CF advertising at school

[resolute]

Enami,

I can't believe your school's policies are that restrictive!

If I were aware of a problem like that at my school, I'd certainly do whatever I could to change things.   As some of the thread's participants have already pointed out, the liberal movement tends to push "freedom of speech" and "tolerance" ... but many of them only extend these rights to those who agree with them.

As far as the social environment at my school, all I can say is that medical students are probably even MORE anti-war and anti-military than the average liberal arts student.   The profession has a tendency to attract pacifists I guess.   In my humble opinion, complete pacifism is as pathologically unidimensional as complete aggression / warmongering.

A normal, well-adjusted man should be able to feel compassion (and perhaps even cry) when confronted with an innocent victim, and righteous rage (and perhaps even kill) when confronted with the perpetrator of the victimization.   Note that I am referring to an extreme situation here, such as rape.

I'd be curious to know...in terms of the Cdn population...what percentage of people are actually hippy/anti-military, and the age distribution.

 

[NATO Boy]

If you think that the "lack of support" at school is bad, wait until you run into anti-military rebels!

I remember my sencond month of being in uniform; months after the US started invading Iraq. The local bank beside our Armoury was desecrated with anti-war grafiti that proudly proclaimed "THIS IS NOT YOUR WAR, CANADA!!!" To see this kind of hatred against the CF (regarding an issue with the US???) left me stunned.

But nothing has changed; there are still time when a few members of my regiment get harrassed (or even attacked) by anti-war protestors and other people who just have such a strong bias against the Military that they cannot possibly comprehend what we actually "do over there!"

This is something that is unavoidable IMHO and will always be encountered in public...and it doesn't make it easier to bear when you realise that it's part of the very society "we stand on guard for thee."

 

[Forgotten_Hero]

It's called selective service.  After the draft was over, there was a need for a pool of names just in case there was a shortage but not large enough to justify a draft, then you could be called up.  That system is still in place.

Isnt it mandatory to fill that thing out though? Thats why people conveniently go on a "vacation" when they need to hand in the info.

 

[ArmyRick]

I would say to the desperate anti-war crowd in our country...
(1) The '60s are over and they're were not all that grand to begin with, stop wishing to live in another time.
(2) Unreasonable states, regimes and governments do not respond to "political pressure" or trade embargos, some times they must be met with LETHAL FORCE.
(3) When you turn 18 and see how the real world works, maybe you will change your mind (assuming the drugs you are using havn't fried your noodle)...


Extremist on the anti-war, anti-US, etc, etc, tell them basically to get a life.

 

[pbi]

Speaking of ignorance about the US system: last night I attended the Annual Employer Awards Ceremony held by CFLC at 17 Wing, Wpg for employers in MB/NWONT who give Res time off for service. The guest speaker was the Hon. Peter Liba, past LG of MB. During his opening speech stressing the importance of Res to Canada, he compared our situation to that of the US and stated words to the effect of "but they don't need to worry about that in the US-they have the draft".

Rather shocking ignorance from the man who was once the representative of the Head of State in our Province.

Cheers.

 

[PJ D-Dog]

Isnt it mandatory to fill that thing out though? Thats why people conveniently go on a "vacation" when they need to hand in the info.

If you want to get a government job or received funding for school, you have to register with selective service.  It's the law.  If you don't register, you can be prosecuted.  Government employers will not hire you if you don't register.

No one will necessarily come knocking down your door for failure to register but it is a law and to receive government benefits, you need to register.

Honestly, I can't remember of any case when someone was called up through selective service.  It's a tool that is there in case it is needed.

I think you are getting confused with elements of the draft back in the late 60s early 70s.  Back then, people went on a vacation of convenience to Canada.  There is currently no draft going on in the US nor is anyone being called up through selective service.  It is all volunteer.

The only people being called up are the inactive reservists.  When you join up, you sign a contract for 4 years of active duty and 4 years of inactive ready reserve (IRR) for a total of 8 years.  The only people who got recalled were the IRR Marines who still had an obligation of service even though they were no longer on active duty.  Clear as mud...good.

PJ D-Dog

 

[Cpl.Banks]

Simple really, selective service means that your name adress, phone number etc... is there in case they need to contact you. Recruiters will call? to see if you are interested in the armed forces. And if there is a desperate need for soldiers It CAN be used to recuit new troops.Nothing too too complicated, IMHO this is a pretty good idea and maybe we should do the same...my two cents
UBIQUE!!!!!!!!

