drinking and the infantry

[bled12345]

I know that at first this sounds like a crazy post, but it has some real merit behind it... For the past year, I have heard nothing but people telling me I will drink all of my money away, and that all soldiers do is drink, pick fights, and try to pick up chicks. Obviously this is not the case, but it is a serious issue for me, obviously if everyone is going to the bar for a few pints, I'll want to go too... Anyways. I really want to save up some money, and my goal is to not spend any money on anything that I don't need (alcohol)

so right, back on topic. How bad is drinking in the infantry actually? Any info from someone whose been there and seen it first hand, obviously some are going to be better than others, but is it really as bad as everyone makes it out to be? (people drinking away their paychecks and all that)

any info from a serving, or past serving member would be greatly appreciated. If this belongs in a different forum, feel free to move it, but I am going PPCLI infantry, and was looking for a trade specific answer. Thanks in advance =)

 

[Island Ryhno]

Drinking in the Infantry (and the forces as a whole) used to a freaking past time. I think anytime you throw young guys (as is typical of the infantry) together and then lock them down for weeks on end....well. What you get when these guys are loosed is TESTOSTERONE in all it's glory. The key with this is to not be pressured into drinking when you don't want to, what's that peer pressure is hard! It's no harder than your BIQ is going to be. You're going to be an infantry soldier, stand your ground, your tough enough not to drink. It will be difficult for you not to go drinking, however you could go to the bar and sip coke. You'd still be "out with the boys" just not pissing your money away like them. Maturity will serve you well in all your endeavours!

 

[Blackhorse7]

I hate to say it, but it was a problem not just limited to the infantry.  I say was, because I think the CF has taken some very positive steps to move away from the days of old, where it was virtually encouraged to drink.  At one point eary in my CF days, me and the boys were hitting the bars 5 to 6 times a week.  That being said, I think it has more to do with the age of all of us at the time, and , agreeing with the last post, a whole lot of testosterone.  Back then it was about partying and picking up girls, but you can't tell me that university males weren't doing the same thing....

 

[2 Cdo]

Hindsight being 20/20, I wish that I didn't piss away my money drinking as a young trooper. That being said, I find on average todays troops are not as hard charging, binge drinkers like we used to be! Now it seems to be about keeping in shape, or trying to keep up the payments on a brand new 3/4 ton 4x4, leaving little money to go drinking. Drinking with the troops is a time honoured way to pass the time but remember come 0600 or thereabouts you still have to go out for a little PT ;D.

Most troops today limit their partying to the weekends and don't quite "give ER" like the old days. Keep in mind it is your life, your money, and your career on the line so watch yourself. Sometimes it is actually more entertaining to be the sober one in the crowd and to watch all the stupid crap that young troops end up doing! ;D

 

[Britney Spears]

Anyways. I really want to save up some money, and my goal is to not spend any money on anything that I don't need (alcohol)

I'm not against binge drinking per se, it's one of those things you should do young rather than old, but ultimately YOU make the decision, YOU do the pack drill.  If you don't have enough discipline and self control to pick your timings and drink responsibly, you shouldn't be trusted with a pair of scissors, much less a weapon.

 

[Horse_Soldier]

There was a time when the Army was hard-drinking and hard-partying.  When I was a plt ldr in Lahr in the 80s, I can't remember the number of times one of my troops got into shit (and the MP shack) for getting pissed at the Centennial Club or in town on a Friday or Sat night.

Nowadays, things aren't quite like that any more.  Granted, what I see these days are Reserve troops, so I'm a bit out of touch with the troops in my former Regt, but the youngsters these days are smarter than we were and don't drink anywhere near as much any more, and the older guys like us have learned that the amount of grey matter we could burn away with booze and still function above the basic simian level is limited.

