The RCAF's Next Generation Fighter (CF-188 Replacement)

[PuckChaser]

If they go with Boeing it'll have to be built here. Super Hornet is shutting down production in the next 2-3 years. We won't have a decision for 5.

 

[MarkOttawa]

Looks like Kuwait (and likely USN) will keep Super Hornet line going awhile:

U.S. poised to approve Boeing fighter jet sales to Qatar, Kuwait

The U.S. government is poised to approve two long-delayed sales of Boeing Co fighter jets to Qatar and Kuwait, and could announce the multibillion-dollar deals during President Barack Obama's visit to the Gulf this week, according to two sources familiar with the matter.

Both deals have been stalled amid concerns raised by Israel that equipment sent to Gulf states could fall into the wrong hands and be used against it, and by the Obama administration's broader decision-making on military aid to the Gulf.

However, the Pentagon and the State Department both have signed off on the sale of some 36 F-15 fighter jets to Qatar and 24 F/A-18E/F Super Hornets to Kuwait, both built by Boeing. The White House is expected to follow suit shortly.

The sale to Kuwait is worth about $3 billion and the one to Qatar is probably close to $4 billion, sources familiar with the matter said...

Senior U.S. officials, including Navy Secretary Ray Mabus have publicly urged approval of the weapons sales, which will help maintain production of the fourth-generation Boeing fighter jets, while the newer and more advanced Lockheed Martin Corp F-35 fighter jet enters service in coming years.

One senior U.S. defense official said the Pentagon is keen to see the Boeing F-15 and F/A-18 production lines in St. Louis continue and does not want to "foreclose any options on fourth-generation aircraft at this point."

Boeing already is spending "hundreds of millions" of dollars to buy long-lead materials such as titanium to prepare for a possible Kuwaiti order for F/A-18E/F Super Hornets and a separate U.S. Navy order for 12 jets put on the service's "unfunded priorities" list submitted to Congress.

The Navy is hoping that Congress will provide the funding to pay for the Boeing jets in fiscal 2017, although the planes were not included in its base budget request. It already has earmarked funding for more F/A-18E/F jets in fiscal 2018...
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-boeing-mideast-gulf-idUSKCN0XF2KU

Mark
Ottawa

 

[FSTO]

Looks like Kuwait (and likely USN) will keep Super Hornet line going awhile:

Mark
Ottawa

I wonder how many Canadian subcontractors there are supplying Boeing? First all the angst supplying "jeeps" to KSA now fighter jets to that other beacon of enlightenment Qatar?

 

[AlexanderM]

Anyone interested in F-22 Raptors? The US Congress is looking at bringing them back and possibly allowing exports to Allies. By the time they shut down the line the cost per aircraft had come down, I remember reading a quote from a US Air Force General that he was paying around 150M USD per aircraft.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/04/21/politics/f22-raptor-congress/index.html

This article states the cost per aircraft of the last batch.

http://foxtrotalpha.jalopnik.com/everyone-who-wanted-more-f-22s-is-being-proven-right-1732105884

 

[MarkOttawa]

Super Hornet line continuing:

Pentagon Still Unsure If It Needs More Growlers; Boeing Says Production Restart Would Be Possible

The Navy may know within the next year if it has enough Boeing EA-18G Growlers to meet not only its own airborne electronic attack needs but also to cover all joint operational needs, the Navy’s director of air warfare (OPNAV N98) told lawmakers last week – though by then there may be a cost increase associated with restarting Growler production.

The Navy bought seven Growlers this fiscal year – not because its five-year budget plans called for more planes, but because Congress helped secure the funding to keep the common Growler and F/A-18E-F Super Hornet production line running until further domestic and international sales could be shored up. Now, though, the Navy has no additional plans to buy more Growlers, and there is no serious international interest in the program, Dan Gillian, Boeing F/A-18 and EA-18G programs vice president, told USNI News in an April 21 interview. The airframe production will continue, as Super Hornet demand remains [emphasis added], but the additional work to outfit the planes for sophisticated electronic attack missions will cease.

