Canadian Mechanized Brigade Group.
Meanwhile, Prime Minister Paul Martin admitted yesterday in Ottawa that Canada‘s troops are "stretched very, very thin," but he offered to keep 500 troops in Afghanistan after Canada‘s current commitment to the country ends this summer.
Canadian troops now make up 40 per cent of the NATO-led security force patrolling Kabul.
Canadian Press, With files from Bruce Campion-Smith
--------------------------------------------------
19 Soldiers??? Me being a civilian, and also someone in the process of joining the forces, I can‘t say I find this a morale booster.
D
Danny
Guest
Thats sickening.
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But I saw it on Seinfield!
A
armydrake01
Guest
Not to point fingers but let‘s remember this is the second time the VanDoos have embarrassed the forces in front of full media coverage. The first time put the final nail in the Airborne‘s coffin. Everyone does stupid things but do these guys try to have the entire country as an audience everytime they screw up. What will be the fallout this time? And how many years will it take this time around for Canadians to stop treating our soldiers like criminals? For those of you who were around, I‘m sure you remember the country pretending the boys coming back from Medak Pocket didn‘t even exist because of the fallout from the Airborne. They certainly didn‘t get the respect that they deserved and support that they needed. And the public was actually starting to get past the incident in Somalia when the VanDoos hazing tapes came out and decimated any respectability the Airborne had left. All of our troops got painted with the same paintbrush. Let‘s hope history is not about to repeat itself.
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The hazing tapes happened well before Somalia. The Commando that was over there when it happened was ENGLISH. Drug use is across the board regardless of unit or language and I‘d wager the PPCLI or RCR would fare no better.
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If we are just going to tar our own organization with falsehoods and rumors on this thread I‘ll shut it down. ****-slinging and finger-pointing does nothing but hurt the Army as a whole.
This is your first post and you‘ve filled out the bare bones on your profile. Who are you to be attacking one of our Infantry regiments with such a silly statement. I know Jungle doesn‘t need my help, but I‘m sure he‘ll be along quickly to chat with you quickly.
The Medak Pocket was in ‘93. The hazing video‘s had not been released yet. The public was focused on the incident in Somalia. It was a couple of Patricia‘s that tortured a kid to death in Somalia.
This is your first post and you‘ve filled out the bare bones on your profile. Who are you to be attacking one of our Infantry regiments with such a silly statement. I know Jungle doesn‘t need my help, but I‘m sure he‘ll be along quickly to chat with you quickly.
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Armydrake01, Before you post here you should know this, this is not a forum board were you can just throw out wild accusations that are‘nt based in some facts. " Not to point fingers"??? Maybe you should read the rest of your post again. This sounds more like an anti-french rant than anything.
Jungle
Army.ca Veteran
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I,d rather be short one man in my Platoon then be stuck with a pothead.
Actually, I am happy they are taking care of this, it just might show the public the CF are serious about drug use, and do not hesitate to take action.
It seems to me one of the troops didn‘t like the thought of going to Afghanistan with potheads around... can‘t blame him, he did the right thing.
Armydrake01, why don‘t you show up at the 3R22eR lines Monday and tell them your opinion ? They‘d be more than happy to set things straight with you...
We have enough enemies on the outside.
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Little is actually known how many service members use narcotics. The general public is never made aware of the real problem. This problem has been around for a great number of years. If the public had access to military records of illegal drug use in the forces they would find that at least 35% or more of the personell have used some sort of narcotic sometime in their career. The problem stems from a many number of reason‘s of which are to many to list them all. The biggest of which is stress. Our forces are cash strapped, stretched far and wide and to thin. Overseas deployments in the last 10 to 15 years most likely has contributed to most of the problem. Not having proper and updated equipment. Yes indeed there are other reasons like just to be able to get out of another deployment and this may likely be the case here. Who would really want to serve in a place like Afghanistan? Knowing that you are vulnerable to anything at anytime an adversary can do to inflict terror and casualties, as we are already getting use too. If the military hierarchy in this country is to control this problem it should be dealt with at the Unit level first off. Screening of soldiers should be done from the begining of enrollment and conducted every 6 months for monitoring. How much more would it really cost to drug screen a soldier? Why not make it like a trip to the dentist. These guys are really not at 100% fault here, it is the system to which they are bound to for there service as well. To a soldier that uses drugs frequently, reality becomes an illusion with time and frequent use of drugs. It becomes more evident when that soldier goes through periods of drug deficiency and lack of what they crave. That is when the problems start to arise. If you cant look after the welfare of the troops, and it shows, they will sooner or later develop a mind set that is like "who really gives a ****".....by going the way of escaping from reality whether it is with alcohol or drugs. Frequently testing for drugs would set a precedence on the part of the system, in being that they will test and insure a clean narcotic (substance) free individual soldier. To enforce the laws on the Military level with individuals that choose to use them is the way to punish them, but let‘s not forget why they started to use them, and what can be done to get them clean again. It would be a terrible waste of resources if we just write the problem off with a court martial jail time & a fine. ReHab is something that is never or very rarely offered in cases with the military. Usuallly it is disciplinary action a fine and if it becomes a re-occurring problem their dealt off as an administrative burden and released F5 from the military. Just wash yourself of the problem is basically the remedy for upper eche at that point. The soldier now has an even bigger problem. If the problem arises from within the military, it should deal with it and offer those that are suffering a problem a way out other than just jail time and a fine and ultimately the boot!!. We spend big dollars in training on an individual basis, one infantryman from recruit level to be trained to a level 4 or 5 can cost as much as $250000 to fully train and equip. With an investment of this much in training one soldier, one would think that NDHQ would extend its soldiers the help they need to overcome an addiction problem. JMHO.
X-TowGunner 3RCR PRO PATRIA :gunner:
X-TowGunner 3RCR PRO PATRIA :gunner:
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