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The Movie 300 and response by Iran

Journeyman said:
Pardon?
???
Interesting grasp of history


Wasn't he a student at the time during the Hostage Crisis, I meant? Wasn't he one of the people involved in
the "Muslim Student Followers of the Imam's Line" group who took all those Americans hostage?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_hostage_crisis
 
CougarKing said:
Wasn't he a student at the time during the Hostage Crisis, I meant?
Yes. Iran-Contra was a different, although related issue; no embassies were harmed in the swapping of arms for cash.
 
What does the Islamic Republic of Iran care about Persia? They don't call their country Persia anymore and isnt there a saying to the effect that there is no history before the Prophet? Why do they care if a bunch of idol worshippers slaughtered each other? Perhaps they are afraid that the west will rediscover its democratic pagan ethos and kick their candy------ ! It is a Hollywood Epic nothing more but now that it is on Teheran's blacklist I just might go and see it. Tell the Spartans, passer-by, here, obediently, we lie. :cdn:
 
Romeo Echo Mike Echo said:
What does the Islamic Republic of Iran care about Persia? They don't call their country Persia anymore and isnt there a saying to the effect that there is no history before the Prophet? Why do they care if a bunch of idol worshippers slaughtered each other? Perhaps they are afraid that the west will rediscover its democratic pagan ethos and kick their candy------ ! It is a Hollywood Epic nothing more but now that it is on Teheran's blacklist I just might go and see it. Tell the Spartans, passer-by, here, obediently, we lie. :cdn:
Why?... possibly they fear that it will affect the price of Persian carpets in the years to come.

From my perspective, they (Iran & their President) can always finance a movie that glorifies the brave hijackers who wrestled control of aircraft and slammed them into the World trade centre and the evil Pentagon.  No one is going to pay a .05$ to go see it but.... if it's their dime..... it's their dime.
 
geo said:
From my perspective, they (Iran & their President) can always finance a movie that glorifies the brave hijackers who wrestled control of aircraft and slammed them into the World trade centre and the evil Pentagon.  No one is going to pay a .05$ to go see it but.... if it's their dime..... it's their dime.

Yep, they certainly could produce one. And you are probably correct in stating that not too many North Amercians would go see it.

But I'm already imagining the political fallout such a movie would have over here!!

Very funny how that works.
 
hmmm.. what's the saying.... "What's good for the Goose is good for the gander"?
 
geo said:
hmmm.. what's the saying.... "What's good for the Goose is good for the gander"?

That's exactly it Geo. What we North Americans sometimes view as comedy, entertainment or "just a movie" is by no means always regarded as such elsewhere and has the potential to develop into quite the political activty.

Witness the publication and political fallout of what some thought were "harmless" cartoons in Denmark. I'm quite sure that there would be a thread running on this very forum should the Iranians ever produce such a movie as you have mentioned, and I guarantee that most of use here would not support any arguments of it being just harmless entertainment.

Our values are not necessarily reflective of those of other governments, therefore the political fallout that occurs regarding movies. Mel Gibson certainly got a taste of that with The Passion of the Christ as well.

 
Agreed Vern.
In a poltical tit for tat, you can always be certain that everyone will always interpret it as being it's worst.

Guess that's why they keep this old warhorse around (sigh!)
 
In other news:  Outraged descendants of Vlad Tepesch demand an apology from Hollywood, the estate of Bram Stoker, and every teenager who ever wore black nail polish.... ::)
 
The Librarian said:
Witness the publication and political fallout of what some thought were "harmless" cartoons in Denmark. I'm quite sure that there would be a thread running on this very forum should the Iranians ever produce such a movie as you have mentioned, and I guarantee that most of use here would not support any arguments of it being just harmless entertainment.

Our values are not necessarily reflective of those of other governments, therefore the political fallout that occurs regarding movies. Mel Gibson certainly got a taste of that with The Passion of the Christ as well.

Give me a break!  There is an ocean of difference between either of the Danish cartoons, "300" and harmless entertainment crap like this, from an Iranian television series: http://www.littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/?entry=15898_Iranian_Television_Blood_Libel&only

In the words of the producer (quoted from the same link):
Ahmad Mir-’Alawii: We have presented only a small portion of the Zionists’ crimes. During our work [on the film] we received information— even from Jews sympathizing with our point of view. They themselves were anti-Zionists. These were monotheistic Jews. They gave us information that made us regret the film had been completed. I wish we had this information before we made the film.

