6 Jan 2020 U.S. Events (Split from A Deeply Fractured US)

[Brad Sallows]

"Inciting an insurrection" is a strong claim.

Did Trump Commit a Crime When He Riled Up His Supporters Before They Rioted? by Jacob Sullum at Reason.com.

 

[Altair]

If talk about how Trump influenced the events of 6 Jan 2020 is on topic, talk about how prior events influenced Trump and his supporters is on topic. It is meaningless to pretend to talk about how people are moved to act without considering all things they might find provocative.

The marked difference here is that despite everything that happened as far back as 2016, without Trump banging the fraud vote, stolen election, stop the steal, never stop fighting narrative for the last 6-7 weeks, the storming of the capital would not have happened.

I, for one, am happy the mods have let this discussion go on, because every other political discussion was shut down in no time and locked, but if we start going off into the weeds this will no doubt be locked as well.

 

[Brad Sallows]

I had no idea it was so easy to pinpoint the exact grain of rice that tips the scales.

 

[Weinie]

Both of us?

And that is the attitude that infers that a manufacturer that makes guns is responsible for the actions of the end user. I call bullshit.

 

[OceanBonfire]

The marked difference here is that despite everything that happened as far back as 2016, without Trump banging the fraud vote, stolen election, stop the steal, never stop fighting narrative for the last 6-7 weeks, the storming of the capital would not have happened.

I, for one, am happy the mods have let this discussion go on, because every other political discussion was shut down in no time and locked, but if we start going off into the weeds this will no doubt be locked as well.

Seriously. This is veering close into the conspiracy theory field that the right-wing/alt-right/far-right are known for to find anything. This is all on Trump himself and his own doing considering how he was already unhinged far before he considered running.

 

[Altair]

I had no idea it was so easy to pinpoint the exact grain of rice that tips the scales.

In this case it was rather easy.

The president tweeted “Statistically impossible to have lost the 2020 Election, Big protest in DC on January 6th. Be there, will be wild!”

 

[The Bread Guy]

... Support the actions of the 2% on the left and be described as a radical socialist, don't support them and be termed a racist and fascist.

Support the actions of the 2% on the right and be described as white-supremacist and racist, don't support them and be described as un-patriotic and a radical socialist.

Support the 96% in the middle, and be described as not engaged or uncaring to the plight of others ...

No room in the middle anymore - zackly! #NoShadesOfGrey

 

[The Bread Guy]

Encouraging the beheading of the POTUS and calling it "art" is just a sample of the stuff the progressives put out. The hate they have for him is quite unreal. I can get why people don't like him or think he is a poor choice for POTUS, but this is the same level of hate that you see with groups that kill ...

Sadly, art and memes are rife with people calling for the death of politicians on all sides (even those saying, "it's just a joke") don't make either side look good.

 

[Weinie]

Seriously. This is veering close into the conspiracy theory field that the right-wing/alt-right/far-right are known for to find anything. This is all on Trump himself and his own doing considering how he was already unhinged far before he considered running.

And your source for that is who? Maybe below? She obviously had no agenda.

Mary Trump: Tell-all book depicts president as inept, habitual liar (usatoday.com)

 

[OceanBonfire]

And your source for that is who? Maybe below? She obviously had no agenda.

Mary Trump: Tell-all book depicts president as inept, habitual liar (usatoday.com)

I was actually thinking his earlier tweets and multiple other references, but, sure. /s (semi)

 

[Altair]

And your source for that is who? Maybe below? She obviously had no agenda.

Mary Trump: Tell-all book depicts president as inept, habitual liar (usatoday.com)

The moment, the exact moment I knew without a shadow of a doubt was when he accused Ted Cruz's father of helping to kill JFK.

 

[Weinie]

I was actually thinking his earlier tweets and multiple other references, but, sure. /s (semi)

Well then cite your sources. Who claimed Donald Trump was unhinged far before he considered running?

 

[Altair]

Democrats have been recorded time and again making veiled threats of "it's our turn now" and "we're coming for you". It's the same mentality that got Captain Cheeto elected in the first place. Kicked dogs will eventually bite.

So Democrats said something, and those kicked dogs stormed the capital during a joint session of congress?

 

[brihard]

Gee. I hope we still believe in individual freedom to think. Policing action is one thing, expression another...but thought?

Who's policing thought here?

Let's not mistake the actions of government and its agents, with the actions of public sector business that provide communications platforms and infrastructure. There's no 'free speech' claim with any legal grounding to be made against Twitter, Amazon, etc. Those business are free to make decisions about what will be allowed on their platforms. On the infrastructure back end, companies providing web hosting may determine that sites or services utilizing their infrastructure are potentially harmful to their business, or exposing them to legal jeopardy.

