LSVW and ILTIS Replacements (Silverado & G Wagon)?

[McG]

it doesn't matter what you have if you have people behind the wheel who don't know how to drive offroad 

There is the right answer.

 

[Brad Sallows]

>Ford 3-tons painted camo green with B/O lights?

More likely a 5- or 10-ton.  In this case the gunners rather than the recce should get SMP (gun tractors).

Considering how they are used by non-recce units and the number of highway/urban versus off-road/training area mileage, COTS is the way to go for the reserves.  Buy cheap, reasonably rugged trucks with no frills, wear 'em out, buy more of same.

 

[Michael Dorosh]

Okay, call me unobservant, but what does MILCOTS stand for?  Brad just used COTS on its own.  Civilian Off The Shelf??

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Yes Michael,

MILitary Commercial Off The Shelf

 

[Brad Sallows]

I recollect Commercial Off The Shelf.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Brad,
You're right. Had a brain fart trying to get a dig at Michael ;D (See my byline about the monkey. Shows where my heads been at after three weekends off this summer : )

 

[Jeff Boomhouwer]

I like MILVERADO instead of MILCOTS

 

[Posthumane]

Out of curiosity, does anyone know how these vehicles are going to be serviced in the reserves? By that I mean, are there going to be standard qualification courses for it right away so that local vehTechs can fix them, or are they under a factory warranty, as the rumors I've heard say? I can see some issues with repairs being done on them in local shops since many reserve units do not have much equipment and knowledge on *modern* vehicle repairs (anything dealing with modern auto electrical systems and such seems to be a black art to a lot of people I know). Also, is the 404 qualification on this vehicle the same one as for the civvy pattern crew cab?

 

[Fishbone Jones]

The whole idea, or one of the main ones anyway, was to give the Reserves a vehicle that could be serviced locally. It will be going to the nearest dealer for servicing, at least while it's under warranty. You can't even add oil to it right now. You need the conversion course or the formal one, depending what you hold right now, before you can drive it.

 

[Mountie]

How about the 5/4 tonne version of the G-Wagon as a LSVW replacement?  This would ease the maintenance burden by eliminating a vehicle fleet.

 

[b.scheller]

Well with the cracked floor boards, and the small Ilsis' perhaps Canada needs a new vehicle in their armed forces. Should the government spend money on just re-building and arming already existant vehicles such as FORD OR GMC trucks or god forbid more Mercedes Benz G wagons or should they try to develop something of their own. Something bigger and better then the small ilsis?

Thanks!

oops i'm retarded...sorry, if a mod could move this thread to the sub-vehicle section i'd appreciate it... :-[

 

[Gilligan]

The reserves are getting the Milcot, which is a "militarized" chevy silverado.   Personally, I find it to be a giant hunk of crap....we can't take it off hardpack, which is useless to us out west.   I've heard many good things about the G-wagon that the regs have, based on use of the milcot, I would rather have the G-wagon, although I'm not quite sure I'm altogether ready to give up the Lltis.   It is far more vesitile than a full sized pickup, as it is it's a civy truck with a rifle rack in the middle. We aren't afraid to beat the Lltis up a little, as isn't that the purpose of any vehicle in the military?

 

[McGurk,G]

On this subject My Feeling is that the Canadain Forces need to step back for a moment and look at the history of all the vehicles they have had, look at the repair records for them and choose the newer models of each one no matter what the cost. My opion is that you cannot put a price on a persons safety.
 

 

[Wizard of OZ]

The reserves are getting the Milcot, which is a "militarized" chevy silverado.   Personally, I find it to be a giant hunk of crap....we can't take it off hardpack, which is useless to us out west.   I've heard many good things about the G-wagon that the regs have, based on use of the milcot, I would rather have the G-wagon, although I'm not quite sure I'm altogether ready to give up the Lltis.   It is far more vesversatilean a full sized pickup, as it is it's a civy truck with a rifle rack in the middle. We aren't afraid to beat the Lltis up a little, as isn't that the purpose of any vehicle in the military?

I hear you!!

As i look out my office window i can see at least a hundred of those green MILCOT's in the parking lot.  I hear they are only two wheel drive packages with no winter block heaters in them, smart right.  The G-Wagon is also sitting out there, but i don't know much about, but i do hear good things from some of the guys overseas.  There are the usual bitches about the G-Wagon, like any new kit, but mostly i hear good things don't know if that will hold but only time will tell.

As for the MICOT's jeez it's like the government went and bought year end stock from GM and then had them paint it drap green.  I don't know what will happen with those as i hear they are not to be deployed or used in the field but for domestic operations only.  Sounds like a government purchase alright.

As far as the LSVW being replaced by the HUMMER, recent events in IRAQ have shown the HUMMER can't live up to its reputation or boast (depending on who you talk to) But i don't see that as a very viable way to go. As we rarely buy equipment that the Americans do because that might make it cheaper and easier to get and fix and ........  breath breath.  Anyway the LSVW is and was a political decision the PC under Kim to have it replaced now would be expensive and would take away from more pressing matters SEA KINGS, HERCS and the list goes on.

