Military Making Pitch to Aboriginal Youth ($1,200 bonus for aboriginals)

[PPCLI MCpl]

Or yeah, and when we send cadets to summer camp and give them a training bonus, that is.....what?

That is just one benefit of an outstanding program provided for Canada's youth.  It's usually enough to cover toiletries, sundry items and some entertainment.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

Quote,
So all of those high school kids who sign up for the paid Army Reserve Co-op programs (and at the end of the semester they elect not to stay in the reserves)... You would call that what....? Or yeah, and when we send cadets to summer camp and give them a training bonus, that is.....what?

...that is....something anyone can qualify for....the way it should be.

Clearly, most on this thread don't understand the history or the aim of the CFAEP and in fact diversity issues and challenges in general.  Do some research. Read up on the program and its history. Veterans Affairs has an excellent book entitled Native Soldiers Foreign Battlefields that chronicles Aboriginal achievements in Canada's 20th century wars.

...did they NEED a bonus?

And cut out the qualifying statement "Don't get me wrong, I have no problems with..."  This statement is easily interpreted as bigotry.

....yea, one can interpret anything they wish if they want it to be so. :

 

[Kat Stevens]

I was going to say exactly the same thing Bruce, you trumped me again!

CHIMO,  Kat

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

Bruce Monkhouse    - Posts: 2,575

Kat Stevens        -  Posts: 336

...practice, practice, practice.........

 

[Kat Stevens]

I would add one thing, save the flames for the end. Yes, aboriginal soldiers fought bravely and honourably in both World Wars and Korea (Tommy Prince was a Sapper first!).  So did Canadians of every other ethnic group....see where I'm going, here?

CHIMO,  Kat

 

[PPCLI MCpl]

Tommy Prince was a Sapper first!

Thems fightin' words. 

 

[mbhabfan]

I am not a bigot in any way shape or form....I am white 31 years old why won't the government give me 1200 for joining up.   If it were reversed it would be considered all over the country as a racist policy...so why is this new program not racism???   I am all for bonuses but for every person, red, white, black, or green for that matter.  

PS...thanks Bruce and Kat for the help.  I don't see my view as bigotry at all.

 

[Cloud Cover]

If $1200 is all it costs to yank someone away from the temptation to sniff glue and gas, from poverty, illness, suicide and jail, then I am happy to pay. For 1200 we would get a positive role model who contributes selflessly to community and to country. I would say that is the best $1200 a head the feds ever spent on this group of  young people.  So, I suspect a catch or a trap. 

Nevertheless, I say give it a try and see what happens. 

 

[x-grunt]

Many Aboriginals have roadblocks that are difficult to overcome, in general. Admittedly some non-natives do too - but Natives on reserves face these hardships as the rule, not the exception. This is extremely hard to convince most people of unless they have lived it.

I think the idea of some program for native youth on reserves to see what the CF is like is okay. I'm not convinced the current method is the right one, but I see nothing wrong with the general concept.

 

[SHELLDRAKE!!]

I don't understand how this policy (even if its unsubstantiated) can not be looked upon as racist. IMHO the paperwork done when enrolling in the CF should contain no references to a persons sex or race. As any job should be, the first ones hired should be based on who meets the CF's prerequesites first.

If the governments case is in the past we have not had many (female, native, klingon, or whatever you would class a minority) maybee its because traditionally the "minorities" didn't have an interest in joining.

I am all for recruiting for the CF, based on those that are interested, no matter who they are.This would raise the retention rate and help stave off problems such as those that were given a bonus to entice them to join but didn't really want to be there.

This "signing" bonus is so rediculouse to me that I wonder whats next? A bonus for signing concienciose objectors because they are a minority in the CF?

 

[TCBF]

"If you need to be bribed into joining the CF...makes you wonder what kind of person they are."

- You mean like Doctors and Lawyers?

Tom

 

[Cloud Cover]

"If you need to be bribed into joining the CF...makes you wonder what kind of person they are."

- You mean like Doctors and Lawyers?

Tom

Electronics technicians, powerline technicians, journeyman trades, retention pay for fighter pilots and the list goes on.