I'll echo what 2Cdo said, being the sober one in the group is actually a lot of fun.  I've watched buddies make total asses of themselves often enough to make an evening on a single beer worthwhile.  In the end, what you do is up to you.  There will be the odd troop that will give you a hard time for not drinking hard, but that breed is in a small minority so don't sweat the thought of peer pressure.

 

[c4th]

Don't sweat not drinking, or drinking little.  I know plenty of soldiers who drink nothing or almost nothing.  Personally, the only person I've really noticed at being shocked at this is the MO when I do my medicals.

Here's a shocker, I even know a Drum Major who doesn't drink at all.  Until I met him I thought getting blind drunk was an 871 PO.

If your buddies are big drinkers and you are feeling pressure, buy a big car.  Everyone likes the driver.

 

[paracowboy]

For the past year, I have heard nothing but people telling me I will drink all of my money away, and that all soldiers do is drink, pick fights, and try to pick up chicks.

y'know, when you paint with too big a brush, you miss a lot of details. I don't drink anymore. I did when I was young. Because I was young.

if everyone is going to the bar for a few pints, I'll want to go too...

so go. Just don't be stupid.

Anyways. I really want to save up some money,

so do it.

and my goal is to not spend any money on anything that I don't need (alcohol)

then don't.

How bad is drinking in the infantry actually?

what's the difference? You don't want to drink, don't drink.

 

[bled12345]

lol i'm impressed with some of the great feedback I have gotten here...

"If your buddies are big drinkers and you are feeling pressure, buy a big car.  Everyone likes the driver."  lol thats ****ing hilarious!!!

and yeah para cowboy, thats what I plan to do, hence this post and me saying stuff like "I don't want to waste money on alcohol"  I just wanted to get a feel for what it would be like, whether it would be like a 4 times a week thing, or just once a weekend. Obviously there are going to be times when I just get right pissed. I just wanted to know how often everyone else gets wasted. And hey, you can still get drunk and save money! thats why man invented 5 star whiskey and TNT lol.

 

[winchable]

you shu'ttup...no NO...youuuuuuu shuttup...I bet..that I c'n fire a'rifle at my foot...and not shoot myself in'the'head..

........yer on, jus'olong as you pay up..b'fore you do'it n'case you lose.



I thought peer pressure and people going "Come on, you're not cool if you don't drink" went the way of teenage mutant ninja turtles and afterschool specials about figureskaters drinking out of mason jars? Was I wrong?
If you don't want to drink, don't drink, if you're really worried that people will pressure you just say it's a religious thing and watch the sensitivity training kick in.

 

[Erborn]

I drank my share while in the service
One yr at Christmas I came home from the Mess Pissed to the eyeballs
Lived on the 3rd floor of a apt in Germany
When I got home the better half got me just a bit mad
So I threw the Christmas tree over the balcony
and most of the presents
I am not proud of what I did
When I woke up Christmas day I two small children wondering what
happened to the tree.and the gifts from Santa
You should have seen the look on their faces
It was at that point that I quit
From that day on whenever I was asked if I would like a drink
I would answer No I am a recovering drunk
After awhile most of the guys just stopped asking
In fact some even began to buy me a coke
The moral of the story is
If you are going to drink, drink responsible

 

[GO!!!]

While all of you have brought up excellent points on why NOT to drink, I feel compelled to play devils advocate and point out that there is a particular esprit de corps and bonding that takes place on those fateful nites that end up broke, hungover, and incarcerated.

While you may never know if you dont try, I had alot of great times loaded, and the friends who were there with me are still there today (although the tempo has slowed, and we are as likely to discuss the merits of a variable rate mortgage as the possibility of tagging the shooter girl(s)

I guess the morale of the story is to have some fun and get loaded w/ your friends, maybe just not 6x a week. Booze is not the demon we make it out to be - irresponsibility is.

Besides, how are you going to tell YOUR young troops to relax before the hatless dance (charge pde) if you've never had one yourself?

Basic and Battle school are a place to learn skills and teamwork, and also have fun on the side. Dont turn it into some money hoarding exercise - you have the rest of your life for that.

