• Thanks for stopping by. Logging in to a registered account will remove all generic ads. Please reach out with any questions or concerns.

Hybrid Electric Vehicles

The title of this thread is "The Great Gun Control Debate 2.0". we've gone almost three pages yet taking about EVs. Not a single post about phased plasma rifles, rail guns or phasers all of which are still legal in Canada - for now. Focus, people!
 
There are undoubtedly numerous locations where the wiring has not been updated to allow for everyone on the system to install a high-speed charger which is going to be the requirement in 2035 and they don't have the financial resources to do so. Drive around your area, and if you see the old green transformers bolted to the poles you can bet that the service won't take the load. But that is just one of the problems. What does a person do who parks on the street or pays for a remote garage? Does the garage owner become responsible for upgrading the wiring system in the parking area? I doubt that most municipal parking areas, not to mention private ones, have no where near the capacity to install a charging unit for each spot and rewiring a concrete structure to handle the increased load is neither easy nor cheap. New conduit throughout to take the heavier cabling is just a start. Look at the cable for your stove or dryer and then try and picture the system required to run a dozen or more of them through a garage. It won't be only the municipalities that say no but everyone who is confronted with the bill for the change-over
One of the reasons some utilities started throttling feed-in tariff generation was the grid couldn't handle anymore without significant upgrades. Many of these are in residential and rural areas. The wires don't care which way the electrons move but a lot of the equipment, including safety elements, do. Most of the grid was designed and built to move power one way.

Local generation for older apartments and condos will be a huge issue. I would imagine any apartment or condo builder in that last couple of years is baking in capacity and/or conduit space to retrofit cabling. People in older neighbourhoods who rely on on-street parking will be pretty much screwed, and I can't see municipalities cutting in public EVSE stands or allowing cords over public property. For those who have space for front lawn parking pads there are more options, but cities have several restrictions on those, if for no other reason than storm water management.
 
Canada has the power grid of a model train set compared to what would be required to service EVs at 2035 level.

If they were going to upgrade the national grid to handle the draw of all those EVs they would have had to start, in earnest, 20 years ago. And it ain't going to happen using windmills and solar panels.

I truly think, that by 35, this whole EV thing as it is now will be in the rear view mirror. Too expensive, too cumbersome, too controversial.

And you still require huge amounts of fossil fuel to build them. Everything on an EV requires fossil fuel to produce.
 
Last edited:
The title of this thread is "The Great Gun Control Debate 2.0". we've gone almost three pages yet taking about EVs. Not a single post about phased plasma rifles, rail guns or phasers all of which are still legal in Canada - for now. Focus, people!
I guess this derail could all go over to the electric vehicle thread…
 
Was he looking at upgrading his panel? If not, this decision by the municipality makes no sense. His house is likely already permitted to use up to 200 amps. Whether he uses this to charge his Tesla, or run carpentry equipment and his hot tub, it shouldn't matter to the municipality. Just that the installation is done correctly.
Correct- he could get a permit to get a 200A panel.
 
The title of this thread is "The Great Gun Control Debate 2.0". we've gone almost three pages yet taking about EVs. Not a single post about phased plasma rifles, rail guns or phasers all of which are still legal in Canada - for now. Focus, people!

Phased plasma rifle in the 40-watt range.
 
Canada has the power grid of a model train set compared to what would be required to service EVs at 2035 level.

If they were going to upgrade the national grid to handle the draw of all those EVs they would have had to start, in earnest, 20 years ago. And it ain't going to happen using windmills and solar panels.

I truly think, that by 35, this whole EV thing as it is now will be in the rear view mirror. Too expensive, too cumbersome, too controversial.

And you still require huge amounts of fossil fuel to build them. Everything on an EV requires fossil fuel to produce.
I mostly agree. Under our system of public money mostly funding grid and large-scale generation development, there is no way they could have justified funding future capacity even if they were able to predict the future, which I'm not sure they could have. Even in systems such as the US which is largely or at least more privately funded, there is no way it was going to happen without guarantees of future profitability.

