Gaining British Citizenship

[Sh0rtbUs]

Well Im looking into applying for a Dual British/Canadian Citizenship right now, and am totally lost as to how i should go about it. I know theres a few guys with dual Citizenships here (not necessarily british), so any help would be extremely helpful. I'm in contact with a british recruiter for the RM, but his responses are very slow to get back to me, so I hoped there could be some helpful info i could get from here. I've done alot of searching through the net on the U.K Government's website, and although have come across several things on nationality acts and such, they havent really told me what Im looking for, or I just flat out didnt understand them.

 

[NavyGrunt]

What benefit is there to obtaing british citizen status? Your canadian status qualifies you for everything in Britain as Canada is part of the commonwealth......which recruiter are you talking to?

 

[Sh0rtbUs]

You need to have british Citizenship to join the british military, as far as I've seen. My name is still in que to be replied to, so i dont have a specific recruiter yet.

 

[NavyGrunt]

Good news bro. As a citizen of Canada you can join everything except the Marine Commandos(they have a 3 year residency requirement-even that can be waived under certain circumstances). Go to the british army website and look under nationality requirements.

 

[Sh0rtbUs]

Ironically, its the Royal marines that Im looking to apply for  ;D Many current marines have been saying that the waiver is easy to obtain, especially as a canadian citizen but the citizenship cant be avoided.

 

[NavyGrunt]

Goto the marine commando site and you'll see that applying as a canadian citi for the enlisted marine is acceptable ;D

 

[ZipperHead]

I took a quick look at the Brit website: http://www.army.mod.uk/careers/index.htm

Nationality
Applicants will be eligible if they are a bona fide resident of the United Kingdom or the Irish Republic and are one of the following:

A British citizen; a citizen of the British dependent territories; a British overseas citizen; a British subject under the British Nationality Act 1981; a citizen of an independent Commonwealth country; British Protected Person; Citizen of the Irish Republic.

Residence
In addition to the rules on nationality, whether or not you are of UK origin, you should normally have resided in the UK for a minimum of 5 years immediately prior to making an application. In certain circumstances, a shorter period of residency may be accepted. Your recruiter should be able to advise you when making an application if you are eligible for such an exemption. You should also be in possesion of a full passport from your country of origin showing your immigration status in the UK. All applicants must have the right of entry in to the UK.

You can have all the wishful thinking that you want, but I doubt you can bypass those items that I underlined. The special circumstances would probably be for someone who has served a few years in another military with training that the Brits want, and are underborne in.

I don't want to invoke the ire of people who have higher goals in life than I do, but becoming a RM (or FFL like some other young guy posted about a few days ago....) is pretty difficult, and I think that you would be better served by doing a few years in our Reg force, infantry, and then think about it. They would be more inclined to waive some of the requirements than if you come in "cold".

If you feel that our military isn't challenging enough, try doing some volunteer work, and do things like rifle team, pistol team, Cambrian Patrol team (if the unit does it), unit sports, train for Mountain Man, Iron Man, triathlon, a marathon, etc. I think that that will keep you busy and challenged. If those types of things sound too hard, then I think that perhaps these elite units that all the young bucks aspire to be in, aren't really for them either.

My 2 cents,

Al

 

[Sh0rtbUs]

It isnt necessarily that the CF isnt challenging enough for me. The more I've looked into the RM  the more it seems to be for me, and although I love the Canadian Army, I feel the RM would be that much enjoyable for me. the physical aspects arent so much a determining factor for me as Im currently in good shape, and can get that much better with some extra training, but its the opprotunities. I've spoken to many CF soldiers who have served overseas, and although it is overseas duty, Peacekeeping duty isnt all its cracked up to be. Simple enough, I didnt join the army to play baseball in Bosnia with buddies. I guess you could label me as just another young kid with "hot feet", but the options for more "intense" overseas duty are far more bountiful than here in Canada. On top of this, I've always found it difficult to see myself remaining in Canada, but cant see myself outside the military.

Currently, Im awaiting to hear from the recruiter on whether i can have the mandatory UK residence waived or at least bumped down.

 

[Pieman]

Currently, Im awaiting to hear from the recruiter on whether i can have the mandatory UK residence waived or at least bumped down. 

I have my application into the British forces as we speak. The residence requirement is not as bad as it is made out to be on the the application form from what I understand. The recruiters were saying to me it is not a problem at all. The catch is that at some point, they will invite you out there for interviews, tests, etc. This can take 6 months and they prefer you to stay in the UK during that time. I don't know why that is exactly, but I suspect it is part of getting a permit to work there, security clearance etc.

Don't sweat it, if you want to go, just get your hands on the application form and start the process.

