Concealed carry on Post/Base

[mariomike]

Contrary to popular belief, no police force has supported the LGR (I know that the LGR is not the topic, but its relevant).

The Boards, Associations, and Chiefs are the police forces ( services ).
"Joint Statement on Firearms from the Canadian Association of Police Boards (CAPB), the Canadian Police Association (CPA), and the Canadian Association of Chiefs of Police (CACP): Representing the police boards, police officers and police leaders from across Canada":
http://www.cacp.ca/media/library/download/883/CAPB_CPA_CACP__joint_statement_on_firearms_final.pdf

 

[Container]

They don't speak for me.....but we were told that we aren't allowed to comment.

I think that speaks for itself. Of course this shouldn't be taken as an endorsement either way.

However, police officers are not to rely on the results of checks but to be vigilant either way.....so.....

 

[mariomike]

However, police officers are not to rely on the results of checks but to be vigilant either way.....so.....

Same as paramedics - at least in Metro.
They are not permitted to "delay service" ie: not immediately enter a scene and make patient contact unless:
1) There is use of weapons at scene.
2) There is continuing violence at scene.

This must be based on specific ( they put it in red bold underlined capital letters ) information.
Other than case 1 or 2, with or without police, they have to go inside without delay.

Even if they had access to a gun registry - which EMS never did - it would not make any difference to how they respond to calls.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

What he said. What she ( Moe ) said.

Like I said, now that I am retired and no longer respond to "unknown problem" calls inside people's homes, I no longer worry about what weapons they keep inside them. I could care less about that now.

We here on the internet all have our opinions. We can "educate" and entertain each other - even add and deduct points.
But, when it comes to advice on personal safety issues, I give the last word to our police and emergency services professionals.

Yup.

'To serve and invesigate.'

'Call 911. When seconds count, the police are only minutes away.'

None of this is meant to slag LEOs (other emergency services don't enter into the equation), but until every person is issued a personal constable as a body guard, they can't help you in most situations.

The normal advice, to curl up in a fetal position and give them what they want, is not the way I will live my life.

Feel free to live your life like a sheep, if that is how you want to do it. I refuse to allow low lifes the chance to decide how I live mine.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

The Boards, Associations, and Chiefs are the police forces ( services ).
"Joint Statement on Firearms from the Canadian Association of Police Boards (CAPB), the Canadian Police Association (CPA), and the Canadian Association of Chiefs of Police (CACP): Representing the police boards, police officers and police leaders from across Canada":
http://www.cacp.ca/media/library/download/883/CAPB_CPA_CACP__joint_statement_on_firearms_final.pdf

You better look into exactly who the CACP really is before you start using their propoganda as backup for your arguements. They are a lobby group of Chiefs that don't represent the rank and file. They are led by the biggest anti of all, your own Bill Blair, that uses the organization as a personal pulpit.

From an article in McLeans: '“led by organizations of police chiefs”—i.e., political advocacy groups that claim to represent police chiefs, and that have a strong interest in the naïve citizen (or the naïve reporter) confusing them with the police qua police.'

Also: John Jones, an ethics advisor to the Canadian Association of Chiefs of Police, quit because of the association’s incorrigible addiction to questionable corporate donations.

As Christie Blatchford wrote in the Globe at the time:

"Dr. Jones and the members of the ethics committee were in Montreal in August for two days of meetings around the CACP’s annual conference when they learned about Taser’s sponsorship and that of others, including a joint Bell Mobility-CGI Group-Techna donation of $115,000, which went toward the purchase of 1,000 tickets at $215 each to a Celine Dion concert on Aug. 25."

They also receive donations from CGI Group Inc, a major, long-term firearms-registry contractor. Wonder what happens to those?


If you're going to bring your horse to the race, make sure it's not a gluebag.

 

[Infanteer]

But, when it comes to advice on personal safety issues, I give the last word to our police and emergency services professionals.

When it comes to advice on our rights as citizens, I will rely on the best rational argument rather than an appeal to authority.

The normal advice, to curl up in a fetal position and give them what they want, is not the way I will live my life.

Feel free to live your life like a sheep, if that is how you want to do it. I refuse to allow low lifes the chance to decide how I live mine.

Yup.

 

[mariomike]

You better look into exactly who the CACP really is before you start using their propoganda as backup for your arguements. They are a lobby group of Chiefs that don't represent the rank and file. 

The chiefs do not represent the rank and file. The boards do not represent the rank and file. But, the Canadian Police Association ( CPA ) does.
They signed the same "propaganda" that the boards and chiefs did.

"The Canadian Police Association (CPA) is the national voice for 41,000 police personnel across Canada. Membership includes police personnel serving in 160 police services across Canada, from Canada's smallest towns and villages as well as those working in our largest municipal and provincial police services, and members of the RCMP, railway police, and first nations’ police personnel.":
http://www.cpa-acp.ca/about/index_e.asp

 

[Container]

"During Parliamentary hearings into the long-gun registry, the President of the Canadian Police Association, Charles Momy, admitted that less than 1 per cent of his association’s membership responded to a survey on the long-gun registry. (House of Commons Public Safety Committee, May 13, 2010)"

And its stats like that make we wary of any statements by any "associations". Legal or otherwise.