 

[chrisf]

The reserves are getting the Milcot, which is a "militarized" chevy silverado.   Personally, I find it to be a giant hunk of crap....we can't take it off hardpack, which is useless to us out west.   I've heard many good things about the G-wagon that the regs have, based on use of the milcot, I would rather have the G-wagon, although I'm not quite sure I'm altogether ready to give up the Lltis.   It is far more vesitile than a full sized pickup, as it is it's a civy truck with a rifle rack in the middle. We aren't afraid to beat the Lltis up a little, as isn't that the purpose of any vehicle in the military?

I qualified on the milcot very recently, and I must say, it's a pleasure to drive... and though it's got many drawbacks... and I've withdrawn my earlier distaste for the vehicle... I still think it's ridiculous as a replacement for the iltis, and it would be ridiculous as a replacement for LSVW as well, but it's a reaonsably good vehicle for use in a utility role, primarily in support of domestic ops... if we ever get the winches for them, it'll be better still... snorkel kits would be nice too... but that would be nice for all vehicles...

On the subject of beating it up, according to our transport rep, as the body panels are substantially thicker then a normal truck, you can walk on them... as soon as I have a reasonable excuse to walk on one (I can't justify simply dancing on the hood in case he's wrong), I plan to walk on every inch of it just to find out. Beyond that, the paint is just cosmetic... if somone tells you you're not allowed to scratch it, well, that's a problem between you and them, not me.

I'm really not a fan of not being allowed to do maintence on it, and the fact that our mechanics aren't allowed to do maintence on them bothers me even more... for the purposes of exercises, fine, whatever, save the mechanics to work on the other vehicles, but if you're supporting domestic ops, you need to be able to fix your trucks...

We obviously still need a real replacement for the iltis, and the milcot isn't it, that being said, it does give us a much more durable (And unfortunately, much more expensive) vehicle to fill a niche usually filled by rental vehicles.

Now that I'm done being frightened by the iltis, I'm going to move on to being terrified that the rumor that they're replacing the MLVW with a cube van painted green...

 

[Love793]

Just to clarify.  The MILCOTS can be taken off road.  They are 4 WD (4H,4L,2H) with a Duramax 6600 generating 300+ HP.  Yes they are being maintained currently by dealerships (probably until the warrantee expires), at which time driver maint will probably start to be a larger issue.  You probably don't want to be beating the snot out the truck as a driver any how.  It's not intended to go places the Iltis/Jeep etc go.  It's a LOGISTIC/ADMIN veh, not a Recce veh, not a Baja Truck.  Common sence should apply.  If you crack up a Iltis, through carelessness you get hung.  What do you think will happen when you crack up a $80 000, brand new truck and void the warrantee?

As for the G Wagon, until I see one and get qualified on it I will reserve judgement.  However I have heard very little in the way of negative reports on them.

 

[chrisf]

Just to clarify.  The MILCOTS can be taken off road.  They are 4 WD (4H,4L,2H) with a Duramax 6600 generating 300+ HP.

Yes, it *can* *physically* be taken off road, but if you've got it stuck off road through a break down, the warranty is voided, and the dealer won't fix it.

 

[Love793]

Yes, it *can* *physically* be taken off road, but if you've got it stuck off road through a break down, the warranty is voided, and the dealer won't fix it.

Through neglect, or some other fault of the driver.  Again the vehicle is intented to drop supplies and pick up people, not follow tanks through a battle run.  If you as a driver are aware of the vehicles capabilities/ physical restrictions and don't try to out drive the truck you won't require recovery.  On the other hand if you try to cross a swamp.... I'd call that negligence and you should be held responsible.

 

[21trucker]

I recently took the course for the MILCOTS. This is what i took from the course;

The maint folks will be given computers to plug into the truck and check fault codes (yes, the same computer your local GM dealer does for the same). This will allow maint personnel to inform the dealer of the problem, and as well as check and make sure the repairs were done.

This same computer, is like a big brother. Say you were in an accident with a MILCOT, and the MP's had little to go by for whatever reason, they could plug same computer into the truck and find out how fast you were travelling, what actions you took just before the accident, etc. Kind of like a black box.

So if you think your going to get away with doing donuts in the mall parking lot in the middle of the night, in theory, they could track you down (day, time, speed, vehicles actions are all recorded in the vehicle computer). All they have to do is go to dispatch and find out who drove the vehicle on this day and this time. ( )

So drive responsibly and defensively, as we all should!!

 

[old medic]

hmm,

Milcots:

move people,
pick up supplies,
are four wheel drive
based on the chevy pickup truck (thus the acronym)
are issued to the reserves ...........

Sounds an awful lot lick they replaced the CUCV's