Cheers!!

 

[Blackhorse7]

GO!!! brings up a certain point that, unfortunately is true.  My best bonding moments with my fellow mates came at times of partying.  Those people are still friends of mine to this day (I would describe them as my closest friends), despite the fact that our lives have all gone different directions. 

Just yesterday, a friend of mine were discussing his new recruit.  He said outright that he won't fit in because he doesn't drink with the boys.  There is an inner circle that seem to work better together because they drink together.  Right or wrong, thats just the way it is.  I think that it may be because in some of those moments of intoxication, you get rare glimpses into what people normally bottle up, and they share it.  True esprit de corps comes out when the conversation turns serious, and a guy says to you "We may have had fights in the past, but man, if you went down, I would be two steps behind to pick you up.  I'd die for you."

Of course that is promptly followed up with the drunken "I love you man!  But not that way!  Oh, hell!!  You know what I mean..." and variations thereof....

 

[ZipperHead]

I'm kind of surprised how much sober (pun more or less intended  ;D) thought has come of this topic. I have often thought how different my life and/or career would be if I would have either not drank, or more specifically, drank more responsibly. I would certainly be better off financially (nothing kills a bank account like a hot shooter girl......) and physically (my knees, elbows, memory, liver). But, then again, some things can't be quantified, like the cameraderie and friends that you make in low places. Not too many army stories begin with "remember when we were drinking pop and playing chess.....". Almost every funny story has some alcohol involvement.

I know more than a few guys who have never drank (allergic, moral or religious reasons) and to be honest, I'm not particularly "tight" with them, but then again I'm not too tight with guys who have had to go to "spin dry" (alcohol rehab) or are still chronics. Most of my buddies let off their steam in their youth, and then grew up. I have limited my anti-social drinking to about once every 3 months, if not 6 months.

I don't think anybody should be black-or-white about something like this: if you want to go out with your buddies, and let your (limited) hair down, fill yer boots. But don't feel pressured into doing things that aren't "you". Because "you" are the one who will have some 'splaining to do to your Sergeant Major when you are in cells (prison)..... One thing that has changed in society (and hence the military) over the last 20 odd years is not being able to use "but I was loaded" as an excuse to get out of shite. Some of the dinosaur style Sr NCO's might let it slide, but the new "enlightened" crop will (rightfully) hammer you, as it is unacceptable. I tend to let "boys be boys" as I did my fair share of stupid things whilst intoxicated, but there is a limit to that generosity. As stated before, there is a saying that goes along with drinking: If you want to hoot with the owls in the evening, you better be able to soar with the eagles in the morning. If you do the crime, do the time, and shut yer hole.

One of the "problems" I have seen come up in the military is the inability to let soldiers have a few beer in the field or while on deployment. I'm talking more than the authorized 2 per day (if that). A few gluebags ruined it for the majority, and the knee-jerk reaction was to treat everyone like children. So when they do let people go over the 2 beer limit, it is usually mayhem, as people act like morons, as they don't know how to act normally (mind you, I have been known to be quite an idjit while drinking, so I'm not one to talk....). The individual, not the group, should be punished for an indiscretion. Otherwise, people have no concept of the idea of personal responsibility.......

Anyway, the moral of the story: do what you think is right. Regret can be painful, in any form. When you're 40 you can't say: I wish I went out with the boys more often. But you also don't want to say: I wish I hadn't pissed all my money up against a wall, and I have nothing but a beergut to show for it.....


Moderation, moderation, moderation......

