Summer 2024: Rioting across UK cities

[dapaterson]

I was speaking to the concept of applying laws to speech located elsewhere in the world.

 

[Brad Sallows]

I was speaking to the concept of applying laws to speech located elsewhere in the world.

Any Canadian government that handed a Canadian citizen over to a foreign government - or even attempted to - for a freedom-of-expression crime would deserve whatever punishment people sought fit to administer.

 

[brihard]

Any Canadian government that handed a Canadian citizen over to a foreign government - or even attempted to - for a freedom-of-expression crime would deserve whatever punishment people sought fit to administer.

The simple rule of extradition in Canada is we will only extradite someone to face charges for conduct that is criminal in both countries. We also have a step where the court holds a hearing and assesses whether the evidence provided to Canada by the requesting country would be sufficient to bring the person to trial in Canada. The Brits could request extradition of someone for, for instance, willful promotion of hatred or advocating genocide, because those are offences here- though both have a pretty high bar. Simply saying things that are very offensive wouldn't cut it.

 

[Haggis]

The simple rule of extradition in Canada is we will only extradite someone to face charges for conduct that is criminal in both countries.

The person subject to extradition from Canada must be facing a sentence of two years or more upon conviction in the receiving state. Also, Canada may refuse to extradite anyone to face charges which could put them in jeopardy of a death sentence.

 

[Blackadder1916]

A selection of news releases from the UK Crown Prosecution Service referencing some of the on-line agitators as well as the thugs in the street. Swift procedure seems to be the order of the day.

Online agitator becomes first person from Wales to be convicted following widespread unrest | The Crown Prosecution Service

www.cps.gov.uk

• Richard David Williams, [07/05/1990] of Buckley, Flintshire, was charged with and pleaded guilty to one count of sending a menacing message via a public communications network.
• He was sentenced to 12 weeks imprisonment at Mold Magistrates' Court on Friday August 9, 2024.

Man jailed just two days after posting online during public disorder | The Crown Prosecution Service

www.cps.gov.uk

• Tyler Kay, [DOB: 17/02/1998], is of Northampton, Northamptonshire.
• He pleaded guilty to publishing material intending to stir up racial hatred, contrary to Section 19 of the Public Order Act (1986).
• He was sentenced to 38 months' imprisonment at Northampton Crown Court on Friday, 9 August.

Woman charged with publishing material intending to stir up racial hatred | The Crown Prosecution Service

www.cps.gov.uk

• Lucy Connolly, [20/01/1983], is of Northampton, Northamptonshire.
• She has been charged with publishing written material which was threatening, abusive or insulting intending thereby to stir up racial hatred or having regard to all the circumstances, whereby racial hatred was likely to be stirred up, contrary to section 19 of the Public Order Act 1986.
• She is due to appear at Nottingham Magistrates’ Court today.

First prison sentences for those involved in North East unrest | The Crown Prosecution Service

www.cps.gov.uk

Ryan Sheers, 28, of Powlett Road, Hartlepool, pleaded guilty to a charge of violent disorder. He was today sentenced to two years and two months' imprisonment at Teesside Crown Court.
Steven Mailen, 54, of Arch Court, Hartlepool, also pleaded guilty to a charge of violent disorder and was sentenced to two years and two months' imprisonment at the same court.
Bobby Shirbon, 18, of Cornwall Street, Hartlepool, pleaded guilty to a charge of criminal damage and two charges of violent disorder. He was sentenced to 20 months’ detention in a young offenders’ institution.
Keiron Gatenby, 19, of Yeovil Walk, Hartlepool, pleaded guilty to one charge of violent disorder. He was sentenced to 16 months’ detention in a young offenders’ institution.
Carl Holliday, 30, of Tankerville Street, Hartlepool, pleaded guilty to one charge of violent disorder. He was sentenced to 32 months’ imprisonment.

