Replacing the Subs

[YZT580]

doesn't surprise me at all. They pulled the same stunt with the 105. Locker room gossip says that we had several interested European customers until they refused permission for AVRO to sell them with the nav./targeting system installed. Belgium was one, and I believe that Germany was another. They gave us a deal on the 104 instead

Need to really reconsider US made technology in our military equipment, going by this the US cannot be relied upon not to use it power to block sales even between two countries friendly to it.

 

[Kirkhill]

It's time to ditch Virginia subs for AUKUS and go to Plan B - Breaking Defense

In this op-ed, Henry Sokolski argues Australia should switch its focus from buying Virginia-class submarines and instead put that money towards Pillar 2 technologies.

breakingdefense.com

Great progress and greater potential: Australia needs to accelerate programs for uncrewed naval vessels | The Strategist

Australia is doing well in developing uncrewed naval vessels. Now it needs to redouble efforts to get them into service faster. Application of asymmetric technology is a declared outcome of the Defence Strategic Review (DSR) ...

www.aspistrategist.org.au

Australia is doing well in developing uncrewed naval vessels. Now it needs to redouble efforts to get them into service faster. Application of asymmetric technology is a declared outcome of the Defence Strategic Review (DSR) to generate deterrence by denial, so these systems should be moved to the front of the queue.

The Australian Defence Force has designs for three uncrewed vessels in development: the extra large uncrewed submarine Ghost Shark by Anduril Australia in Sydney, the smaller Speartooth submarine by Melbourne’s C2 Robotics, and the Bluebottle boat by Sydney’s Ocius Technology. Each craft is the result of navy-industry collaboration. When the three are operated together as a maritime system, they offer excellent combinations of capabilities and force multiplication, achieving outcomes that no single type could achieve alone.

Everything We Just Learned About The Ghost Shark Uncrewed Submarine

Anduril has laid out big plans for the Ghost Shark, one of which is now in the U.S., especially when it comes to proving out new payloads.

www.twz.com

Latest Speartooth trials complete and production-ready - Australian Defence Magazine

The new Speartooth Large Uncrewed Underwater Vehicle that has been under development for the RAN has completed trials and is ready for the next stage of development | Tim Fish

www.australiandefence.com.au

Bluebottle Unmanned Surface Vessels (USV), Australia

Bluebottle is an autonomous unmanned surface vessel manufactured by Ocius Technology for continuous maritime surveillance.

www.naval-technology.com

Importantly, these vessels are not for next decade in the DSR’s third epoch. The Bluebottle is mature and mission ready. Long-range maritime operations are standard everyday activities for Bluebottles that have already been delivered to the navy. The Speartooth is continuing intensive testing and trials, with more than two years in the water so far and a number of units operating frequently in a test environment. The Ghost Shark is also progressing rapidly, ahead of schedule, with in-water testing well underway.

For all three, testing is showing low workforce demands. Allocated personnel are operating many of these uncrewed systems concurrently. Humans assist and direct them but do not continuously control them.

Rather than sacrificing much of its defense program to buy nuclear submarines, Canberra should instead adopt an AUKUS Plan B that would field new defense technologies such as uncrewed systems and hypersonic weapons that would enhance Australia’s security faster, and for far less.

Rather than spend more than $13 billion on US Virginia-class submarines, under Plan B, Australia would maintain its current fleet of aging Collins-class subs while investing in, and eventually fielding, other advanced defense technologies through Pillar Two.

These innovative projects, which include uncrewed systems, AI, quantum computer science, and hypersonic weapons, could deliver technologies that provide most of what the Virginia-class subs would offer for Australia. For example, Chinese fighters can barely reach Australia and Beijing’s bombers cannot risk unescorted missions. Without an air threat, Australian surface warships, uncrewed vessels, and long-endurance drones like the MQ-9 Reaper could patrol the waters around Australia for Chinese subs and ships (which operated last week off Australia’s eastern waters) at a fraction of the price of Virginia-class boats.

Autonomous undersea vehicles like the Ghost Shark or Speartooth could perform some of the offensive missions nuclear submarines would otherwise provide by deploying mines or torpedoes — or weaponizing the vehicle itself. The threat of an unwarned attack on Chinese artificial islands or naval forces in the South China Sea could deter Beijing from armed aggression, especially if China is also confronting US and Japanese forces to the north.

