Enhanced Reliability Check (ERC) - Merged

[majidsabra]

I am 19 years old, born march 10 1987 and have been in Canada for 11 years from 1993 to 2002(9 years) and from 2004 until now .

2002 and 2003 were spent in Dubai(U.A.E).  I had to go there because my mother had a good job oppurtunity and i was 14 at the time so i did not have a choice. . If i understand correctly from mccharts post, if one turned  18 in Canada i am not obliged to undergo the Pre Sec?

Thanks in advance.

 

[kincanucks]

2002 and 2003 were spent in Dubai(U.A.E).

Here I go repeating myself again.  Part of the eligibility requirements to join the CF is the Enhanced Reliability Check (ERC) and that goes back five years.  If you have not lived in Canada for the last five years then there may be a requirement to do out of country checks and this requires the taking of your fingerprints and sending them to the RCMP who will then attempt to contact authorities in Dubai to carry out checks there.  That in itself can take a very long time.

If i understand correctly from mccharts post, if one turned  18 in Canada i am not obliged to undergo the Pre Sec?

If you are a Canadian citizen and if you have lived in Canada for ten-year continuous period immediately prior to applying or you have lived in Canada since you were 16, whichever comes first then you will not require a pre-sec, unless you come from a scheduled country or have immediate relatives living in a scheduled country.  Follow the directions given by your CFRC/D.

 

[Towards_the_gap]

Pre-assessment and security clearance procedures are separate from each other.  Pre-assessment (which you are under going) is required to determine if you are going to be a security risk to Canada based on the fact you were outside the country for more than six months.  This pre-assessment will be conducted regardless if you are going NCM or Officer Reg F or Res F.  The security clearance procedures will be carried out after you are enrolled.

Where does the Enhanced Reliability Check come into play? The CFRC I'm going through says they need to wait for this to come back (at least a year) before they can even start the Pre-Assessment? But according to what you've wrote above they're doing it backwards.

Also, will spending the last 5 years in a NATO/Commonwealth military speed up the process? Or will they not take the MOD's word for it that I was where I said I was on the forms?

thanks in advance!

 

[kitrad1]

The ERC ( known as the CRNC - Criminal Record Name Check Credit Check), must be completed before the CFRC can sub,it the pre-security assessment. In the interim, you should be completing (or have already completed) the requisite form.

 

[kincanucks]

In addition, there is a requirement for out of country checks which must be completed prior to the ERC being approved.  ERCs only come back in two to three business days if you have spent the last five years in Canada.

 

[Towards_the_gap]

and it's these out-of-country checks, along with the ERC (taking into account I've lived in the UK for the past 5 years), which will add up to the 1 year minimum wait until further steps to enrol the CFRC quoted me? I'm just checking to make sure it is indeed 1 year min......not that I'm jumping for joy about it but such is life....and yeah I've completed both the pre-sec and ERC

 

[kincanucks]

Yes the out of country checks do take considerable time because of the need for the RCMP to go to the authorities of your previous country of residence to have a criminal check done on you.  The only thing going in your favour is that it may be faster given you are from a commonwealth country so it might not take a year.

 

[Towards_the_gap]

thanks for the advice! I'm keeping my fingers crossed it won't take a year.

the really frustrating thing is... I could go to any constabulary in the UK, and get a UK criminal records check done myself within a week. Granted it may not be the same as the RCMP doing it but it is still official, and covers all of the great britain and northern ireland.

 

[kincanucks]

thanks for the advice! I'm keeping my fingers crossed it won't take a year.

the really frustrating thing is... I could go to any constabulary in the UK, and get a UK criminal records check done myself within a week. Granted it may not be the same as the RCMP doing it but it is still official, and covers all of the great britain and northern ireland.

Perhaps you should do that as it may help your situation.

Note to all Canadian citizens who have lived in other countries in the last five years prior to applying to the CF.  Get a criminal and credit check done in that country before you leave.  For the USA that includes a FBI check.  As long as the checks are done officially and recently a CO/Det Comd may use them to make a quicker decision on your reliability.

 

[Springroll]

Unless you were there due to a NATO posting of a family member or spouse.
Then the extras are not required. You will do the regular security check.

 

[kincanucks]

Unless you were there due to a NATO posting of a family member or spouse.
Then the extras are not required. You will do the regular security check.

