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Combat Engineers

Towards_the_gap said:
Still to collect my thoughts and post hints for any other transferees, will get to it one day!!!
CHIMO!


Well, today is that day. This will take a while, as I want to cover all the bases on my experiences so far as a British Army - CF Transferee, so that others know what they are in for. I'll also break it down into stages so that it's not one huge super-paragraph:

Recruiting Process

Relatively straightforward. The CFRC I dealt with initially didn't know quite what to make of it, as it's not such a normal occurrence to have a serving British soldier waltz in and ask about transferring, however, once they ascertained I was in fact Canadian I was simply treated as a rejoin. The PLAR process did not take very long, in fact the most worrying wait was to be for my Pre-Sec, however in the midst of my application I was informed that individuals who have lived in either the US or UK need only to supply a criminal record check (done within the last 12 months) and then will not need a Pre-Sec.

I was then sworn in as an AL/Cpl on the Thurs and given an ETP message for Pet to report the following sunday night.

Arriving at new unit

First impression was that everything was newer and shinier, however 2 CER does occupy a pretty new and well maintained building. The in clearance process was 'relatively' painless, I say relatively for there were issues with my initial pay and benefits administration that are only being resolved now. However those were the fault of the CFRC not my unit. I was kitted out with an initial issue of combats and head dress so I could look the part, and then given my full scale of issue on the Wednesday. As this was the Wednesday of the last week before Xmas leave, most people were quite surprised that I was able to get so much done, it being the silly season and all, so BZ to the sup techs in the Pet Clothing Store.

First few months

The first few weeks were spent settling in, more specifically finding a home for myself and my wife who crazily followed me from the UK. The IRP process is great. Compared with the British Army, where you are given sometimes as little as 2 weeks notice to move on posting, then given around $1400 in moving allowance and told to 'crack-on', the whole process, although daunting, made life so much easier. At work, it was a case of settling in, getting to know everyone, and I was lucky to be allowed to stay back from the Texas exercise in order to finish renovations on our newly purchased house. I also started getting acquainted with the different bits of kit, in particular the C7. I found the entire regiment extremely welcoming, and VERY similar in attitude, outlook, and humour to what I was used to.

I also began the process of having other quals, that weren't looked at in the initial PLAR process, recognised. An example of this is my British Army 'driving license' recognised and swapped for a 404's. Whilst a direct swap isn't possible, I only have to do DDC & Safe Backing, then I can receive my 404's, and get familiarised on all vehicles similar to those that I drove in the British Army. This saves me the annoyance of having to relearn, on a driver wheel course, how to change a flat tire.


Conclusion

Best da*n choice I ever made. If any other British soldier are reading this and considering it, I would recommend the following:
-Get copies of absolutely everything in your p-file. If necessary get in touch with Glasgow or your RCMO to get this. Also make sure your FMT 600 is up to date.

-If possible, get in touch, possibly through these means, with the regiment/branch you wish to transfer to. Unless you are being recruited/file managed by someone from that same background as you, they may not necessarily know what you are capable of. For example, how would an Air Force Cpl RMS Clerk know what I meant when I said I was a B2 Combat Engineer and A2 Engineering Surveyor.

-Be prepared to drop a rank, if only for the fact that some qualifications, particularly leadership, are not covered in the initial process. They may just hire you as qualified in your trade, not necessarily your rank. If you do drop a rank, take it on the chin and consider it a break from the responsibility you were used to, in order to give you time to settle in and learn the subtle differences in the two armies.


Pros's
-Better pay
-Better food (the first week at pet I ate at Normandy court and was in heaven. The British Army are not called sh*teaters for nothing)
-Better terms of service
-WAAAAY More support for families than you would get in the UK
-WAAAAY more support from the public in general. I never once got thanked in the UK for being a 'squaddie', hence it embarasses the hell out of me when it happens here.
-Better benefits, in particular the health care (both OHIP and PSHCP).
-Better kit. Yes some of it doesn't float my boat, but I got issued more socks on my enrollment than I would've got in 5 years British Army service. And that 'Clothing Online' is a great idea too. Never seen the likes of it in the UK. I was also issued a number of things I had already had to buy as a British soldier.

Cons

.....................

