Dion vows snap vote on Afghan deployment

[GAP]

Dion vows snap vote on Afghan deployment
Pushes issue for Quebec by-elections
CAMPBELL CLARK  August 31, 2007
Article Link

ST. JOHN'S -- The Liberals will force an early vote on the Canadian mission in Afghanistan this fall in a bid to set Prime Minister Stephen Harper on the defensive over the issue.

Liberal Leader Stéphane Dion said his party will use its first opposition day in the fall session to put forward a motion for Canada to notify its allies that it will withdraw from Kandahar in February, 2009.

Although Mr. Harper has said Parliament will vote on whether to extend Canada's military mission past that date, he has not said when. The Liberals hope to force the Conservatives to take a stand as soon as next month.

"The Prime Minister is wasting time, shilly-shallying, and I know why - because he wants to stay longer than February, 2009," Mr. Dion told reporters after a meeting of his caucus in St. John's to plot the party's fall strategy.
More on link

 

[a_majoor]

I hope Mr Harper publicly reminds Mr Dion that he was a sitting cabinet minister in the Chrétien government, which committed Canada to combat in Kahdahar and to work with ISAF in Afghanistan until 2011, and was still a cabinet minister during the Martin government when our mission was changed from Kabul back to Kandahar.

If he found no grounds to object then; why should he object to the very same mission he approved now? If he did object, why did he not do the honourable thing and resign his cabinet post or even his seat in protest?

In fact, why not write Mr Dion and let him explain himself?

Email Address
Dion.S@parl.gc.ca

Mailing Address - Parliament Hill
Stéphane Dion, M.P.
Leader of the Opposition
House of Commons
Ottawa, ON
Canada
K1A 0A6

Phone Number
(613) 996-5789

Fax Number
(613) 996-6562

Mailing Address - Constituency Office
Stéphane Dion, M.P.
Leader of the Liberal Party
750 Marcel Laurin Boulevard, Suite 440
Saint-Laurent, Quebec
Canada
H4M 2M4

Phone Number
(514) 335-6655

Fax Number
(514) 335-2712

 

[Genetk44]

Dion...this guy is a true politici....uuuggghhh weasel...ooops sorry I've just insulted the weasels .....but he really makes me want to puke

 

[McG]

The Liberals will force an early vote on the Canadian mission in Afghanistan this fall in a bid to set Prime Minister Stephen Harper on the defensive over the issue.

I think the PM should take the offense with this one.  He should be pulling out the arguments listed by a_majoor, and then he should press it farther to remind the nation that turning our back on the Afghan people would be hypocritical of a nation that self-indulges in a vision of itself as a peacekeeper.

 

[Zell_Dietrich]

We all saw this coming.  Unfortunately this current government is ... lacking in its ability to properly convey the proper messages it has on Afghanistan in the mass media.  Out of a 40 minute speech,  the 30 second sound byte that implies "support us, support this war or you are a traitor" is used and repeated over and over on the nightly news. True complex subjects don't lend themselves readily to the age of soundbyte politics and that those arguing the necessity of putting/keeping soldiers in danger have the burdon of proof - which is as it should be - but still,  the right message can get out.

Maybe the new minister of defence will do a better job of getting the message out - reasons we went in, reasons we're staying and what needs to be done and why.  I've lost count of the number of people I've turned into supporters of the mission who've said that they only really opposed it because they didn't know anything about it except that Canadians were getting hurt and our leaders were appearing to be a Mini - Me to George Bush. 

I've said it before,  I'll say it again.  Let the Grits call an election on this issue.  If it is the major election issue,  there will be detailed documentaries and many discussions on it - that is what this mission needs to keep the majority support.

Add to that there are some Liberals, very high up, who support the Afghan mission with a steadfast conviction... It would be very bad for the Liberals.

 

[Rifleman62]

Winnipeg Free Press Editorial - Wed Aug 29 2007

Call the Bluff

LIBERAL leader Stéphane Dion this week threatened yet again to bring down the government and to force Canadians to the polls. Parliament resumes on Sept. 17. Prime Minister Stephen Harper's Conservative government is expected to announce a throne speech for sometime in October. Mr. Dion warns that if that throne speech does not meet Liberal demands on global warming and announce surrender in Afghanistan without so much as debate on the issue in Parliament, he will attempt to defeat it. That is entirely possible. Unless, of course, Mr. Dion is bluffing.
He has bluffed before, but it becomes an increasingly difficult posture to maintain, and this time he is specific about what Mr. Harper must do to maintain Liberal support. If the Conservatives do not bow to an opposition bill to reduce greenhouse gases by meeting the deadlines set in the Kyoto Accord, "we will not be able to support it and look Canadians in the eye," he said on Monday, although such a commitment is, in any practical way, impossible to meet.

