Canadian Surface Combatant RFQ

[Underway]

This may have been posted before but it bears repeating. A good article on the Land Based Test Facility for CSC from the Maritime Engineering Journal.

The LBTF is expected to start summer 2022 and finish being built 2025. Frankly this is going to be a great facility, allowing a lot of the ship systems to be trialed and placed together before they make their way onto the ship proper. Should remove some risk from the project.

 

[Good2Golf]

The grand daddy of all DITMCO testers!

 

[OceanBonfire]

Irving met with the team building HMS Glasgow:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1522310176019263494

 

[Colin Parkinson]

A cautionary tale for Canada

Frigate factory could be coming to the Clyde

With the news that welds on the first Type 26 Frigate are 'deforming' because the ship is being assembled outside, more information has emerged over plans to build a 'frigate factory' on the Clyde.

ukdefencejournal.org.uk

 

[Underway]

Interesting. There is no more room at ISI yard to build another assembly building that I can tell. Unless they put one over the pad they already have.

Weld deforming can be compensated for a number of ways. This is a good news situation for us, as now that a gremlin is out in the open you can plan for it.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

Interesting. There is no more room at ISI yard to build another assembly building that I can tell. Unless they put one over the pad they already have.

Weld deforming can be compensated for a number of ways. This is a good news situation for us, as now that a gremlin is out in the open you can plan for it.

They might have room on the Dartmouth side to put a building. Maybe the old refinery site?

 

[YZT580]

They might have room on the Dartmouth side to put a building. Maybe the old refinery site?

Or just perhaps rebuild in St. John NB. May sound out in left field but Irving still owns the land and the drydock is still there. That would certainly buy Trudeau votes in NB and give them lots of room to spend money for the military without actually buying a gun.

 

[Underway]

Wonder if weld deformation was the issue with HDW not lining up properly between two megablocks. If so they compensated quite well as there hasn't been a misalignment since and Max B is almost done.

 

[Stoker]

Interesting. There is no more room at ISI yard to build another assembly building that I can tell. Unless they put one over the pad they already have.

Weld deforming can be compensated for a number of ways. This is a good news situation for us, as now that a gremlin is out in the open you can plan for it.

What I'm hearing is the building will be modified somehow after AOPS is completed.

 

[Underway]

What I'm hearing is the building will be modified somehow after AOPS is completed.

Makes sense. They probably have some lessons learned in workflow and the blocks they are building for CSC are going to be a bit different. Reorg how some of the cranes work, stations etc...

It would be tough to have them out in the weather throughout 3 or 4 winters, though the wraps usually do ok to keep the worst off of them.

 

[suffolkowner]

BAE to construct new shipbuilding facility in Glasgow

It is understood that the wet basin at Govan will be drained and a 'covered build hall' will be constructed on the site, allowing for later Type 26 frigates to be built indoors.

ukdefencejournal.org.uk

not sure if this is the same article as colin posted above as I cant get it to load but lots of back and forth in the comments. Glued on bolt head issues suggests its not only Canada with shipbuilding QC/QA

A cautionary tale for Canada

Frigate factory could be coming to the Clyde

With the news that welds on the first Type 26 Frigate are 'deforming' because the ship is being assembled outside, more information has emerged over plans to build a 'frigate factory' on the Clyde.

ukdefencejournal.org.uk

 

[Underway]

I was watching recently watching a lot of Carrier shows while doing other things around the house. Both the one on the HMS Queen Elizabeth and USS Ford kept coming back to the same argument discussion.

When you build a phone or a car you do dozens if not hundreds of prototypes. But a ship is too expensive and large to do a prototype. It's the initial production run and the prototype at the same time. This means there will always be problems and issues with the product that you have to work out. Building a ship is a huge risk, particularly if it doesn't work out as expected.

The QE had problems with welds on the GT ventilation cracking, a huge problem with crack thrust block on their main shaft line that could have been a disaster, fuel flooding in one of the machinery spaces, and other things.

Ford has had famously their new catapult and arrestor gear not work as advertised, and some serious elevator issues.