*Mods please feel free to move this to a whole new thread if it takes up too much space.
 
Hey there TTG, glad that you and the Mrs are settling in so well.
Umm... since your unit was training in Texas, you up for a tour to Kandahar?

WRT the general public being nice to the military..... cool isn't it ;D
 
Gooday folks. I rcently enrolled in the Army as an engineer with the ultimate goal of getting onto the dive teams ( and am well aware of how tough a goal that is... but hey aim high right!). As such I have a few questions. First off is there a differance between the Combat engineer regt. 's ( 1-2 in pet and edmonton) and the Engineer support regt. in gagetown? Secondly, is there a certain regt I should request to go to that might afford me better resources to get onto the dive teams and am I best off to try to get the power boat operator course first? I know I may not get it but I can request it. And finally what prerequisites are required to take the dive course? Thats all I've got for now, but I'm sure I'll wanna pick some brains again later.
 
1-2 CER Anglo, 5 RGC Franco ;)

1,2 & 5 Combat Engineer Regiments are the Operational Military Engineer Units supporting 1,2 & 5 Canadian Mechanized Brigade Groups. By definition, combat engineering is primarily concerned with meeting mobility, counter-mobility and survivability requirements of the manoeuvre forces and is most often carried out in the combat zone. As a secondary role, combat engineers are also called upon to fight as infantry when the need arises

4 Engineeer Support Regiment's primary operational task is the provision of sustainment engineering such as water supply, route maintenance and construction, vertical construction and the provision of utilities. The Regiment is also capable of performing traditional engineer tasks in the following areas: mobility and survivability. Common tasks to support CFB Gagetown include demolition and mine warfare training, provision of battlefield simulation, equipment and firepower demonstrations and the provision of engineer advice and support to courses. The Regiment also provides extensive support for CFB Gagetown Range and Training area development. This support includes road construction, small arms range construction and most recently the construction of Lindsay Valley Lodge. The Regiment is also responsible for conducting all armoured engineer training in the Canadian Forces. As one of the operational units within CFB Gagetown, 4 ESR also provides aid or assistance to civil authorities.

 
A better definition one could not wish for. that was extremely helpful. Greatly appreciated. Do you perhaps have a suggestion on which regt someont might want to request if they wanted to go for the combat dive course. I know this would be a few years away as I am a fresh outa the box newbie, but I'll take any advantages I can get! Once again thanks.
 
The combat diver course in given in Gagetown.... home of 4 ESR and CFSME (Cdn forces school of Military engineering)
However, all CERs receive positions on Combat diver courses.... for the most part - you can get there from any one of these points.
 
well you seem to be the man with the information! Thanx alot. I would like to pose one final question ( for now at least until I come up with something else) Being a specialist course is/are there any prerequisites to the diver course, i.e rank requirements, power boat op. course etc etc.? As I said I know it would be a year or two away from now but hey a leg up is a leg up right.
 
Timmy said:
power boat op. course etc etc.?

The power boat operator course has nothing to do with the combat diver course. The PBO course exists to train sappers to operate the BBE in support of operations. Being PBO qualified is not a pre-req for the combat diver course.


CHIMO


 
Prequisite.....
1.  Become a Sapper
2.  Be a good sapper that your Tp WO will feel comfortable recommending for advanced training.
 
3. Drink with the right people.
 
geo said:
The Regiment [4 ESR] is also responsible for conducting all armoured engineer training in the Canadian Forces.
Are you certain of this?  In spring/summer 2004, the Armd Engr COE transfered to 1 CER (along with all the trg aids).  I understand that AEO trg stopped in 2006 and as a result the CF has sent at least a few Cbt Engr to do AEO trg in Germany.  I have not heard if in Canada courses have resumed (though I would expect they should have) nor have I heard that courses were moved back out of 1 CER.

geo said:
1,2 & 5 Combat Engineer Regiments are the Operational Military Engineer Units supporting 1,2 & 5 Canadian Mechanized Brigade Groups. ...