He has previously demanded that the government commit to a firm date for withdrawal of combat troops from Afghanistan by 2009, although most Canadians understand that such a commitment is an invitation to Taliban and al-Qaida terrorists to increase their attacks on a wavering Canadian military presence and undermines NATO forces there.

Mr. Harper should be prepared to call the opposition's bluff -- if bluff it is -- by delivering in October a strong throne speech that clearly sets out the Conservative party's course for the country, including a realistic plan to deal with greenhouse gas emissions and an honourable course for the nation to navigate its way through the Afghan war.

Polls indicate that Mr. Dion's two major issues are much on the public mind, but he may have misread that mind on both fronts. The environment is a luxury issue on which Canadians have shown time and again that they will talk a better game than they are willing to pay for. Mr. Harper should set some rules that this country can afford. And Canadians are ambivalent about Afghanistan, if recent surveys can be believed, devastated by the casualties incurred but proud of the role their soldiers are playing.

People hardly ever want elections, but 20 months into this minority government's mandate, perhaps the country deserves one.

 

[GAP]

As the last election showed, Canadians function quite well in a winter election.

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

Two words for M. Dion.....BRING IT

 

[STONEY]

Maybe someone should be looking at this not from a political (which we all agree is garbage) viewpoint but from a purely military viewpoint. How long can the Army realistialy sustain its present commitment. How many, who have already did a tour would readily go back again. How many more Reserves will there be available to argument the Reg's to sustain the mission.  How many warm bodies are available beyond 2009 or will we be sent on repeat deployments & will their families put up with it ,without putting pressure on politicions. 

Cheers

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

How many, who have already did a tour would readily go back again.

With that statement it sounds like you are doubting the willingness of the Canadian soldier to be deployed where ordered or needed.

Stoney how many personnel that have served in Afghanistan have you spoken to? With the exception of 2, all that I have spoken to would go back in a heart beat.

 

[aesop081]

How many, who have already did a tour would readily go back again.

As it stands, many have already done multiple tours there and will continue to do so

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

During previous conflicts many were away for 4 or more years....6 months every 3 years or so is not that bad given the deprivations of previous generations.

 

[Flip]

During previous conflicts many were away for 4 or more years....6 months every 3 years or so is not that bad given the deprivations of previous generations.

Sadly, we are not made of the same stuff as previous generations.

( to be clear, I mean Canadian society at large-not you guys in green)

 

[starboard]

Dion is nothing but a two faced power seeking Quisling maggot.

 

[Franko]

How many, who have already did a tour would readily go back again.

I know I'm going again and was willing to go when my buddies were repatriated. I also know of a few that have been there 3 times and are willing to go again. Do you actually know anyone that has gone?

Methinks not.

How many warm bodies are available beyond 2009 or will we be sent on repeat deployments & will their families put up with it ,without putting pressure on politicions. 

Mind not calling troops bodies? It's a little thing called respect...and you are wearing thin right now with little quips like that.

As for families, they'll keep doing what they've been doing. An outstanding job supporting their loved ones deployed.

Regards

 

[Greymatters]

During previous conflicts many were away for 4 or more years... 

Nowadays called an 'embassy posting'. 

While most soldiers will go back in a heartbeat for another tour, I believe the number of volunteers would drastically fall if you told them it would be for 4 years. 

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

Nowadays called an 'embassy posting'. 

While most soldiers will go back in a heartbeat for another tour, I believe the number of volunteers would drastically fall if you told them it would be for 4 years. 

Well of course they never told them that in previous wars either. there used to be a slogan in the First World War..."home by Christmas" (the troops meant 1914) but that was a pipe dream. I think the second was similar in that there wasn't a thought that they would be away as long as they were. i think the Korean War they rotated them on a yearly basis but I'm being lazy and not backing that up with a little research. the six month roots are a relatively modern invention...I think we discussed this in a previous thread and it was determined that the UN tours were set at 6 months back in the early sixties.
I think there are a lot of US units doing year long tours right now.

 

[Greymatters]

Up til 2001, the US guys I worked with were doing 6-9 months depending on what branch of the military they came from, which got extended to 9-12 months after Sep01 due to a lack of replacements (who had been diverted to Afghanistan at the time).  I believe previous US tours were a year long (back in the 1970's) so maybe they are just going back to the old standard?

 

[PhilB]

I am a reservist, I volunteered to go in 06, I have since volunteered to go on 1-08, and I would go again. It has nothing to do with "warm bodies" volunteers etc. It is the right thing to do.

 

[a_majoor]

If there is a snap vote, the results will be priceless:

http://www.bloggingtories.ca/btFrameset.php?URL=http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/DrRoysThoughts/~3/152560298/can-dion-be-trusted.html&TITLE=Can%20dion%20be%20trusted?

Click on the link for a great political cartoon!