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I wonder why that is? Easier to transport dairy and its products?
US Presidential Election 2024 - Trump vs Harris - Vote Hard with a Vengence
- Thread starter kkwd
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Eaglelord17
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I wonder if that's really true at this point. The latest numbers I could find in a quick search was from 2016 and that said we had approximately 272k farmers across the whole country. Which was down 7.5% from the previous census. It might make a difference in a few ridings, but overall I don't think it will change that much. Farmers matter but their voting power is on a decline. I suspect the money trail to the politicians explains it a bit more.
You should probably look into the Quebec cheese cartel. Those guys won’t go down without a serious fight.
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less farmers is a bad thing actually.
Oldgateboatdriver
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It's more than the farmers, Eaglelord17. There is a whole chain of specialized services around them; there is also the whole downstream industry that collects, processes, packages, markets and distribute the milk. Then you add all the cheese and other derivatives plants that are integrated into the system as far as production is concerned. Basically, a whole lot of the smaller cities and towns in Qc and On rely on the milk quota system to operate and be profitable.
And Suffolkowner is right: The less farmers there are, the less food security we have. Imagine if Covid had been such a dangerous virus that nations would have elected to completely close their borders. If we were dependent on US farming to feed ourselves, we would have starved. We have to be able to feed ourselves, at least in the main categories providing enough calories and protein for all our citizen to eat sufficiently. For that, I don't want to be at the mercy of the US mega corporate farms.
Besides, I would agree to abolish the quota system only in a trade with the US where they would agree to stop subsidizing their farming sector (they wont, because the same thing would happen to them: rebellion and losing the next election cycle) and start paying fair value for the water their farms consume (instead of putting that cost on the head of all the US citizens).
And Suffolkowner is right: The less farmers there are, the less food security we have. Imagine if Covid had been such a dangerous virus that nations would have elected to completely close their borders. If we were dependent on US farming to feed ourselves, we would have starved. We have to be able to feed ourselves, at least in the main categories providing enough calories and protein for all our citizen to eat sufficiently. For that, I don't want to be at the mercy of the US mega corporate farms.
Besides, I would agree to abolish the quota system only in a trade with the US where they would agree to stop subsidizing their farming sector (they wont, because the same thing would happen to them: rebellion and losing the next election cycle) and start paying fair value for the water their farms consume (instead of putting that cost on the head of all the US citizens).
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I was going to say that too. The US heavily subsidizes their farming sector (to include dairy).
Also, I don’t drink enough milk to really notice but people I know who do, say that it definitely tastes different.
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hard to say if theres a difference. If I drink American milk its usually in Florida or someplace like that. Same cows really but the feed/grass/hay is not
but the US does heavily subsidize their farmers just differently
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You mean States and States rights, don't you?
That was kind of the original "problem" with These United States of America. It was 13 States, similar to France and the UK and Spain, all working independently but co-operatively.
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Not really. I guess what I meant was “States’ rights” in the way that US states say they’re somewhat independent of the federal govt, then “country’s rights” in respect to Canada vs US.
Eaglelord17
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I live on the border, grew up drinking both. Definitely a taste difference, however I actually prefer the taste of American milk.
I never said less farmers is a good thing, simply that there is less of them (mainly thanks to technology and rising costs forcing some out).
Sort of a consumption tax I guess, use the roads pay for roads…
lol. No way that becomes a thing.
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Good grief.
Eaglelord17
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I can see it. Mainly due to electric cars not paying road taxes which are currently based on fuel. Lots of states are trying to come up with a solution to it, this actually is one (especially if they remove the road taxes on fuel).
lenaitch
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The entire genesis of supply management was to provide a consistent market and price for a highly perishable product. Before supply management, and back in the day of more local dairies, farmers would truck their raw milk to dairies only to find they didn't want it or were offering pennies. Unlike other products that they could simply return to the farm (unless they were desperate for cash), they were often forced to dump the milk. You can chose to keep feeding beef or pork, or store grain, but you cannot not milk a cow bred for milk production.
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no what i meant was why the focus on the dairy part of supply management vs chickens? Chicken farmers are by a nastier bunch in all ways(at the organizational level)
Halifax Tar
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Unverified, off twitter err X I suppose.
lenaitch
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Then sorry, no clue. I don't know the background of the poultry side of supply management.