  Oh Zionists, you have occupied the homes of innocent people. You are killing them, making them face firing squads, and gouging out their eyes in front of their parents. In this film we treated you more than fairly, when we presented you as taking out their eyes in an operating room.

    There is a white ship sailing the oceans. It doesn’t enter the territorial waters of Iran or similar countries. Our Arab brothers must look out for this ship. In it [the Zionists] hold children only one or two years old, who don’t know anything. These are children no one cared for. They are kidnapped by various means under the pretext of wanting to take care of them. These children are held on this ship, and no one knows their fate. They become teenagers, not knowing what their fate will be. They receive the best medical care and are under constant physical monitoring and supervision. Why do [the Zionists] give them such care? To use them for medical purposes. They use the heart, the kidneys, and their other organs.
 
I_am_John_Galt said:
Give me a break!  There is an ocean of difference between either of the Danish cartoons, "300" and harmless entertainment crap like this, from an Iranian television series: http://www.littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/?entry=15898_Iranian_Television_Blood_Libel&only

Mr. Galt,

Thanks for pointing that out. Give me a break. I realize there is a world of difference, and nowhere have I said that I agree with their views.

This thread is for discussion of that politcial fallout. Whether we agree with it or not doesn't mean it doesn't exist. And what WE view as harmless entertainment...others do not.

Is that too difficult to understand?
 
The lack of political fallout (on our side) doesn't change the fact that we recognize it as hard line hate-mongering propaganda, not harmless entertainment, and yet we don't react in the manner you suggest.

There is a huge difference in the way we and they act:
Their response to harmless entertainment >>> react as if it is hate-mongering propaganda.
Our response to hate-mongering propaganda >>> act as if it is only harmless entertainment (or perhaps more accurately, ignore it completely).

The kind of crap I linked to happens all the time and yet there is no general discussion of  in the West (let alone threads on this forum).
 
I_am_John_Galt said:
The lack of political fallout (on our side) doesn't change the fact that we recognize it as hard line hate-mongering propaganda, not harmless entertainment, and yet we don't react in the manner you suggest.

There is a huge difference in the way we and they act:
Their response to harmless entertainment >>> react as if it is hate-mongering propaganda.
Our response to hate-mongering propaganda >>> act as if it is only harmless entertainment (or perhaps more accurately, ignore it completely).

The kind of crap I linked to happens all the time and yet there is no general discussion of  in the West (let alone threads on this forum).

Their hate-mongering propaganda is so common and so over the top that for many of us it's reduced to the credibility of most entertainment- although I'll admit it's hardly harmless.

I simply don't take those guys seriously. It gives them far much more attention than they're due.
 
I_am_John_Galt said:
The lack of political fallout (on our side) doesn't change the fact that we recognize it as hard line hate-mongering propaganda, not harmless entertainment, and yet we don't react in the manner you suggest.
I have NOT suggested that we react in any manner let alone the same manner.
I_am_John_Galt said:
There is a huge difference in the way we and they act:
Their response to harmless entertainment >>> react as if it is hate-mongering propaganda.
Our response to hate-mongering propaganda >>> act as if it is only harmless entertainment (or perhaps more accurately, ignore it completely).
How we react is indeed totally different JUST like I said. Re-read that post of mine that you've quoted down below. Read it carefully. And then tell me where you are pulling these two statements regarding how I ever said that our reaction and theirs were comparable?? I said the exact opposite in fact and gave the example of our two totally different reactions to the cartoons. Ironiclly, the exact point by me that you chose to quote.
I_am_John_Galt said:
The kind of crap I linked to happens all the time and yet there is no general discussion of  in the West (let alone threads on this forum).
No general discussion of it in the West or on these forums?? I suggest you also use the "search" tool. Try looking up "Paris, Riots, Danish Cartoons etc etc" Here's some for you:

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/39534.0.html

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/39390.0.html

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/34696.0.html

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/43100.0.html

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/49833.0.html

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/52758.0.html

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/51413.0.html

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/36145.0.html

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/48224.0.html

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/34400.0.html

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/47186.0.html

etc etc.
 