 

[ZipperHead]

Simple enough, I didnt join the army to play baseball in Bosnia with buddies. I guess you could label me as just another young kid with "hot feet", but the options for more "intense" overseas duty are far more bountiful than here in Canada

I would hope that you have in fact played baseball with your buddies in Bosnia, as you have just insulted a lot of soldiers, here on this board, and elsewhere, that have in fact done much more than that overseas. Two guys I work with at the Armour school were taken hostage by "belligerents" in the early days of Bosnia, complete with pistol pointed at head. One of those guys fired ~80 rounds of co-ax at "belligerents". A few guys in  the Strathconas have been shot while on tour. How about the guys who have received Medals of Bravery for saving civilians, while under fire, in Bosnia? Heard of the Medak Pocket??? How about the operations that 3PPCLI BG conducted on Op Apollo? Not "intense" enough for you? Do you know what a Paper Tiger is???? Look in a mirror for the answer.....

I hope that you get accepted into the RM, and see what war is about. No doubt you'll wish that you never saw it. It isn't a game or a movie. There's a reason why most veterans don't talk about war. I hear George Bush is hiring.... maybe you should look south....

Al

 

[1feral1]

I have dual nationality in Canada and Australia. Hard work though, but earned it after two years, and with the ADF one has to apply for Aussie citizenship withih 90 days of being elegible or one is discharged.

So, I served over two years as a foreigner in the Australian Army before gaining my citizenship in May 1997. These regs may have changed, but if so, only recently.

For anyone who choses this carreer path, its no cakewalk. In reality throw away the romantic BS and all that goes with those notions, as its a total life change with MUCH sacrifice, and teaches you a whole new meaning to the word 'independant'.

The Army to me is more than a job, its a culture and a way of life, and things yet similar to Canada in some ways, the rest is the most unusual and freaky things one can imagine.

However, I often wonder why I do this stuff, and have contemplated release every so often. I think I am in for the long haul   :warstory:

'Talking the talk' is one thing, but 'walking the walk' is another, for those who go thru with it, good on ya's for having the intestinal fortitude to do it.

Best of luck in your future endeavours,

Wes

 

[Sh0rtbUs]

Allan, i didnt speak to offend, I simply spoke a truth. Im well aware that many Canadian soldiers have done what you've mentioned, and Im speaking from what I've been told first hand from SEVERAL members of my unit who recently returned from Bosnia. Sure there are the extraordinary incidents, but for the most part the vast majority of the CF have never had a round fired in their direction. I can talk the talk, but I at least want the opprotunity to walk the walk. And i highly doubt I'd be classified as a war mongerer.

Wesley, what made you choose to join the Australian Army? And you hit an important point, the prospect of moving to another continent really appeals to me, especially when Im doing it alone. lifes too short to sit back and wait for opprotunities, I just want to head them off on my own time.

 

[ZipperHead]

Well, rather than listen to guys who have done SFA on tour, do something about it and join the REAL army and do something. Most Reservists that I have seen go on tour aren't exactly at the pointy end. The guys that I work with HAVE done these things, and if you consider them (these things) exceptional, how many RM's do you know? For real, not the sniper-ninja-JTF types that you meet on forums like this. I'm sure some of them have spent a good part of their career doing less than what some of the members of the CF have done. It's all time and place. Some guys go a whole career without doing squat, and others get plenty in within 3 or 6 years. Perhaps too much.

Ask yourself what is more important, serving your country and the people, who, through their tax dollars, have paid for your education, medical bills, roadways, utilities, or going to another country to fight for them, and their ways and ideals. Sounds like a mercenary attitude to me. Talk to a few WW II vets (before they pass away, and it's too late) and see what they have to say about your ideas. Those that have seen the "elephant" will probably set you on the straight and narrow. Better yet, travel down to the States and visit a VA hospital that has some patients from the US foray into Iraq, and see for yourself what intense is all about. The military is a way of life, and sometimes an adventure, but to throw it away on a romantic notion (which governments and recruiters love to sell) is bollocks. If you want adventure, do the Eco-challenge. If you want to get shot at (which most soldiers never want to happen, BTW) go steal some apples from a farmer's tree.

You're young, and full of piss and vinegar, no doubt, but realize that there is more to military service than what you see in movies. Cleaning a shitter in England is the same as cleaning one in Canada. And from my limited experiences with the Brit army, forget about our huggy kissy ways if you go over there. They are starting to become more "modern" (if that's what you want to call it), but it can be a shock for someone used to our ways.

Anyway, you'll end up doing what you want, but try to get as much info as you can.