4 Engineeer Support Regiment's primary operational task is the provision of sustainment engineering ....
geo,
I need to clarify a few things here.  You are correct that engineering support is divided into combat engineering or sustainment engineering.  However, engineers are grouped into organizations defined as either close support or general support.  Close support engineers are "those units which provide intimate support (mobility, counter-mobility and survivability) to the commander of a manoeuvre [Infantry or Armour] unit or sub-unit to deal with tasks of immediate concern to his operations."  General support engineers provide support to the force as a whole and not to any particular sub-division thereof, and as a result GS Engr focus on sustainment engineering, reinforcement of close support engineer capabilities, and combat engineering support to higher formation troops.

1, 2 and 5 CERs are the close support engineers to the correspondingly numbered CMBGs.  4 ESR is the general support engineers to the Army as a whole, and it provides close support engineering to 2 RCR.  You will find that in its GS role, 4 ESR does more than enough reinforcing CS units with capabilities (like EROC and ILDS) such that it would be inaccurate to suggest it is focused on sustainment engineering.

Both CER and ESR contain a mix of combat engineering and sustainment engineering capabilities.  Neither type of organization has a role of developing or maintaining any CF training area though most (if not all) do under take such tasks from time to time as a means of developing/maintaining branch skill-sets (such as line of communication bridging & route maintenance).  Any regiment can be called upon for domestic operations.

geo said:
1-2 CER Anglo, 5 RGC Franco
4 ESR - Bilingual (in theory).
 
MCG,
WRT CEO... oopsie, you are correct.  When we got out of the tank business & shipped off most of our LeoC2s to Wainwright - CEO capabilities migrated out west - cause that's where all the kit ended up... (old electronic notes)  Time will tell how things go now that the year has changed and we are back in the tank business.

WRT 4 ESR filling a CER capacity for 2 RCR and Gagetown based units - true...

Gagetown is a perverse kinda place :D
 
well it definately appears that I've come to the right place for what I've been looking for. Good thing too, Its not easy to find indepth info on combat divers, at least, and eng. regt's arent much better since only 1 CER has an actual website. Well thanks again folks. should I need anymore info, i'll hopefully be able to find it here. Hope to see you all soon.
 
Ha I knew I'd have at least one more question! A few years ago I met A guy who I know was an Eng. for 13 years, never trade transferred, just Eng. for his whole career. ( hes been ret. for about ten years now). He had his para wings though, and his maroon beret. I'm not really in contact with him any more so I cant ask him anything about it. So the question I pose is this. Is it possible to take the specialty and general courses of other trades ( ie infantry courses etc)? or is this just something that may have occured in the mid 90's during all the viscous budget cuts? 
 
Timmy said:
Is it possible to take the specialty and general courses of other trades ( ie infantry courses etc)? or is this just something that may have occured in the mid 90's during all the viscous budget cuts? 

The Para course is not " another trae's course"........it was open to all trades that were required to participate in airborne operations. There are courses that engineers can take  but the bottom line is this : If you want to do infantry things, join the infantry.
 
yeah I generally got that, I just wondered cus it seemed to me that it was only offered to infantry, and sig ops. And isn't listed as a course that engineers can take, at least not anywhere I can find. Dont get me wrong I'm not one of these neophyte 18 year olds who just wants to join the army cus it seems fun in the video games! I just wondered cus para work has always interested me and thought it would be a good course to take should the chance ever open up. Thanks
 
Look, i told you already,

Basica para course is open to engineers because there is a requirement for them in airborne operations. I never did the course but seeing i was an engineer for 11 years, i know what courses you can take.
 
wow Okey dokey! I dont know what makes you think I was restating the question, I meant no argument there, I was just stating my understanding of it BEFORE you made your post. Kinda figured the thanks at the end gave that away.
 
Timmy said:
... Its not easy to find indepth info on combat divers ...
Try here: http://forums.milnet.ca/forums/threads/23226.0.html

Timmy said:
Is it possible to take the [parachute] courses ... 
Try here: http://forums.milnet.ca/forums/threads/25453.0.html
 
thanks a lot for the links. Ive looked over the combat diver thread befor, it was informative, but aside from that and the OOOOOLLLLLLLD C.D.A.C. site, niether of which had any anything on requirements, there's not much out there. Thats ok though the good folks here have filled in the blanks for me. Much appreciated. And the thread on the jump capable eng.'s is definately handy. answers most of my questions. thanks again.
 
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