Investing in these projects rather than the Virginia-class nuclear submarines would also benefit US and Australian industry.

Canada is already in the game

Extra-Large AUV Achieves MASS Compliance in Canada | UST

Cellula Robotics’ Solus-XR XLAUV (eXtra Large Autonomous Underwater Vehicle) has successfully achieved MASS (Maritime Autonomous Surface Ship) compliance in Canada. This...

www.unmannedsystemstechnology.com

Canadian fuel cell AUV featured at Autonomous Warrior 23 - cellula.com

Rendering showing the Loggerhead concept. XLUUV with deployed ROV conducting offshore wind farm inspection.

cellula.com

Cellula Robotics Successfully Delivers 'Abraham' Autonomous Underwater Vehicle (AUV) to Terradepth to Support Development of AxV Platform

Cellula Robotics announced that it has successfully delivered Abraham, an autonomous underwater vehicle (AUV), to Terradepth LLC to support the development of their AxV platform.

www.bctechnology.com

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Transmitting information while submerged is tricky business, I see manned and unmanned underwater systems as complimentary, not an either or situation. Most submerged UAV's will be doing data gathering , popping to the surface/close to the surface to transmit. The manned sub will be the shoot/no shoot decider. Unmanned system will be used for really dangerous tasks like shallow waters or penetrating a harbour. A manned sub will likely bring the unmanned system closer to the opponents shore and release it underwater to finish the mission and either depart or await it's return.

 

[Rainbow1910]

Anybody advocating for unmanned platforms to entirely or mostly replace manned submarines in the context of the RAN's requirements is fundamentally misinformed or unserious.

 

[Kirkhill]

Anybody advocating for unmanned platforms to entirely or mostly replace manned submarines in the context of the RAN's requirements is fundamentally misinformed or unserious.

The SSN-AUKUS, also known as the SSN-A, is a planned class of nuclear-powered fleet submarine (SSN) intended to enter service with the United Kingdom's Royal Navy in the late 2030s and Royal Australian Navy in the early 2040s. The class will replace the UK's Astute-class and Australia's Collins-class submarines.

SSN-AUKUS - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Officially at least, Aukus remains on course, centrepiece of a storied security alliance.

Pillar one of the Australia-UK-US agreement involves, first, Australia buying between three and five Virginia-Class nuclear-powered submarines from the US – the first of these in 2032.

Surface tension: could the promised Aukus nuclear submarines simply never be handed over to Australia?

The multi-billion dollar deal was heralded as ensuring the security of the Indo-Pacific. But with America an increasingly unreliable ally, doubts are rising above the waves

www.theguardian.com

Chinese Task Force Circumnavigates Australia, Causing Local Stir

A Chinese Task Force circumnavigating Australia attracted considerable local attention. Naval News provides a timeline and analysis of events.

www.navalnews.com

....

The Chinese are interfering with navigation right now.

 

[BdaDug]

That was the plan with the project already, take them with the weapons and sensors that the build country is already using, the only canadianization would be the crypto suite.

And the galley, hopefully!

 

[Kirkhill]

For the record, I am not advocating for UUVs instead of subs. I hope we order the subs right quick. My concern is that, like Ukraine, we might end up fighting with what we have and what we can scrounge.

China’s navy sends a steady drumbeat of ships around Australia | The Strategist

China’s deployment of a potent surface action group around Australia over the past two weeks is unprecedented but not unique. Over the past few years, China’s navy has deployed a range of vessels in Australia’s ...

www.aspistrategist.org.au

Australia’s defences must be ready in two years. Here’s what to do | The Strategist

Beijing deployed a naval task group to the waters around Australia for three related reasons. First, to demonstrate the reach and potency of Chinese sea power and to put Australia on notice that it is ...

www.aspistrategist.org.au

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Canada was doing AUV's long before it was the cool toy on the block. I used to have to dodge them while being tested in Indian Arm. Most were diesel powered with a snorkel as battery packs were not up to the task. I also supported the SFU Underwater Research lab who's students were working on solving underwater communications issues for AUV's and autonomous ROV's. That was in the 1980-1990's.