Al

 

[Sh0rtbUs]

By huggy kissy ways what do you mean? I joined the CF semi-based on the "romantic" side of it. I have planned on switching components when I graduated, but lately I've been placed with the dilemma of CF Regular, or the Royal Marines. As far as "defending the country, way of life..etc.". Those WERE the romantic views on which I joined.

 

[1feral1]

I left for greener pastures, and I believe I am more of a success in Australia than I ever could be in Canada, in every sense of the word, and its worked for me. I guess I won the lotto. Others are not so lucky.

I,  however will never forget my dearly loved country of Canada, and the CF, as without them, I would not be where I am today.

Choose wisely, as once committed there is no turning back. Stick with a army of the ABC countries (Australia Britain Canada), as I believe these are the best fighting forces in the world.

I am rewarded with many things ranging from working with our own AMF's, to knowing I have personally made a difference with regional military forces such as the East Timorese, and soldiers from  Papua New Guinea.  Assisting them in their trg, and other things makes it all worthwhile to me. Call it helping your neighbours, if I may. 110% job satisfaction!

Now, am I prepared to deploy and fight for my adopted home of Australia? Yes, this country has welcomed me with opened arms, to which I have never felt so warm and welcomed. Sounds silly, but its true.

One regret. I should have come here at 21 yrs old, not 35.

Again, its worked for me, and what I have done might not be for everyone. So, as I sit and type these words out here in Regina, Saskatchewan, this am, and enjoy some stiff rums with family and friends, its truly good to be back, and I will enjoy my time here in the Land of the Maple Leaf, as I know what I have left behind, and I appreciate this great country of Canada even more, but come 3 wks time I will return to Australia, carrying on where I left off.

So what am I spewing on about? Mate, do what ya gotta do, but crikey, never EVER forget where you come from. Although I view Australia as my home, its Canada where my heritage and origins come from, andd that no matter where I am, or what I am doing, I never forget.


Cheers,

Wes

 

[Spr.Earl]

Wes,good word's and advice.
I salute you

 

[NavyGrunt]

Hey Alan. Canada is an independant commonwealth country. I dont know why you underlined that. I talked to a RM recruiter and they had no problem with me applying from Canada, we arent a security concern. And I understand completely what your saying but if the guy wants to give 'er a go I dont see why its a huge deal. He's not revoking his citizenship and he's swearing an oath to the same queen.

 

[NavyGrunt]

Hi, thank you for the email



To apply for service in the British Army from overseas you need to send an email with your full name, address, date and place of birth to aa.overseasrecruiting@recruitinggroup.mod.uk This will place you on the overseas application list.  Each name is dealt with in order, an application letter will go out to you in the normal post.  This will get to you within 3 months of your initial email.  Due to the sheer number of people applying from overseas no reply will be given to your email.

To apply you must have a sponsor who is a permanent resident in the UK who will be ready to support your application. This can be a relative or a friend.

^^^^^^^

This is different than when I talked to them last year but this is the response I got from the recruiter today.

 

[ZipperHead]

Applicants will be eligible if they are a bona fide resident of the United Kingdom or the Irish Republic and are one of the following

Notice where it says you must be a "bona fide resident ..... AND are one of the following". It seems that you still have to become a resident (I'm not sure if you can become an "instant" resident for purposes of enrolling). I suspect that it will still involve a goodly amount of time. And don't forget about the sponsor, though I think for the military they may allow it to be a member of the unit you are trying to join (ie. officer or Sr NCO).

By "huggy kissy" ways I mean our culture of fear in the CF of offending somebody by saying something that somebody, somewhere may find offensive. For example, if you question somebodies fitness level or  "shape", you run the risk of them being offended, and a harassment investigation is sure to follow. It seems that "soldiers" learn more about their rights (but not neccesarily their responsibilities) and how to write memo's and redresses before they learn how to be a soldier (you know, the whole weapons handling, shooting, fieldcraft thing). I love having a Private or Corporal inform me that I can't make them do something, because they know their rights. Try that in the British army. So if that is your experience in the CF so far, I would recommend binning that mentality before you become a RM.

Far from trying to dissuade you from persuing something like this, I am showing you that the reality is usually quite different from what you may be expecting. If you are put off by our recruiting process (delays, runaround) I don't think that it will be much different attempting to join another nation's forces, especially when/if you have to travel over there for your interview/screening/selection/etc. 

Have a good one, but make sure you go in armed with all the info that you can, so that there aren't any unpleasant surprises once you cross the point of no return.

Al

 

[NavyGrunt]

Hey Alan look to that email I got. You need a sponser. the residency thing isnt a strict requirement for Canadians......who were born in Canada. just need a sponser.