Assuming even marginal improvements in factors such as cold weather range and battery life/replacement cost are achieved, I honestly do think EVs will have significant inroads. The demographics of Canada are increasingly becoming urbanized so long-range performance is going to be less of an issue. So long as you can plug into a 120v outlet, many could get enough of a charge to satisfy their next day (such needs could also be addressed by transit but that's a whole 'nudder topic).

Will EVs replace every mode of transport, not a chance. People who make the 'end fossil fuels - now' argument miss the point that we need this economy to pay for the next one, and there is no way, given current technology, that batteries are going to replace heavy transport, rail, aviation and blue water shipping.
 
Canada has the power grid of a model train set compared to what would be required to service EVs at 2035 level.

If they were going to upgrade the national grid to handle the draw of all those EVs they would have had to start, in earnest, 20 years ago. And it ain't going to happen using windmills and solar panels.
There was a fantastic, but missed, opportunity in Eastern Canada to do so following the Ice Storm of 1998. The region of QC where I work, an Ice Storm affected area, is still prone to power failures due to moderate wind, light ice, heavy rain and fat squirrels.
And you still require huge amounts of fossil fuel to build them. Everything on an EV requires fossil fuel to produce.
But green Canada will only be assembling the batteries. The dirty, dangerous mining of raw materials will be out of sight of the average Canadian voter.
 
What are we going to do when, not if, an EV catches fire in the cramped confines of a parking garage below a high rise hotel. Jets of flame a meter long spewing from the car. Setting fire to the cars on either side. Already, apartment buildings are restricting access to ICE vehicles only in underground parking.
 
What are we going to do when, not if, an EV catches fire in the cramped confines of a parking garage below a high rise hotel. Jets of flame a meter long spewing from the car. Setting fire to the cars on either side. Already, apartment buildings are restricting access to ICE vehicles only in underground parking.

EVs catch far alot more frequently than other types of vehicles...

Researchers from insurance deal site Auto Insurance EZ compiled sales and accident data from the Bureau of Transportation Statistics and the National Transportation Safety Board. The site found that hybrid vehicles had the most fires per 100,000 sales at 3474.5. There were 1529.9 fires per 100k for gas vehicles and just 25.1 fires per 100k sales for electric vehicles.



And Fire Chiefs are worried...

Concerns are coming to light over how much water it takes to put out an electric vehicle (EV) fire. It comes as the federal government mandates all new vehicles to be electric by 2035.

“The technology of electric vehicles when they’re on fire is certainly changing faster than the fire service is keeping up with,” said Perth Fire Chief Bill Hunter, a firefighter educator.

Some fire services are sounding the alarm.

According to the International Association of Fire and Rescue Services, firefighters need to use up to 40 times more water to put out a fire in an EV compared to a standard gasoline car.

That’s about 40,000 gallons on average. Hunter said he’s heard reports that it has taken as much as 250,000 gallons of water to put out an EV fire, and that the vehicle can burn for days.

He said this is especially a concern for rural fire departments that don’t always have quick access to water to fight a fire.



And the insurance implications are interesting...

ICBC scraps 2022 electric car after owners faced with $60,000 bill to replace damaged battery​


Damage to the EV’s battery voided the vehicle’s warranty and the quoted $60,000 replacement was more than a new car was worth, so ICBC wrote off and scrapped the nearly new automobile.

 
You can't put one out. It's a runaway battery. You can only cool it till it completely burns up. As soon as you stop, it'll reignite unless it's under water in a cooling pool.
 
You also need to isolate damaged EV's, so storage yards are going to need more space.
Some use rented space in industrial areas, and some landlords have been reluctant to even allow the storage of EVs on property. I recall reading that one or two yards are located under the elevated Gardiner Expressway, which brings it's won potential problems.
 
Some use rented space in industrial areas, and some landlords have been reluctant to even allow the storage of EVs on property. I recall reading that one or two yards are located under the elevated Gardiner Expressway, which brings it's won potential problems.
Many in Sanctuary City want the Gardner gone, from what I hear. Perhaps they're playing the long game😁
 
This is insane. Selling the cars is one thing, delivering them another. Orders are already two years behind...