...if the Pentagon ultimately decides it needs more Growlers, “there will of course be production break costs, some things associated with that. We view it as something that is possible, but certainly a little bit of a costly way to acquire Growler kit,” Gillian said, adding that Boeing does believe there is additional need for more Growlers and is in talks with Northrop Grumman about how to proceed once the companies complete the last seven-plane order...
https://news.usni.org/2016/04/27/pentagon-still-unsure-if-it-needs-more-growlers-boeing-says-production-restart-would-be-possible

Mark
Ottawa

 

[MarkOttawa]

More Super Hornet--and F-35--support at US House of Representatives:

Draft US defence spending bill funds 11 more F-35s and 14 F/A-18s

The Lockheed Martin F-35 and Boeing F/A-18E/F has received strong support from lawmakers in the US House of Representatives, with the defence appropriations subcommittee voting today on a draft spending bill that would buy 11 more Lightning IIs and 14 more Super Hornets than requested by the Pentagon for fiscal year 2017.

The committee has recommended $8.3 billion for 74 F-35 aircraft compared to the 63 requested by the US Air Force, Navy and Marine Corps. The navy and the air force listed five F-35As and two carrier-based F-35Cs on their respective "unfunded priority" lists to Congress in March.

The navy sought just two F/A-18E/Fs and zero Super Hornet-based EA-18G Growler electronic attack jets in its base budget submission in February, but then recommended 14 more to meet an unfunded need. The draft defence appropriations bill now includes $1.35 billion for 16 F/A-18E/Fs...
https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/draft-us-defence-spending-bill-funds-11-more-f-35s-a-425209/

Mark
Ottawa

 

[PuckChaser]

$8.3B for 74 F-35s... Cheaper and cheaper every day.

 

[CBH99]

I THINK you have to add 15% because it would be a FMS....but because we are still a partner nation, I'm not sure if that still applies?

 

[Kirkhill]

I THINK you have to add 15% because it would be a FMS....but because we are still a partner nation, I'm not sure if that still applies?

I want the Delta Air Lines discount.  They can lease them to the RCAF.

 

[CBH99]

Agreed!!

Although to be fair, I think the Delta Airlines purchase of the C-Series might have saved that jet.  A purchase of 75 jets, with an option of 50 more, is huge for an airplane that was struggling to fill substantial orders.

Adding to that, Delta has a reputation for being pretty selective about which aircraft it puts into service.  So with Delta jumping on-board with such a large order, it could certainly attract other orders from other airlines also.  Both Bombardier & Delta came out winners on that one.

 

[PuckChaser]

I THINK you have to add 15% because it would be a FMS....but because we are still a partner nation, I'm not sure if that still applies?

They're waving 15% for partners, we haven't formally pulled out yet. If we buy any other jet from the US, we'll have to pay that surcharge.

 

[MarkOttawa]

Danish F-35A selection and Canada:

Canada and the F-35: The Danish Decision Provides a Way Ahead for Regional Defense

Recently, Denmark selected the F-35 as their next combat aircraft in an open competition with Eurofighter and Super Hornet.

Not only did they select the F-35, they have released public information with regard to that selection process and how they reached their decision.

In the Question and Answer session held last week after Eurofighter testified in front the defence committee of the Danish parliament, the Eurofighter representative was asked directly:

“Did you consider the government’s evaluation of the mission or military aspects of the competition biased in any way towards F-35?”

The answer was a clear no.

This provides an opportunity for Canada to leverage the Danish work, and to have the Danish government directly brief the Canadian government...
http://www.sldinfo.com/canada-and-the-f-35-the-danish-decision-provides-a-way-ahead-for-regional-defense/

Mark
Ottawa

 

[MarkOttawa]

Looks like more Super Hornets for USN:

Key provisions in the $602 billion House defense policy bill

Here’s a look at several key provisions in the Republican-led House defense appropriation and policy bill:
…
The bill rejects the Pentagon’s proposal to cut one of the Navy’s 10 carrier air wings. It also includes 11 additional F–35 stealth fighter jets, which cost more than $100 million each, 14 F/A–18 fighters…
http://www.fredericksburg.com/news/politics/key-provisions-in-the-billion-house-defense-policy-bill/article_6fbbde12-9e6c-5899-92a0-61cd9a5fff1f.html

Mark
Ottawa

 

[MarkOttawa]

From the company's mouth:

Boeing Looks To SLAP Super Hornets Into Shape

With the U.S. Navy using its F/A-18 E/F Super Hornets more rigorously than initially expected, Boeing has started preliminary assessments of what is needed to overhaul the aircraft, increase its combat life and keep it relevant much later into this century.

