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The Bernier Fiascos & Resignation

I think Stephen Harper will deal with him as he usually do when his ministers are in trouble. He will let the dust settle a little bit, then shuffle him out of harm's way. Just like he did to Rona Ambrose. That way, Harper will think he did not appear to give ground to the opposition, while the opposition (of course) will think he did.

But that's what politics is all about : appearances.
 
stegner said:
... I think the larger issue here is that Bernier by his own admission knows very little on geopolitics and has demonstrated this on occasion.  He is simply not qualified to be foreign minister.  I think he is only foreign minister because he is the most prominent member of the Cabinet from Quebec.   If he were from Saskatchewan I think he would have gotten his walking papers a while ago. 

And I think you’re grasping at straws to defend the indefensible. How would that make him different from, say, Jean Chrétien (Minister of External Affairs in the short lived John Turner government) or Allan J MacEachen (Minister of External Affairs twice, under Trudeau)?

Both, like almost all ministers, were appointed for purely partisan political reasons: regional representation, political pay-off or pay-back, linguistic balance and so on. Both Peter MacKay and Jean Chrétien appear to have coveted the External/Foreign Affairs job and also appear to have gotten it as a ‘consolation prize’ after finishing second in party leadership races.
 
I don't see what your problem was with Chretien and MacEachen-both had considerable cabinet experience having served sine the 1960's.  Chretien practically served in every Cabinet portfolio before being made Foreign Minister.  MacEachen would serve in a multitude of positions also prior to foreign minister.  Afterwards, he serve as an advisor to DFAIT for the sum of one dollar a year when he retired from the senate in 1996.  I don't think DFAIT would even pay a dollar for Bernier's advice.  Your reading of Chretien as being appointed to appease Quebec is off as he was quite hated by sovereigntists and was not especially popular there due to his role in bringing in the Charter and preventing a referendum loss.  At that time even the federalists in Quebec were not very found of him.  While Chretien was PM he was pretty respected by leaders all over the world, particularly in the Caribbean and in Europe.  Rather than viewing these appointments as appeasement for purely political reasons I would characterize them as rewarding loyal and experienced Cabinet ministers.  Just because they were not from Ontario doesn't that they were appointed for purely political reasons to appease regional concerns.  There is more to Canada than just Ontario as smart and intelligent people live outside that province.   

In my view the initial successes of Mackay and Bernier comes from the fact that both of their fathers were Cabinet ministers in the Mulroney government.  Both won their dad's old seats and had the support of many of their dad's supporters.  They rode their dad's coattails a la Belinda.  The difference between them though is that MacKay has proven himself competent in every position he has been-Bernier has not in any position that he has been. 
 
So now Bernier is "not competant". Because he dated a girl for a couple of months a short while ago who had been married to a biker over a decade ago?

Only in the world of a segment of poli-sci acadaemia could this be the case ...

I feel very relieved knowing that there are more poli-sci academics around here who hold the opposite viewpoint.
 
stegner said:
I don't see what your problem was with Chretien and MacEachen-both had considerable cabinet experience having served sine the 1960's.  Chretien practically served in every Cabinet portfolio before being made Foreign Minister.  MacEachen would serve in a multitude of positions also prior to foreign minister.   Afterwards, he serve as an advisor to DFAIT for the sum of one dollar a year when he retired from the senate in 1996.  I don't think DFAIT would even pay a dollar for Bernier's advice.  Your reading of Chretien as being appointed to appease Quebec is off as he was quite hated by sovereigntists and was not especially popular there due to his role in bringing in the Charter and preventing a referendum loss.  At that time even the federalists in Quebec were not very found of him.  While Chretien was PM he was pretty respected by leaders all over the world, particularly in the Caribbean and in Europe.  Rather than viewing these appointments as appeasement for purely political reasons I would characterize them as rewarding loyal and experienced Cabinet ministers.  Just because they were not from Ontario doesn't that they were appointed for purely political reasons to appease regional concerns.   There is more to Canada than just Ontario as smart and intelligent people live outside that province.     

In my view the initial successes of Mackay and Bernier comes from the fact that both of their fathers were Cabinet ministers in the Mulroney government.  Both won their dad's old seats and had the support of many of their dad's supporters.  They rode their dad's coattails a la Belinda.   The difference between them though is that MacKay has proven himself competent in every position he has been-Bernier has not in any position that he has been. 

With respect, Allan J MacEachen was Tudeau’s elected political fixer – that’s why he was in cabinet. He was given a series of posts that allowed him to nearly totally ignore his portfolio responsibilities while he devoted most of his efforts to partisan political matters – including, especially, the allocation of pork. He moved from portfolio to portfolio because he could not be left in any one for too long without doing some real harm to governance. He liked External Affairs for its comfort and Trudeau never minded if External Affairs was badly led and managed.