This is all so much bullshit. Less than a few hundred people will take advantage of the program. A bribe is an exchange of money in return for an illegal or illicit purpose, usually criminal in nature. 

 

[mbhabfan]

doctors and lawyers........come on is that an ethnic background now?????? Please people give examples that make sense.

 

[Kat Stevens]

So, would an aboriginal doctor get an additional $1200..... ???

Kat

 

[SHELLDRAKE!!]

Many Aboriginals have roadblocks that are difficult to overcome, in general. Admittedly some non-natives do too - but Natives on reserves face these hardships as the rule, not the exception. This is extremely hard to convince most people of unless they have lived it.



I agree that there are those on reserves or even small towns that have no idea what the CF has to offer, what about taking that $1200 bonus proposed and use it to open more recruiting centers and a recruiting outreach for outlying areas.

My gripe is we will inevitably be getting recruits who don't want to be there wasting the few defence dollars we have.

 

[Infanteer]

Electronics technicians, powerline technicians, journeyman trades, retention pay for fighter pilots and the list goes on.

This is all so much bullshit. Less than a few hundred people will take advantage of the program. A bribe is an exchange of money in return for an illegal or illicit purpose, usually criminal in nature.

No kidding - I guess every RMC recruit falls into that bucket as well - hey wait, the CF gave me some coin for university, does that mean I'm in that boat as well?

I agree that there are those on reserves or even small towns that have no idea what the CF has to offer, what about taking that $1200 bonus proposed and use it to open more recruiting centers and a recruiting outreach for outlying areas.

Now that, my friend, is a good idea.

 

[x-grunt]

If $1200 is all it costs to yank someone away from the temptation to sniff glue...

I wish. It's a rough go on some of these reserves. Poverty and hopelessness is hard to overcome. I have many friends and acquintances in or from isolated reserves, the issues are appalling and complex. I imagine this CF course is an attempt to reach those with little prospects and under-employed in isolated regions.

My concern is that the 3 week course may just be a holiday for many that gives them some quick cash. But then again, maybe I'm talking out my rump, I have no experience with this program.

we don't NEED aboriginal soldiers, but we NEED doctors

2332piper: Actually, much as I am admittedly a bit of a Native advocate you make a good point. The CF is not a social welfare program, and the Native representation seems to reflect the national population.

 

[mbhabfan]

I don't think anyone on here will disagree that things are tough on some reserves and they face real challenges.  Nobody is trying to discount that fact but I don't believe that because I am white I should not be entitled to a bonus if I came from a different location even IF the situation were the same as far as poverty etc. goes.  I am not in that situation but it is my point.  Why not offer it to any person under certain income levels instead of calling it an aboriginal program call it something else and open it to all citizens.

 

[Cloud Cover]

I am white I should not be entitled to a bonus if I came from a different location even IF the situation were the same as far as poverty etc. goes.  I am not in that situation but it is my point.  Why not offer it to any person under certain income levels instead of calling it an aboriginal program call it something else and open it to all citizens.

You hit the nail on the head. The answer is because the government owes no duty to you as a white person, unless you are part of another group - such as gay or transgender. Seems to me the CF has made provision for that sort of thing, why not Aboriginals?  Social and economic status is not yet a recognized duty, but it soon will be.  The theory may defy common sense and perhaps our sense of "fairness" in the ordinary sense of the word, but that is the state of the law as I understand it, FWIW.

 

[Michael OLeary]

I don't think anyone on here will disagree that things are tough on some reserves and they face real challenges.  Nobody is trying to discount that fact but I don't believe that because I am white I should not be entitled to a bonus if I came from a different location even IF the situation were the same as far as poverty etc. goes.  I am not in that situation but it is my point.  Why not offer it to any person under certain income levels instead of calling it an aboriginal program call it something else and open it to all citizens.

bo ·nus
  1. Something given or paid in addition to what is usual or expected.
  2. A sum of money or an equivalent given to an employee in addition to the employee's usual compensation.


While I understand the points being made on the perception of selective opportunities for minorities, and still must acknowledge that the department is held by law to the Employment Equity Act; $1200 for three weeks of work is less than the rate of pay for a Private Incentive 1 - how exactly does that translate into a "bonus."

Would it be better described as a paid work trial program?