That work—along with the accompanying need for more parts and future additional domestic as well as international F-18 family aircraft—is expected to keep the company’s production line going into the coming decades, says Dan Gillian, Boeing F/A-18 and EA-18G Growler programs vice president.

To get an idea of what will be needed to whip the Super Hornets back into shape and help prepare them for future work, Boeing is using its Service Life Assessment Program (SLAP) to put together a Service Life Extension Program (SLEP) that will boost fighters’ life to 9,000 hr. from its current 6,000, Gillian says...
http://aviationweek.com/defense/boeing-looks-slap-super-hornets-shape

Mark
Ottawa

 

[AlexanderM]

When it states, "Boeing has started preliminary assessments of what is needed to overhaul the aircraft, increase its combat life and keep it relevant much later into this century," it will be interesting to see what kind of an overhaul they have in mind. The Advanced Super Hornet concept is fairly recent, so I expect this would be a more substantial overhaul. 

 

[McG]

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/canada-doesnt-have-enough-fighter-jets-liberals-say-despite-plans-to-upgrade-cf-18-fighter-fleet

Are the Liberals laying the ground work to argue for a larger fighter force?

 

[PuckChaser]

Of course we don't, Tories in the late 80s and Liberals in the 90s/early 2000s didn't buy replacements for the ones that crashed/lost air worthiness. Same with every other military procurement, don't break it because you're not getting another.

 

[Cdn Blackshirt]

If Justin Trudeau's Liberal Party actually expands our fighter fleet, I will need to re-examine everything I thoughts was true.

 

[MarkOttawa]

US Navy backroom ally of Trudeau gov't?

U.S. Navy chief [SecNav] warns of costlier Boeing jets if no foreign sales

The U.S. could see the cost of new Boeing Co F/A-18E/F Super Hornets rise unless the government approves foreign sales of the jets soon, U.S. Navy Secretary Ray Mabus said on Sunday [June 19].

Mabus, in Germany for a NATO exercise in the Baltic Sea, told Reuters he was frustrated by delays in approving the sale of the Boeing jets to a close U.S. ally, warning that this could affect the cost of jets the U.S. Navy still wants to buy.

U.S. Navy and other defense officials have said they support the sale of 28 Boeing F/A-18E/F jets to Kuwait for an estimated cost of $3 billion, but this has stalled for nearly a year pending final White House approval.

Mabus said the delays could have an impact on the Navy's budget plans, since the foreign order was needed to augment U.S. Navy purchases and keep the production line running efficiently.

The U.S. Congress is expected to approve funding for as many as 16 Boeing F/A-18 jets as part of the Navy's budget request for fiscal 2017, which begins Oct. 1, but that would give Boeing less than the two jets a month it says needs for economical production. The Kuwaiti order would have filled this gap.

"I'm frustrated. A lot of people are frustrated," Mabus said. "The process is too long, too onerous in terms of getting weapons systems to our friends and to our allies."

Mabus said Boeing could likely continue F/A-18 production for some time without the foreign sales, but dropping below optimal production rates could affect future pricing.

The Navy had requested funding for two F/A-18 jets in its fiscal 2017 budget request and 14 more as part of its "unfunded priorities list". It also said it expected to buy a larger number of Super Hornets in fiscal 2018 to bridge a gap in its fleet until the newer and more advanced Lockheed Martin Corp F-35 fighter jet enters service in coming years.