While you may have escaped doing this, perhaps because Halifax was being nice to you or that you had been back in Canada for a couple of years when the check was done, I can assured you that family members of service members on NATO postings don't get a free pass because of that posting.  Family members have been known to commit crimes and get bad credit while in other countries.

DA

 

[Springroll]

While you may have escaped doing this, perhaps because Halifax was being nice to you or that you had been back in Canada for a couple of years when the check was done, I can assured you that family members of service members on NATO postings don't get a free pass because of that posting.  Family members have been known to commit crimes and get bad credit while in other countries.

DA

I am not sure why they would be just being nice to me when they have rules to follow. At the time when my application went in, we had only been back in Canada for just 11 months. It did take them 6 days to get back to me and let me know that the additional paperwork would not be necessary because we had been NATO posted.  It may have helped that I had to have a criminal record check done down there for my line of work, and I did present them with this information, but they did not want it and did not make copies. According to them, since it was a NATO posting, the extra paper work was not needed for me to enrol. We had resided in the US for 3 years.

I do agree that there have probably been some incidences where families have been in trouble with the law.
I did not encounter any while I was down there, but it wouldn't surprise me if there had been issues before and after we left.

 

[kincanucks]

I am not sure why they would be just being nice to me when they have rules to follow. At the time when my application went in, we had only been back in Canada for just 11 months. It did take them 6 days to get back to me and let me know that the additional paperwork would not be necessary because we had been NATO posted.  It may have helped that I had to have a criminal record check done down there for my line of work, and I did present them with this information, but they did not want it and did not make copies. According to them, since it was a NATO posting, the extra paper work was not needed for me to enrol. We had resided in the US for 3 years.

I do agree that there have probably been some incidences where families have been in trouble with the law.
I did not encounter any while I was down there, but it wouldn't surprise me if there had been issues before and after we left.

Well I have thoroughly checked the books for any reference to dependants not being required to provide the information so I don't know what Halifax was using as a reference but c'est la vie.  I only want to caution you on making blanket statements such as:

Unless you were there due to a NATO posting of a family member or spouse.
Then the extras are not required. You will do the regular security check.

Just because it happen to you it may not apply to others and each applicant's experiences at a CFRC/D, unfortunately, can be different.  Cheers.

 

[chupracabra]

I had to do an enhance security check as I was in Japan for over a certain period in the last ten years. Who the hell are CSIS going to talk to? Do they even have Japanese speaking agents? The only reson I ask is that they seem so utterly incompetent I can't see them doing any check that will amount to any good. Remember the incident when a CSIS computer was stolen from a car and had thousands of people's private info on hard drive? It seems a little overboard to me, just my opinion. If we are so concerned about security, why is it we are letting in thousands of Lebanese flood into the country due to the recent conflict? Just a classic case of targeting the wrong people! You want to put your life on the line for your country - then wait up to 5 years of jumping through hoops and nonsense, but if you were seriously considering coming to the country to blow something up, shit, come on in!

 

[AmmoTech90]

I had to do an enhance security check as I was in Japan for over a certain period in the last ten years. Who the hell are CSIS going to talk to? Do they even have Japanese speaking agents? The only reson I ask is that they seem so utterly incompetent I can't see them doing any check that will amount to any good. Remember the incident when a CSIS computer was stolen from a car and had thousands of people's private info on hard drive? It seems a little overboard to me, just my opinion. If we are so concerned about security, why is it we are letting in thousands of Lebanese flood into the country due to the recent conflict? Just a classic case of targeting the wrong people! You want to put your life on the line for your country - then wait up to 5 years of jumping through hoops and nonsense, but if you were seriously considering coming to the country to blow something up, crap, come on in!

Why were you there?  Last ten years falls into a time when the JRA was still slightly active... http://library.nps.navy.mil/home/tgp/jra.htm
Should CSIS take your word for it that you aren't involved with them?

As BBJ said, suck it up.

 

[IrishCanuck]

I had to do an enhance security check as I was in Japan for over a certain period in the last ten years. Who the hell are CSIS going to talk to? Do they even have Japanese speaking agents? The only reson I ask is that they seem so utterly incompetent I can't see them doing any check that will amount to any good. Remember the incident when a CSIS computer was stolen from a car and had thousands of people's private info on hard drive? It seems a little overboard to me, just my opinion. If we are so concerned about security, why is it we are letting in thousands of Lebanese flood into the country due to the recent conflict? Just a classic case of targeting the wrong people! You want to put your life on the line for your country - then wait up to 5 years of jumping through hoops and nonsense, but if you were seriously considering coming to the country to blow something up, crap, come on in!