You can read a lot into how things are interpreted. "300" is based on a comic book, which was inspired by a historical event. The book "Gates of Fire" was also inspired by the  Battle of Thermopylae but treats the various Greek City States and Persians rather differently. The current Iranians are looking at the film through a lens of religion, cultural erosion and fear of retribution (brought on by their own actions), so have a different view than those of us who have watched it in the West (or are waiting for a copy to be available here.......)

Since Frank Miller's purpose was to examine and glorify the heroic nature of the Spartans, naturally they come off as much better than the opposition, and the Persians are depicted in such a way as to contrast the "virtues" of the Spartans. Classical scholars like Victor Davis Hanson do not find the Spartans to be all that wonderful (read his view in "The Soul of Battle"), I imagine his retelling of the Battle of Thermopylae would be quite different from the way Herotodus, Frank Miller or Steven Pressfield did it.
 
The Librarian said:
What we North Americans sometimes view as comedy, entertainment or "just a movie" is by no means always regarded as such elsewhere and has the potential to develop into quite the political activty.
The Iranian President, et.al. look to take umbrage whenever they conceivably can: it is a question of ulterior motives on their part, not a lack of cultural sensitivity on ours.  We need to look at Ahmadinejad (as well as the more radical mullahs, among others), not ourselves!

....  I'm quite sure that there would be a thread running on this very forum should the Iranians ever produce such a movie as you have mentioned, and I guarantee that most of use here would not support any arguments of it being just harmless entertainment.

While you were referring to glorifying the 9/11 hijackers specifically, movies, tv shows, etc. that are far worse already exist, and yet we do not have threads running on them.
 
Mr. Galt

Again,

The Iranian President, et.al. look to take umbrage whenever they conceivably can: it is a question of ulterior motives on their part, not a lack of cultural sensitivity on ours.  We need to look at Ahmadinejad (as well as the more radical mullahs, among others), not ourselves!

Tell me where did I say in this thread we needed to look at ourselves? You can't; I didn't. And nowhere have I stated anything about cultural sensitivities. And nowhere have I stated that we need to examine this from either our or their perspective. I've only stated that this thread was to deal with it from the political perspective. Period.

While you were referring to glorifying the 9/11 hijackers specifically, movies, tv shows, etc. that are far worse already exist, and yet we do not have threads running on them.

While I was what?? Glorifying the 9/11 hijackers?? I don't think so.

What I specifically said was:

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/58656/post-541943.html#msg541943
Witness the publication and political fallout of what some thought were "harmless" cartoons in Denmark. I'm quite sure that there would be a thread running on this very forum should the Iranians ever produce such a movie as you have mentioned, and I guarantee that most of use here would not support any arguments of it being just harmless entertainment.

Clear?



 
While you were referring to glorifying the 9/11 hijackers specifically, movies, tv shows, etc. that are far worse already exist, and yet we do not have threads running on them.

True. An example would be this Mandarin Chinese language feature film with English subtitles,(you should check your local Korean or Cantonese video store, hehe) I saw about the Opium War of the 1840s, made in the 80s or 90s, which shows Royal Navy ships pounding Qing Dynasty Chinese shore batteries and the Brits eagerly exploiting the "innocent" Manchus and their Han Chinese lackeys. Oh well...but this other topic's best left to the history part of the forum. Whoever's in power in a country decides how history is taught, no matter how much of the truth they have to manipulate in order to make their nation more victimized by the "evil" West or whoever they fought before in a previous war.  ::)

Another example- the Japanese Ministry of Education still does not print any mention of Japanese war attrocities in Japanese school children's text books- including the Rape of Nanjing in 1937 as well as the Japanese massacre of Commonwealth civilians in a hospital during the occupation of either Singapore or Hong Kong, if I can recall correctly.

And no, that movie I mentioned earlier is not called "Once Upon a time in China" though both were set in the same time (I think it's simply called the "Opium War").
 
God forfend that the ancient ancestors of a nation of overemotional, temperamental, paranoid zealots be portrayed as anything other peaceloving, civilized liberators, vice a marauding horde of ruthless invaders.  By the bye, in 480 BCE pretty much EVERYONE were marauding barbarians.  It wasn't until the invention of ouzo that Greece finally managed to civilize the rest of the world.
 
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