Nobody is entitled to a platform provided by someone else.

 

[Kat Stevens]

So Democrats said something, and those kicked dogs stormed the capital during a joint session of congress?

I don't know if you really don't understand what I'm saying, or being deliberately obtuse. Either way, I give. You are, as always, the smartest kid in the room.

 

[Altair]

I don't know if you really don't understand what I'm saying, or being deliberately obtuse. Either way, I give. You are, as always, the smartest kid in the room.

I don't understand what you are saying.

Which is why I put the question mark.

My focus is on the events of January 6th, where a mob stormed the capital building during a joint session of congress, 5 people died, and the USA looked like a banana republic.

As far as I know, there have only been two attempts to get to Washington and storm the capital as a response to election results and the last one had a certain General Lee leading the charge.

As such, this being so far from the norm, I think its worthy of discussion, yet you are talking about things that the Democrats said. And kicked dogs biting. Seeing as this is a discussion about the events of January the 6th, 2021, I'm trying rather desperately, and failing, to understand the connection between the two.

 

[OceanBonfire]

Well then cite your sources. Who claimed Donald Trump was unhinged far before he considered running?

Considering it's now even harder to find his tweets before he considered running:

Read Donald Trump's Meanest Tweets ... Before He Ran for President

Donald Trump started tweeting in 2009 ... and hasn't stopped since

www.thewrap.com

As well as the easily found and known attitudes he had while on The Apprentice, anyone will just say everyone had an agenda and that the 2005 tape was a one time attitude?

Donald Trump Tape Sets Off Reporting Frenzy About GOP Ticket, Billy Bush Fate, ‘Apprentice’ History

The mushrooming Donald Trump scandal has also impacted media figures that were connected to Trump before his presidential campaign.

variety.com

Donald Trump officially fired from "The Celebrity Apprentice"

NBC's entertainment chairman said Thursday the show will return with a new host next season

www.cbsnews.com

 

[Colin Parkinson]

The missing equation is that 70 million Americans voted for him, of that group a sizable chunk feel they have been disfranchised by voting irregularities and possible fraud. It's immaterial whether you agree or not, but the US has to address that grievance if they want peace within the country. Biden is going to have to choose revenge or stability, I not sure if the Democrats are capable of making the correct choice as schisms within their own party may force down a path that will potentiel create the conditions for a partial civil war.

 

[Weinie]

Considering it's now even harder to find his tweets before he considered running:

Read Donald Trump's Meanest Tweets ... Before He Ran for President

Donald Trump started tweeting in 2009 ... and hasn't stopped since

www.thewrap.com

As well as the easily found and known attitudes he had while on The Apprentice, anyone will just say everyone had an agenda and that the 2005 tape was a one time attitude?

Donald Trump Tape Sets Off Reporting Frenzy About GOP Ticket, Billy Bush Fate, ‘Apprentice’ History

The mushrooming Donald Trump scandal has also impacted media figures that were connected to Trump before his presidential campaign.

variety.com

Donald Trump officially fired from "The Celebrity Apprentice"

NBC's entertainment chairman said Thursday the show will return with a new host next season

www.cbsnews.com

Considering your description of unhinged is defined as mentally unbalanced; deranged, lets look at this.

Misogynist.....yup. Or maybe the women "just experienced it differently." Wouldn't be the first world leader to offer that defence.

Anti-immigrant ....undoubtedly. He joins an august group.

COMMENTARY: François Legault’s immigration policies are a ‘gift’ to the Bloc Québécois - National | Globalnews.ca

So don't go outside where you live. Many of the the residents, or people born there, are by your definition........unhinged.

 

[Altair]

The missing equation is that 70 million Americans voted for him, of that group a sizable chunk feel they have been disfranchised by voting irregularities and possible fraud. It's immaterial whether you agree or not, but the US has to address that grievance if they want peace within the country. Biden is going to have to choose revenge or stability, I not sure if the Democrats are capable of making the correct choice as schisms within their own party may force down a path that will potentiel create the conditions for a partial civil war.

That depends on how the MAGA group deals with the post Trump era.

Its clear that many in the republican party don't want much to do with the MAGA group after the storming of the capital. The Republicans governors didn't cave to the power of the president when it came to the election results, neither did the legislatures.

So the republican party is not the best vehicle for the MAGA group going forward in terms of any armed insurrection. They would need to organize into their own party, win at the state level for anything to come of this, because without state backing, they would be crushed by security forces of the USA. They would be like the black panthers or the klan, armed group that does damage here and there, assassinations and the like, but not a civil war by any stretch.