Final electric-vehicle mandate to come Tuesday, sales must double by 2026​


Canadian auto companies sold more electric vehicles this year than ever before, but would still need to nearly double that number within three years to meet a new national mandate.

On Tuesday, Environment Minister Steven Guilbeault is set to reveal the final rules under the Canadian Environmental Protection Act to establish Canada's first-ever nationally-regulated electric-vehicle mandate.

Guilbeault set the targets a year ago, requiring that by 2026, 20 per cent of passenger vehicles sold be zero-emission vehicles, or ZEVs.


Better get a bunch of mid-life and life-extension work done on my vehicles. They're about to become investment-grade assets.
 
Many in Sanctuary City want the Gardner gone, from what I hear. Perhaps they're playing the long game😁
The province recently announced that they are uploading both it and the DVP as provincial highways, so I imagine the game just got a lot longer.
 
There was a fantastic, but missed, opportunity in Eastern Canada to do so following the Ice Storm of 1998. The region of QC where I work, an Ice Storm affected area, is still prone to power failures due to moderate wind, light ice, heavy rain and fat squirrels.

And ongoing adherence to above-ground electric distribution…

But green Canada will only be assembling the batteries. The dirty, dangerous mining of raw materials will be out of sight of the average Canadian voter.

1703220647125.jpeg

You can't put one out. It's a runaway battery. You can only cool it till it completely burns up. As soon as you stop, it'll reignite unless it's under water in a cooling pool.
We have to have both a water-filled Tupperware container and Kevlar burn-bag even to deal with electronic flight books (tablets) on board aircraft…and that’s for a 5000-1500mAh battery…90kWh battery pack on an EV Is 15000x more energy than that…it ain’t going out until it’s done shorting out…
 
EVs catch far alot more frequently than other types of vehicles...

Researchers from insurance deal site Auto Insurance EZ compiled sales and accident data from the Bureau of Transportation Statistics and the National Transportation Safety Board. The site found that hybrid vehicles had the most fires per 100,000 sales at 3474.5. There were 1529.9 fires per 100k for gas vehicles and just 25.1 fires per 100k sales for electric vehicles.



And Fire Chiefs are worried...

Concerns are coming to light over how much water it takes to put out an electric vehicle (EV) fire. It comes as the federal government mandates all new vehicles to be electric by 2035.

“The technology of electric vehicles when they’re on fire is certainly changing faster than the fire service is keeping up with,” said Perth Fire Chief Bill Hunter, a firefighter educator.

Some fire services are sounding the alarm.

According to the International Association of Fire and Rescue Services, firefighters need to use up to 40 times more water to put out a fire in an EV compared to a standard gasoline car.

That’s about 40,000 gallons on average. Hunter said he’s heard reports that it has taken as much as 250,000 gallons of water to put out an EV fire, and that the vehicle can burn for days.

He said this is especially a concern for rural fire departments that don’t always have quick access to water to fight a fire.



And the insurance implications are interesting...

ICBC scraps 2022 electric car after owners faced with $60,000 bill to replace damaged battery​


Damage to the EV’s battery voided the vehicle’s warranty and the quoted $60,000 replacement was more than a new car was worth, so ICBC wrote off and scrapped the nearly new automobile.


ICE vehicles burn when they are being driven. It often starts with oil getting on hot exhaust components or electrical overload. Sometimes due to a collision. Very rarely do people get injured from the fire because they often have ample time to exit before the fire gets too bad.

AFAIK EV'S burn when charging. Typically when no one is around so the fire gets intense before its noticed. Often spreading to other vehicles or the garage they are parked in.

Cuba has much to teach us about keeping used vehicles on the road.
Those classic cars are just the bodies. They transplant modern diesel engines and transmissions, likely suspension and brakes also from Asian cars. We drove in one, a 52 chev if I remember that had a Kia diesel engine in it. The driver said they could never afford the gas the 52 engine would use.
 
Back
Top