 

[DBNSG]

Or just perhaps rebuild in St. John NB. May sound out in left field but Irving still owns the land and the drydock is still there. That would certainly buy Trudeau votes in NB and give them lots of room to spend money for the military without actually buying a gun.

I believe the Irving's still do own the land with the old shipyard space a wallboard factory or some other part of the integrated Empire

 

[DBNSG]

Makes sense. They probably have some lessons learned in workflow and the blocks they are building for CSC are going to be a bit different. Reorg how some of the cranes work, stations etc...

It would be tough to have them out in the weather throughout 3 or 4 winters, though the wraps usually do ok to keep the worst off of them.

How do the wraps deal with humidity control, or do they?

 

[Rainbow1910]

Or just perhaps rebuild in St. John NB. May sound out in left field but Irving still owns the land and the drydock is still there. That would certainly buy Trudeau votes in NB and give them lots of room to spend money for the military without actually buying a gun.

While it is an option, would that be entirely wise? I assumed that through the NSS, the government wanted to consolidate work in a few specific shipyards to ensure that they would be kept busy for the foreseeable future. With the HDW class eventually finishing up in Halifax in the coming years, moving CSC production partially or entirely to NB would go against what NSS is trying to do? I can't think of what work Halifax would have coming down the pipeline. There is very rough rumors about a Kingston replacement but can the yard and its workers survive waiting around for a few years until the project is ready to go? I'm not especially sure. Seaspan is going to have Coast Guard contracts and the JSS to work on while Davie is seemingly gearing up to jump in with regard to ice capable Coast Guard vessels. Could both Irving yards survive long term on splitting the contract up?

What I'm hearing is the building will be modified somehow after AOPS is completed.

That could be a way to deal with these issues but how plausible is that? From what I understand, the plan was for Irving to transition from the HDW class to the CSC as smoothly as possible. Obviously there is going to be adjusting to a new, larger and more militarized design but is that enough of a gap to do major work on the yard groups to accommodate the CSC? I am not entirely sure. Perhaps I have too much stock put into government planning or what I assume is the governments plan.

As Underway said above, it seems the British are dealing with the issue without jumping directly into changing their yard drastically. If it's a matter of adapting to these issues with various construction methods and equipment on site, our ties being a partner with BAE and the RN should allow us to be well informed on the issue. Regardless, I hope for smooth sailing in regard to CSC and the rest of our procurements.

 

[OceanBonfire]

PSPC and National Defence joined Irving:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1531356025386897409

 

[OceanBonfire]

Official Government of Canada designation for SPY-7 radar: AN/SPY-7 (V)3

https://twitter.com/x/status/1532398941567868928

The Canadian Surface Combatant SPY-7 Radar Earns Official Government of Canada Designation, Setting a New Standard in Airspace Threat Detection

Ottawa, ON, June 2, 2022 – Lockheed Martin’s (NYSE: LMT) advanced SPY-7 radar received its Government of Canada official nomenclature – AN/SPY-7 (V)3 – formally recognizing the radar’s...

lockheedmartin.ca.mediaroom.com

 

[Underway]

“This designation marks our commitment to ensuring these ships are well integrated into North American continental defence,

From that article this says to me they are reading the same tea leaves I am regarding where the next batch of Gov't defence money is going to go. Seems they are positioning for a run at whatever the next northern defence or NORAD radar systems might be.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

From that article this says to me they are reading the same tea leaves I am regarding where the next batch of Gov't defence money is going to go. Seems they are positioning for a run at whatever the next northern defence or NORAD radar systems might be.

I very much like where this is heading.

 

[Underway]

I very much like where this is heading.

I can't disagree. I know we all love the away game here on this forum. We're proud of the histories that the CAF's various services have created in fighting European and Asian wars. Enjoy talking about the cool and interesting kit to go over there and do the business.

But if the CAF focus is on the home game going forward and that's a result of better funding then I'm all in. Defence of Canada is our number one priority, followed by being a good continental ally. And if that means (relatively) boring stuff like big radars, satellites, communications systems, patrol assets, and cyber warriors so be it.

The Spy 7's first job is on a shore based facility in Alaska, providing long-range surveillance/traking for NORAD and BMD. It's not a stretch to see it being implemented/repeated in a few strategic places around Canada to do the same.