Al

 

[Island Ryhno]

You know I have a feeling this is going to turn into a beer story from the day kinda deal. Waaaay back in 95, when we were in Aldershot we went out to the university bar in the middle of the week. Aside from the fact that a tuesday night was not an allowed time to be out let alone drunk as skunks we had some T Flashes and Arty sims with us in the bar. Well we got completely trashed up and then the bouncers wanted us gone, so I turn to one of the guys and say "yeah man we'll be gone in a flash" and the boys nearly shite themselves as I chucked a T Flash into the corner. I'm sure you can relate the rest. The next day we did the "puke and shoot" and did it literally!  ;D On a different note, when Murphy died and the boys from 1 RCR came home to help us bury him, we went to the bar, basically locked the door and drank ourselves to shit. Nobody says the things that need to be said in those situations without a little help from the bottle, it was a sad/happy night for us!

 

[paracowboy]

well, in my case, I quit drinking out of a sense of civic responsibility. I don't drink to protect civilization as we know it.
Me + likker = fire + gasoline

 

[Kat Stevens]

Getting falling down, knee walking stupid is one thing.  As a young Sapper, we would all meet up at least once a week to sip a few pints, and solve all the army's problems.  It was BONDING, not BINGING.  At the end of my illusterless carreer, it was tough to get three guys out of thirty to go for an ale after work. 

Kat

 

[GO!!!]

GO!!! brings up a certain point that, unfortunately is true.   My best bonding moments with my fellow mates came at times of partying.   Those people are still friends of mine to this day (I would describe them as my closest friends), despite the fact that our lives have all gone different directions.   

I don't think there is anything unfortunate about it. We are in the profession of arms, and quite regularly risk our hides in vehicles, under canopies and on two wheeled dealers of death. The ability to truly "know" those around you with a bit of booze and a couple of funny incidents (and charge pdes) only helps to solidify this sense of camraderie.

On that note, a few times, in several bars there were punch - ups. Since we so rarely are physically confronted in this day and age, it was truly enlightening to see that some of our "brothers" were too afraid of a bloody nose to help a buddy getting sh*tkicked by some riggers at Wuzzy's.  Still my peer - just not the one I would want as a Fire Team Partner.

This can also be encompassed to the guy who is broke and needs a ride from Leduc to Edmonton Garrisson - and calls you at 0330 so that you - yer wife and 8mnth old go and pick his drunk ass up and drive his truck home for him - cuz you know he'd do it for you - or already did.

There's an old Japanese proverb that says something to the effect that you never know a man until you have been drunk with him - I totally agree with it.

In addition to this, the lack of esprit de corps that we as an army suffer today is a direct symptom of no - one socialising with their peers. This is most easily done by young men with lots of booze and a paycheque in my opinion.

Cheers

 

[Infanteer]

This is why I believe in Platoon R&R's on tour (if there is R&R) as opposed to individual leave.

 

[1feral1]

I can remember back in about 1977, after an entire summer in Dundurn, I came home with $40.00 in my pocket, and my parents were not impressed.

Back in the days of no PC, and no one cared about UA members in the wet mess, Bldg 69, an old wooden structure which was wartime and is now long gone, nothing left but a field now.

What did I spend it on? From memory as fol:

Pubs (The King George Hotel Saskatoon,The Blind Pig, at the Holiday Inn Saskatoon) Dundurn Bar, Hanley bar, Aylesbury and Chamberlain pubs. From the mess and bought in bulk/offsale. Beer (Old Vienna around $8.00/24), rum (Lambs Navy - dark), whisky (5 Star and CC), cheap wine (Blue Nun, Spumante Bianco), women (my own age or a yr or two older -wow, but did I get anywhere??? at least I was try'n), gasoline (then in gallons), 8 tracks tapes (BTO, April Wine, Deep Purple), pizzas (bacon double cheese - still my favourite), McDonalds (and other food outlets etc), and I even bought a rifle (.22 cal). After all, I was only 17, and I was living it up as best I could   ;D. BTW I did not smoke and still don't, but I do still love my CC and the only Cdn beer I can buy on the island is Kokanee 

There was a lesson learned, and after that I did manage to save and spend wisley.

Mind you, those were the days. The daily rate of pay was about $18.00/day (before tax).

Up The Johns!

Wes