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Speaking of Milk products:
www.theglobeandmail.com
Canada’s dairy industry discarded approximately 7 per cent of all milk it produced over a 10-year period, according to a new estimate, as part of a supply management system that is designed to control output and keep prices stable.
In a paper recently published in the Ecological Economics journal, the authors teamed up to calculate how much milk dairy farmers dispose of. They determined that more than 6.8 billion litres of raw milk – and possibly as much as 10 billion litres – disappeared from Canadian farms between 2012 and 2021, worth at least $6.7-billion.
“If you’re wasting 7 per cent of the milk you produce, well, logically, you can only come to the conclusion that milk is too expensive in Canada,” Sylvain Charlebois, a Dalhousie University professor and one of the study’s authors, said in an interview.
“That’s why it’s been taboo for dairy farmers. They don’t want to talk about it.”
Whereas prices for most commodities are set in competitive markets, milk prices in Canada are set in a supply management system that is intended to ensure stable income for farmers while supporting a domestic supply of milk and butterfat. Production quotas are set based on monthly market analysis. According to the Canadian Dairy Commission’s website, “costly surpluses can be avoided by controlling production effectively.”
The CDC contested the new paper’s data and assumptions, adding that when milk cannot be processed owing to unforeseen circumstances, producers will often send it to other provinces, donate it to food banks or feed it to calves.
“Disposing large volumes of milk is not sustainable and takes place on rare occasion,” executive director Philippe Charlebois wrote in an e-mail.
“Based on verifiable data, of the approximately 9.6 billion litres of milk produced in Canada in 2023-2024, 99.9% of butterfat and 99.1% of solids non-fat in Canada were processed and marketed.”
Jacques Lefebvre, chief executive officer of Dairy Farmers of Canada, said the paper’s conclusions are drawn from estimates, not a “robust data set,” and require independent validation.
“Milk is disposed only as a last resort after exploring all other alternatives,” he wrote in a statement. “This is done in accordance with regulations and the costs are borne by the dairy farmers.”
The paper’s authors, however, concluded that vast quantities of milk are wasted annually owing to inefficiencies in that system. The dumped milk results in excess greenhouse gas emissions equivalent to 350,000 passenger vehicles annually, and needlessly pollutes soil, air and water, according to the paper, published last month. To grow feed for the cows and care for them, between 920 and 1,900 square kilometres of farmland are required, and huge volumes of water.
Prof. Charlebois said the paper’s authors, who include professors Thomas Elliot from Denmark’s Aalborg University and Benjamin Goldstein from the University of Michigan, assembled last year after an Ontario dairy farmer filmed himself dumping 30,000 litres of milk, which went viral after he published it. They met in Montreal to discuss how to determine the extent of the waste, which they said had never before been revealed by the industry or government.
They calculated national milk production based on the size of the dairy cow herd and average yield per cow, and then determined wastage by subtracting from that amount the milk sales reported by Statistics Canada.
“Boards will call farmers at the end of the month and say there’s a surplus because there’s too much production in the system, or demand has shifted,” Prof. Charlebois explained. “And so they’ll ask a bunch of farmers to dump. It’s a common practice.”
A Senate committee is considering a private member’s bill, known as C-282, which would grant significant new protections to the dairy industry. Passed by the House of Commons in June, 2023, it would prohibit the federal government from granting greater foreign access to Canada’s supply managed agriculture sectors, including dairy, eggs and poultry.
The authors said the practice of dumping milk that meets food safety standards should be halted, and that the CDC should pay farmers to document and report on how much milk they dispose of. Increased transparency, they added, would incentivize farmers to reduce their herds and move to plant-based alternatives. And the system should be reformed to penalize overproduction.
“The dairy farming community in Canada is doing nothing to limit the amount of surpluses,” Prof. Charlebois said.
“We’re not advocating for the end of supply management. We do think that supply management is part of the solution. And because we have supply management, we shouldn’t be tolerating any waste at all.”