Rage on. I bet flaming the people you want to work faster by calling them "incompetent" works real well for you. The "efficiency" of CSIS has nothing to do with what you may or may not have done in Japan.

So stop crying and be patient if you really want to "put your life on the line for your country". Canada doesn't need raging meatshields, it needs mature , intelligent professionals in its Armed Forces.

Classy.

 

[Remius]

I had to do an enhance security check as I was in Japan for over a certain period in the last ten years. Who the hell are CSIS going to talk to? Do they even have Japanese speaking agents? The only reson I ask is that they seem so utterly incompetent I can't see them doing any check that will amount to any good. Remember the incident when a CSIS computer was stolen from a car and had thousands of people's private info on hard drive? It seems a little overboard to me, just my opinion. If we are so concerned about security, why is it we are letting in thousands of Lebanese flood into the country due to the recent conflict? Just a classic case of targeting the wrong people! You want to put your life on the line for your country - then wait up to 5 years of jumping through hoops and nonsense, but if you were seriously considering coming to the country to blow something up, crap, come on in!

CSIS will be talking to whoever they are supposed to.  And yes as a matter of fact they do have Japanese speaking agents.  Also some of the authorities in Japan can speak english.

I realise that you are frustrated but it is a matter of patience.  The appropriate authorities will do whatever backround check is necessary.  It might seem stupid but there are a variety of things that need to be checked.  Criminal activity is one of them.  Let's say you broke the law in Japan.  And you hightail it back to Canada.  It could have been a minor infraction, whatever.  Next thing you know, you're being deployed to a country where you may or may not be wanted for a crime.  Good one.  Now you've created a whole mess the CF didn't want to have to deal with in the 1st place.  These background checks aren't just for rooting out terrorists or criminals, but also to avoid administrative burdens.

Everyone is a case by case basis.  The system isn't perfect but hopefully some of the Ombudsman's recommendations about security cleareance will be implemented.

I sympathise with your dilema but I don't think you're thinking straight on this one.

 

[GO!!!]

Chalupa,

I personally find it pretty amusing that the federal departments you hold in such disdain are the same ones you are applying to work at.

It must be absolutely infuriating to have to beg for years for a job from such incompetents.

You already seem to know everything - what could the CF possibly teach you?

 

[Sig_Des]

It is public record on how badly the CSIS conducts its affairs, I was merely echoing that opinion, which I feel is true. I am not applying to work for CSIS as you say, I am applying to the Cf, not the same thing the last time I checked.

Both Federal Agencies which serve in the best interest of Canada's National Security and Defence? Besides, you don't know what kind of a good track record CSIS has as opposed to any "badly conducted affairs". 17 potential terrorists in Toronto...Think the sneaky squirrels may have had a hand in that? Please don't criticise an agency when you don't have any first-hand knowledge of the complete picture. We get that enough of the military, and I can empathize with CSIS

Anyone who has gone through it knows it is insanely long, invasive and sometimes insulting

I went through it...took a damned long time, nearly almost 2 years. Most of the problems in the recruiting process were administrative, and they are being addressed. As far as invasive or insulting, I never thought so. When we are researching wether people are fit to be defending this country, while giving them access to protected information, equipment and weapons, I say be as thorough as possible.

If you think it's too long, talk to some of the guys who waited 2+ years, kept at it, and are very satisfied with their military careers. Those who really want to be in the military, will wait it out. IF you see problems with the recruiting process, try posting some solutions for debate. Maybe someone who's in a position to bring it up will see it.

 

[GO!!!]

Chimichanga,

As Sig_Des said, what makes you think that you are entitled to serve in the CF?

You hold yourself in evidently high esteem to believe that you should be permitted to waltz into a country in which you have not lived for a decade, avail yourself of hundreds of thousands of dollars in pay, training and equipment, and then be entrusted with the leadership of others without a detailed inspection of your aptitude, character, claims of education, fitness and trustworthiness?

The CF would be remiss in hiring people without a thorough investigation, especially considering the damage that one idiot can have in a theatre or mission of high profile.

Finally, have you considered that you may be a poor applicant? That your education, reliability and aptitude have been measured against other applicants and found to be lacking? The way the CF makes offers of employment is that it makes them to the best applicants first. Since you've been waiting what, four years now, maybe you should consider the possibility that you are out of your depth in applying for a job with the CF.

Keep up that positive attitude though!