 

[mariomike]

And its stats like that make we wary of any statements by any "associations". Legal or otherwise.

Like I said, the Registry never did me any good.

 

[Journeyman]

But, when it comes to advice on personal safety issues, I give the last word to our police and emergency services professionals.

I'm sorry, I usually make an active effort at ignoring your posting internet links in each and every thread....but are you suggesting that being an ambulance driver makes someone an expert to be listened to on concealed weapons issues??  WTF?!

 

[Fishbone Jones]

The chiefs do not represent the rank and file. The boards do not represent the rank and file. But, the Canadian Police Association ( CPA ) does.
They signed the same "propaganda" that the boards and chiefs did.

"The Canadian Police Association (CPA) is the national voice for 41,000 police personnel across Canada. Membership includes police personnel serving in 160 police services across Canada, from Canada's smallest towns and villages as well as those working in our largest municipal and provincial police services, and members of the RCMP, railway police, and first nations’ police personnel.":
http://www.cpa-acp.ca/about/index_e.asp

Make a point will you. Try a personal perspective without all the links. Really, can you make a post without one? Google Fu is not the end all to be all. If every opinion you have comes from your surfing capabilities it really isn't yours, is it.

My Charter Rights won't be infringed by your ability to post links.

BTW, if you'd done any amount of surfing, to find a broader opinion than your own, you'd find the rank and file was under a gag order, promoted by their associations. The rank and file, that don't agree with you are in the thousands, as proven by the survey they participated in and that some were disciplined for. Use your magic and look it up.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

So let me get this straight, I am supposed to limit my options to protect myself and my family by legal means because of a fear that you have that I or some other licensed and permitted person might do something wrong, despite documented evidence that over an 18 year period of record keeping only around 1% of people similarly permitted are indited on firearm offenses. Talk about allowing rather paranoid imagination to run legislation.

The law to carry exists here, make the requirements and training clear, reasonable for a licenced firearm owner to obtain and make the responsibilities under law clear. Going by the US example between 4-55 of the population at most will seek permits, mostly likely less.

 

[cupper]

When it comes to advice on our rights as citizens, I will rely on the best rational argument rather than an appeal to authority.

I will defer to the Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

So let me get this straight, I am supposed to limit my options to protect myself and my family by legal means because of a fear that you have that I or some other licensed and permitted person might do something wrong, despite documented evidence that over an 18 year period of record keeping only around 1% of people similarly permitted are indited on firearm offenses. Talk about allowing rather paranoid imagination to run legislation.

The law to carry exists here, make the requirements and training clear, reasonable for a licenced firearm owner to obtain and make the responsibilities under law clear. Going by the US example between 4-5% of the population at most will seek permits, mostly likely less.

 

[cupper]

I'm currently living in a permissive open carry state (no special permit required to carry in plain site, you own one, you can carry it anywhere with very few restrictions) and I do not feel any safer than I do in other states I travel to where they are restricted from open carry.

And I would prefer to see someone carrying than not knowing if they are or not.

 

[Container]

I'm currently living in a permissive open carry state (no special permit required to carry in plain site, you own one, you can carry it anywhere with very few restrictions) and I do not feel any safer than I do in other states I travel to where they are restricted from open carry.

And I would prefer to see someone carrying than not knowing if they are or not.

I find that interesting- you've been in the military for this long and you see firearms as more than tool with a specific use? This isn't a jab. I'm just always surprised. I can do more damage with my Dodge Ram than I can with a Glock 19. I just dont look as good doing it.

Eh. To each his own I suppose- Im not uncomfortable with firearms being around at all. If a stringent check and course was in place it would be no different to me than carrying a leatherman. And its not like everyone would carry.

 

[cupper]

I find that interesting- you've been in the military for this long and you see firearms as more than tool with a specific use?

Not sure what you mean by that.

I can do more damage with my Dodge Ram than I can with a Glock 19. I just dont look as good doing it.

That's part of the point I was making, it doesn't take someone carrying a firearm to do major bodily harm. For me, it makes no difference either way, I don't feel any safer, I don't feel any less safe. (And now I have earthquakes to deal with ;D )

And believe me, they have a hard enough time driving here in good conditions. Throw in even a little bad weather and anarchy erupts. :rofl:

Eh. To each his own I suppose- Im not uncomfortable with firearms being around at all. If a stringent check and course was in place it would be no different to me than carrying a leatherman. And its not like everyone would carry.

I fully agree. Just that I think I would prefer open carry with limitations to concealed carry if Canada were ever to expand the range of those permitted to do so. There will also still be a need for concealed carry, but that's mainly where we are now anyway.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Once again people are confusing their comfort levels with my right to defend myself.

I don't care if people are uncomfortable with the idea of me carrying a firearm. The matter is, do I feel comfortable enough carrying it and using it, competently, if I have to?

Your comfort level does not usurp my right to self defence.

 

[LineJumper]

Dunno, the only things that should stay concealed on base (or anywhere for that matter) is some horribad tattoo and the one eyed trouser trout.

 

[Greymatters]

Your comfort level does not usurp my right to self defence.

I think the issue here isnt your comfort level but competence level.  You may have experience and wisdom with your weapon, but you know as well as I do that there are many out there who would be comfortable carrying, but would overestimate their own competence in weapons handling.