Canada’s dairy farms dump 7 per cent of all milk produced, study contends
Researchers say waste results in excess greenhouse gas emissions and needlessly pollutes soil, air and water
www.theglobeandmail.com
Canada’s dairy farms dump 7 per cent of all milk produced, study contends - 18 Oct 24
Canada’s dairy industry discarded approximately 7 per cent of all milk it produced over a 10-year period, according to a new estimate, as part of a supply management system that is designed to control output and keep prices stable.
In a paper recently published in the Ecological Economics journal, the authors teamed up to calculate how much milk dairy farmers dispose of. They determined that more than 6.8 billion litres of raw milk – and possibly as much as 10 billion litres – disappeared from Canadian farms between 2012 and 2021, worth at least $6.7-billion.
“If you’re wasting 7 per cent of the milk you produce, well, logically, you can only come to the conclusion that milk is too expensive in Canada,” Sylvain Charlebois, a Dalhousie University professor and one of the study’s authors, said in an interview.
“That’s why it’s been taboo for dairy farmers. They don’t want to talk about it.”
Whereas prices for most commodities are set in competitive markets, milk prices in Canada are set in a supply management system that is intended to ensure stable income for farmers while supporting a domestic supply of milk and butterfat. Production quotas are set based on monthly market analysis. According to the Canadian Dairy Commission’s website, “costly surpluses can be avoided by controlling production effectively.”
The CDC contested the new paper’s data and assumptions, adding that when milk cannot be processed owing to unforeseen circumstances, producers will often send it to other provinces, donate it to food banks or feed it to calves.
“Disposing large volumes of milk is not sustainable and takes place on rare occasion,” executive director Philippe Charlebois wrote in an e-mail.
“Based on verifiable data, of the approximately 9.6 billion litres of milk produced in Canada in 2023-2024, 99.9% of butterfat and 99.1% of solids non-fat in Canada were processed and marketed.”
Jacques Lefebvre, chief executive officer of Dairy Farmers of Canada, said the paper’s conclusions are drawn from estimates, not a “robust data set,” and require independent validation.
“Milk is disposed only as a last resort after exploring all other alternatives,” he wrote in a statement. “This is done in accordance with regulations and the costs are borne by the dairy farmers.”
The paper’s authors, however, concluded that vast quantities of milk are wasted annually owing to inefficiencies in that system. The dumped milk results in excess greenhouse gas emissions equivalent to 350,000 passenger vehicles annually, and needlessly pollutes soil, air and water, according to the paper, published last month. To grow feed for the cows and care for them, between 920 and 1,900 square kilometres of farmland are required, and huge volumes of water.
Prof. Charlebois said the paper’s authors, who include professors Thomas Elliot from Denmark’s Aalborg University and Benjamin Goldstein from the University of Michigan, assembled last year after an Ontario dairy farmer filmed himself dumping 30,000 litres of milk, which went viral after he published it. They met in Montreal to discuss how to determine the extent of the waste, which they said had never before been revealed by the industry or government.
They calculated national milk production based on the size of the dairy cow herd and average yield per cow, and then determined wastage by subtracting from that amount the milk sales reported by Statistics Canada.
“Boards will call farmers at the end of the month and say there’s a surplus because there’s too much production in the system, or demand has shifted,” Prof. Charlebois explained. “And so they’ll ask a bunch of farmers to dump. It’s a common practice.”
A Senate committee is considering a private member’s bill, known as C-282, which would grant significant new protections to the dairy industry. Passed by the House of Commons in June, 2023, it would prohibit the federal government from granting greater foreign access to Canada’s supply managed agriculture sectors, including dairy, eggs and poultry.
The authors said the practice of dumping milk that meets food safety standards should be halted, and that the CDC should pay farmers to document and report on how much milk they dispose of. Increased transparency, they added, would incentivize farmers to reduce their herds and move to plant-based alternatives. And the system should be reformed to penalize overproduction.
“The dairy farming community in Canada is doing nothing to limit the amount of surpluses,” Prof. Charlebois said.
“We’re not advocating for the end of supply management. We do think that supply management is part of the solution. And because we have supply management, we shouldn’t be tolerating any waste at all.”
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Dairy 1969 from Ontario and Quebec out
from 1961 chicken and eggs started in BC and other provinces followed
1971 the federal system implemented
1973 turkeys added to supply management
1979 the federal import restrictions
my point is more why everyone makes a big deal about milk and not so much the others
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