 

[HollywoodHitman]

And, if none of that works, bash them with a pick handle, really hard. >

It's not a pick handle........It's called the "Persuader, CF Mark I"

 

[Forgotten_Hero]

I think you are getting confused with elements of the draft back in the late 60s early 70s.  Back then, people went on a vacation of convenience to Canada.  There is currently no draft going on in the US nor is anyone being called up through selective service.  It is all volunteer.

Nah, Im not confusing it with that... I just over heard some people talking on another board... one was chinese but going to school in the US... he said something about going back to China when he turns 18 so that he doesnt have to sign that draft sheet.

 

[PJ D-Dog]

Nah, Im not confusing it with that... I just over heard some people talking on another board... one was chinese but going to school in the US... he said something about going back to China when he turns 18 so that he doesnt have to sign that draft sheet.

Again, the source you getting this from is probably confused.  There is no such thing as a draft sheet.  There are a lot of misconceptions about selective service and some young people just don't understand it or they were not given the most accurate information...."I heard from a friend of a friend of a friend twice removed on the German side etc".  Selective service is not the draft.  It may be used if a draft is called for but is not a draft.  Go to www.sss.gov and you can see what it is about.

PJ D-Dog

 

[jerrythunder]

Enami, I'm afraid this seems to be common place amoung our enlightened post-secondary students these days. Its a real shame that an anti-military sentiment has become seemingly engrained into our post-secondary institutions. I guess all you can really do is grin it and bear it. Hard to do, I know, but you can't change the ignorant.

well its like this with about 80 percent of our student body in my highschool, i thought one day to ask around about what people thought about our army and about joining and stuff like that and most of them said that they would never because they didnt want to kill people or get killed or commit or something like that. Now, no offense to the women out there in my school but every one of them, after me telling them that im going to be a reservist, told me not to join and that i am going to get killed

well my reply to that was: im not going to sit around and let other people defend my country! im a canadian and a damn proud one and im going to defend my country even if it means dying.

 

[Pte Cowden]

Yeah man, i go to mohawk college, and there was a recruit poster that said 'Join The Argyll's!' and someone wrote over the poster "No War".

It made me really angry, and confused. i really wasn't impressed.

 

[PJ D-Dog]

Yeah man, i go to mohawk college, and there was a recruit poster that said 'Join The Argyll's!' and someone wrote over the poster "No War".

It made me really angry, and confused. i really wasn't impressed.

Confused about what....I would just have been angry or at the very least annoyed.

 

[pbi]

Yeah man, i go to mohawk college, and there was a recruit poster that said 'Join The Argyll's!' and someone wrote over the poster "No War".

It made me really angry, and confused. i really wasn't impressed.

So channel your anger. Put up two posters where the old one was. Don't give grouind-why should you? What makes our arguments any less valid or persuasive than theirs? Theirs often seem to be based on an utterly uninformed view of the world, plus a fairly complete rejection of concepts such as duty, responsibility or service to others, or the idea that armed, aggressive evil has to be confronted or we get Rwanda and Sudan. We have as much right as anybody to put up public information, and we should challenge people who stop us. (Challenge--not thrash--never mind my earlier pickhandle comment...)

Cheers.

 

[Cpl.Banks]

When our teacher asked us all what we wanted to be there was the usual dribble: "Doctor", "Doctor", "Doctor"etc...Although most of them will be doctors because we are in the IB,anyways then my teach asks me and I tell her first Resv then Regs. She just looks at me like im from another planet! She asked why I wanted to die, why I wanted to serve the US by being their pupet etc...She didnt let up and I had to explain to her that I wanted to serve my country and make a difference in the world (while enjoying a few perks...early retirment/mil pension). From that day on she never talked to me again other than the polite crap saying that she doesnt like me. Half the people in my class are from other countries and they dont understand why I would want to serve our country and the other half are all Anti-War. When I tell them about all the cool and interesting things that could happen in the army they are slightly swayed but then out Teach preaches more Anti-War BS! She gets me really angry ...Stupid @!#$%, Anyways the point is I would want to get an army recruiter to come by the school and hopfully put some common sence into these ignorent masses. Any idea's on how I could accomplish this? Thanks
UBIQUE!!!!

 

[jerrythunder]

yeah i know what you mean,

so many people are so un informed about the military and what is going on and what they are used for. They do not take into account that the military is used for aid in national disasters, or some rescue operations and also peacekeeping operations. and they do not take into consideration that they propbably would not be here today if it wasnt for a canadian soldier.