Mabus welcomed possible moves by Congress to add jets to the fiscal 2017 budget, but said those orders alone would not keep production at the Boeing facility running at optimal rates...
http://whtc.com/news/articles/2016/jun/19/us-navy-chief-warns-of-costlier-boeing-jets-if-no-foreign-sales/

Mark
Ottawa

 

[a_majoor]

Given the historic low priority for defense matters in Canada, we may be forced to consider jumping a generation ahead by going aboard this project. Canadian aerospace companies are perfectly capable of building UCAVs or UAVs on an assembly line basis, and the USAF's "Arsenal Aircraft" idea could be extended to cargo planes like the C-130. While hardly romantic, it is possible to envision a scenario where allied F-35's use their sensors to discover and exploit seams and openings in the enemy AD envelope, and Canadian C-130's lumber in behind and unload large numbers of drones to flood the openings. Of course this is a very poor solution to the problem; ideally you have high performance aircraft capable of self defense as the carriers as well....

http://www.darpa.mil/program/collaborative-operations-in-denied-environment

Collaborative Operations in Denied Environment (CODE)
Mr. Jean-Charles Ledé

DARPA’s Collaborative Operations in Denied Environment (CODE) program aims to develop algorithms and software that would extend the mission capabilities of existing unmanned aircraft systems (UAS) well beyond the current state of the art, with the goal of improving U.S. forces’ ability to conduct operations in denied or contested airspace. CODE would enable mixed teams of unmanned aircraft to find targets and engage them as appropriate under established rules of engagement, leverage nearby CODE-enabled systems with minimal supervision, and adapt to situations due to attrition of friendly forces or the emergence of unanticipated threats—all under the command of a single human mission supervisor. CODE envisions improvements that would help transform UAS operations from requiring multiple people to operate a single UAS to having one person able to oversee six or more unmanned vehicles simultaneously.
The U.S. military’s investments in unmanned aircraft systems (UAS) have proven invaluable for missions ranging from intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance (ISR) to tactical strike, but most current systems demand continuous control by a dedicated pilot and sensor operator supported by numerous telemetry-linked analysts. This requirement severely limits the scalability and cost-effectiveness of UAS operations and compounds the operational challenges posed by dynamic, remote engagements against highly mobile targets in contested electromagnetic environments.

DARPA’s Collaborative Operations in Denied Environment (CODE) program aims to overcome these limitations with new algorithms and software for existing unmanned aircraft that would extend mission capabilities and improve U.S. forces’ ability to conduct operations in denied or contested airspace. CODE researchers seek to create a modular software architecture beyond the current state of the art that is resilient to bandwidth limitations and communications disruptions yet compatible with existing standards and amenable to affordable retrofit into existing platforms.

CODE intends to focus in particular on developing and demonstrating improvements in collaborative autonomy—the capability of groups of UAS to work together under a single person’s supervisory control. The unmanned vehicles would continuously evaluate their own states and environments and present recommendations for coordinated UAS actions to a mission supervisor, who would approve or disapprove such team actions and direct any mission changes. Using collaborative autonomy, CODE-enabled unmanned aircraft would find targets and engage them as appropriate under established rules of engagement, leverage nearby CODE-equipped systems with minimal supervision, and adapt to dynamic situations such as attrition of friendly forces or the emergence of unanticipated threats.

CODE’s envisioned improvements to collaborative autonomy would help transform UAS operations from requiring multiple operators for each UAS to having one mission commander simultaneously directing all of the unmanned vehicles required for the mission. Commanders could mix and match different systems with specific capabilities to suit individual missions instead of depending on a single UAS with integrated capabilities, the loss of which would be potentially catastrophic. This flexibility could significantly increase the mission- and cost-effectiveness of legacy assets, reduce development times and costs for future systems, and enable new deployment concepts.

The program plans to develop the operational concepts for CODE-enabled strike missions and validate their effectiveness through detailed modeling and simulation. It also intends to develop the most promising capabilities and demonstrate them in flight using multiple surrogate UAS equipped with mesh network radios and a variety of payloads, augmented by a number of virtual UAS.

This sort of program is also extendable to all other arms and services, as swarms of sensors, weapons and platforms working together in land, sea or air environments are the likely means to overcome active and passive defences in near peer environments and engage fleeting targets in any conflict environment.