Violent offenders jailed for Sunderland disorder | The Crown Prosecution Service

www.cps.gov.uk

Leanne Hodgson, 43, of Holborn Road, Sunderland, previously pleaded guilty to a charge of violent disorder and was sentenced to two and a half years' imprisonment.
Andrew Smith, 41, of High Street East, Sunderland, previously pleaded guilty to a charge of violent disorder and was sentenced to two years and two months' imprisonment.
Josh Kellett, 29, of Southcroft, Washington, previously pleaded guilty to a charge of violent disorder and was sentenced to two and a half years' imprisonment.
Bradley Makin, 21, of Simonside Road, Sunderland, previously pleaded guilty to a charge of violent disorder and one charge od possession of class A drugs. He was sentenced to two years' imprisonment.

Thugs jailed for violent disorder in Hull | The Crown Prosecution Service

www.cps.gov.uk

Three men who attacked police officers during widespread unrest in Hull have been jailed today.

Andrew Stewart, 37, was sentenced to two years and six months at Hull Crown Court. He pled guilty to violent disorder at an earlier hearing in the Magistrates’ Court. During the disturbances, he was seen pushing a burning waste bin towards police officers and throwing missiles at them.
Brandon Kirkwood, 20, was also jailed for two years and six months for violent disorder after pleading guilty to pushing a large bin, along with others, at police officers in Hull city centre on 3 August.
Christopher Douglas, 35, was handed a sentence of two years and eight months in jail after pleading guilty to violent disorder. He was caught on CCTV in Hull city centre on 3 August throwing items at police officers, pushing officers, shouting and acting aggressively as part of a large group. At one point he was seen waving a stolen police shield above his head. He was arrested at his home three days later. Douglas was also given a five-year criminal behaviour order that includes not congregating in groups in public places and not covering his face in public except for medical reasons.

 

[The Bread Guy]

The Lucy Connolly case is interesting to watch, given the content in question mentions setting fire to hotels containing refugees.

Tory councillor’s wife Lucy Connolly remanded in custody on racial hatred charges

Lucy Connolly is accused of stirring up racial hatred on the day three children were killed in Southport

uk.news.yahoo.com

The Brits best be careful not to apply a “if in doubt, round ‘em up” approach, but if that’s as reported, that’s not just taking the piss out of the government.

 

[Fabius]

Jailing people for comments like that on social media is likely not a good solution. It’s probable that the overall government will continue to ignore a significant social issue and the purported solution will only clamp down the lid of a pressure cooker making the next explosion even worse by further reducing any trust in government and the national institutions. The issues outlined in the already mentioned article here, won’t be improved by this response.

Andrew MacDougall: The long, hard road that brought Britain to these riots

What explains the chaos on British streets? There's a long and a short answer to that. Here's both.

www.readtheline.ca

An authoritarian response to legitimate concerns that have been ignored and poo pooed by a bipartisan consensus for decades is not a good solution.

We can all decry the comments and violence and say it’s not acceptable but we must also then consider what the people’s options are if their concerns are not addressed by any stripe of political party. A rush to authoritarianism will be akin to destroying the nation in order to save it if societies are not careful.

 

[The Bread Guy]

A rush to authoritarianism will be akin to destroying the nation in order to save it if societies are not careful.

1000% That said ....

... We can all decry the comments and violence and say it’s not acceptable but we must also then consider what the people’s options are if their concerns are not addressed by any stripe of political party ...

... is there a case to be made that the eye should be drawn to specific cases of "burn 'em in their hotels," "death to the capitalists" or "death to the infidels" and the like? I think we should jump on them all equally, and agree that if one is jumped on, all should be jumped on.

And you've also hit the nail on the head re: radicalization of all kinds: how do you dial down someone who feels fucked over by the system, and doesn't see solutions within the system, but can be influences by simple (too simple?) answers via social media? That IS a harder problem to solve, and it won't be solved by "if in doubt, lock 'em up" approaches.