 

[MissHardie]

On somewhat of a tangent, but still related to the thread:

Looking back at my school years, I'm struck by the near absolute lack of information presented about Canada's military history.  Even Remembrance Day ceremonies consisted of maybe a broadcast over the school intercom system of the Last Post and a minute of silence.  As solemn a ceremony it was, there was no context to this 'interruption of class', as one teacher put it, except the occasional 10 minute blurb on why it's important no one speak during the period of silence.  The knowledge I gleaned about Canada's proud military tradition during those years came primarily from my parents, as my dad was serving in the Navy. I'm therefore not surprised to read stories of teenagers and teachers and other civilians blowing off the military as an outdated institution, whose only purpose is to kill - with no knowledge of it's history or context as to why it is important, how could they but be influenced by the current pap being offered today by vocal groups and media outlets? 

The solution is, to me, quite obvious.  Why not add Canadian military history to the school curriculum? I realize that's a lot easier said than done, particularly given the attitudes of some educators, but I do see it as necessary.  It could be as simple as spending the day before the Remembrance Day holiday going over the background as to why we commemorate the soldiers who fought in the conflicts that essentially defined the 20th century, or going on a field trip to the local military museum and talking to vets. If I had my way, school kids wouldn't get the day off; they'd spend the morning doing a brief history or perhaps presenting projects on ancestors who fought in such conflicts before attending a ceremony either put on by the school or a local unit or the city - but I realize asking people to give up days off in the name of heritage and education is a bit much, so I'm not holding my breath.

This sort of education needn't be confined to the Remembrance Day time of year, either.  The best field trip I ever had, hands down, was a tour of my dad's ship when I was in second grade, in the spring.  I still remember thinking how cool it was - it was like I was being taken into some forbidden realm, where the people were actually doing Important Things.  I realize it's quite unfeasible to suggest that every grade-school class has a similar tour, but I see no reason why they can't be taken down to the local military museum to further their education - or even, maybe, to some local unit or base and being told about it's proud history and what it's currently doing.  The problem, as I see it, is that the military seems so distant and insulated from the civilian world, particularly in non-military cities.  Educating citizens about what we actually do - and have done - is the only solution I see to the seemingly increasing levels of hostility some members face.  There will always be those who believe what they do for no other reason than they want to, of course, but I think more exposure, particularly at the primary and secondary school level, would help shape those attitudes into something more accepting of - and perhaps foster pride in - our military. 

Anyhow, that turned out to be a longer tirade than I anticipated.

Miss Hardie

 

[PJ D-Dog]

Miss Hardie is right.  Military education in the schools is what we need but that is a long term solution.  It takes years to teach students from a young age about our military history.  This should be the first, long term step at changing the face of public opinion about the CF.

What the CF urgently needs now is an onslaught of good PR.  The CF has made a mess of many things because of its innability of control the PR world, even down to the brigade level.  The practice of assigning PAFO duties to some officer with nothing more than a five day indoctrination into the realm of public affairs is crazy.

PAFOs should work in concert with recruiting efforts at both community and school levels.  They should be used as an support arms in the arsenal of CF publicity.

When I was running recruiting in my unit, I bombarded every school, college, and employment center with posters and followed-up with phone calls and meetings.  I was publishing stories in the local newspapers and do live radio interviews on how the reserves was a great opportunity for people in the community.  I wrote the stories and sent them out as press releases.  I did, however run into a brigade PAFO issue.  This is off the thread but I'll tell the story anyway.

Brigade come down with a policy where all newspaper stories and radio interviews had to go through the PAFO.  Having been a formally trained journalist and a managing editor of my own newspaper (at one time), I knew how to do the job and get the message across.  Brigade wanted me to wait up to a month in order to get the PAFO to approve anything I wrote.  This was slowing down our efforts and my CO came to the rescue.  He told brigade that I was more qualified to be the PAFO than the PAFO was and we were granted an exception. 

Just to loop this back around, this is an example of how PAFOs are not used to the extent they should be.  Recruiting should be done at all levels and PAFOs can be a great resource but they are not used to their full capacity.

For recruiting efforts to be successful, they need to use this resource and train them properly.  Most PAFOs have never been to a press conference let alone held one.  I used to summond the local press every year and hold a press conference at the armoury to announce our recruiting campaign.  The brigade PAFOs and unit recruiters need to work together to get the message out there.

PJ D-Dog

 

[Britney Spears]

PJ D-Dog

Well, I disagree with you on the issue of pay-equity between regs and reserve, but on account of the above, you yourself should definetly have gotten at least a 15% raise.

 

[Britney Spears]

I know there's a thread dedicated to advertising for the CF, but I can't find it and this thread is also semi-relevent.


I came across <a href=http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=42512>this</a> over at Militaryphotos.net.

Pretty neat for a country the size of a large Canadian city.