As I mentioned, Chrétien got External as a leadership race consolation prize, as did MacKay and Joe Clark. Earlier he got finance despite his nearly total lack of gravitas because Trudeau wanted to prove that almost any French Canadian could be the Finance Minister – the fact that we ended up with 20% mortgages and out of control inflation was not Chrétien’s fault and even Trudeau only gets about 20% of the blame, the other 80% being out of Canada’s hands, no matter how inept and corrupt the government might have been, and Trudeau’s was both. 
 
This drivel still going on?

Anyone who thinks that the HA would send someone with ties back to them that were that easy to trace is a complete moron anyway and should be posting in the kiddie forum.
Bottom line......

 
stegner said:
Sure but as Michel Fortier said if the shoe was on the other foot they would be doing the same thing.
So, you are defending muck-racking in Canadian politics on the backward argument that the other party would do the same?  A little lesson that we like to teach young children is that something is not necessarily right just because someone else is doing it.  If it is wrong then it is wrong (regardless of it being your team).

Muck-racking is wrong.  It takes the focus and time away from issues of national importance and gives the main effort to childish finger-pointing (in hopes of collecting votes).

If you want to argue that a 10 year ago connection to the Hells Angels is a security risk today, then go fill your boots.  Don't make yourself out to be a fool by defending muck-racking by a (any) political party.
 
tick, tock, tick, tock. This has just about reached the end of its tether. If anyone has any last words they want to sum up their 'stance' with, better lay them out quick.

Milnet.ca Staff
 
tick, tock, tick, tock. This has just about reached the end of its tether. If anyone has any last words they want to sum up their 'stance' with, better lay them out quick.

I hear ya.  No one has contributed any evidence one way or the other let's lock this up. 
 
Maxime Bernier resigns as foreign affairs minister
Updated Mon. May. 26 2008 7:35 PM ET

CTV.ca News Staff

Prime Minister Stephen Harper says Maxime Bernier has resigned as foreign affairs minister, after he acknowledged leaving classified documents out in the open.

"I received and accepted Minister Bernier's resignation from the cabinet," Harper told reporters Tuesday.

"Mr. Bernier has learned and informed me that he left classified government documents in a non-secure location. This is a serious error and the minister has accepted his responsibility."

Trade Minister David Emerson will take over the post on an interim basis.

Harper said Bernier's resignation has nothing to do with his former girlfriend Julie Couillard, who has been linked with Hells Angels members.

Harper said Bernier's resignation has nothing to do with his former girlfriend Julie Couillard, who has been linked with Hells Angels members. However, The Canadian Press reports that the sensitive document was actually left at Couillard's apartment, and her lawyer notified the Foreign Affairs department about the slip this past weekend.

"Let me be very clear: this is not to do with the minister's life or the life of a private citizen, 99 per cent of which I think is completely off bounds," said Harper.

"I don't think it matters who a minister is dating, I don't think it matter about the private life of some private citizen. What matters here is the rules respecting government classified documents were broken."

More criticism

Earlier Monday, Liberal MP Michael Ignatieff had said the government should examine the role of Couillard in a company that bid on airport security.

Bernier first faced criticism after it was reported that Couillard had been involved with Hells Angels members, and the press has also seized on more personal details -- such as what Couillard wore to certain political events.

Ignatieff said the real issue is whether there were any links between organized crime and airport security, or the possibility of improper bidding for such security.

"I make no allegations here. I don't know the facts, and that's the point. I want someone in government to establish the facts and establish if there is -- or is not -- a link with a minister of the Crown," Ignatieff told reporters Monday.

"I don't care about her skirts, I don't care about her cleavage, I don't care about her past. I don't care about any of it -- it's none of my business, quite rightly."

Harper has repeatedly brushed off concerns about Couillard.

"I have no intention to comment on a minister's former girlfriend," Harper told reporters Monday at a joint news conference in Ottawa with Ukraine's President Viktor Yushchenko. "I don't take this subject seriously."

The new question came in light of a report in Montreal's Le Devoir newspaper on Monday that Julie Couillard, who had been involved until recently with Bernier, had been involved in a high-tech firm that had bid on airport security contracts. Her partner in that venture had biker connections.

The newspaper quoted a source as saying that in 2005, she had received documents that involved airport security.

Earlier reports have revealed that Couillard had other personal links to people involved in the biker underworld.

"There is a public security question when there is a possible link between airport security and organized crime," Ignatieff told the House of Commons' question period on Monday.

"If there is no link, all they have to do is stand up and say so, and we will leave the matter aside. But until we get an answer, we will ask the question."

Conservative House Leader Peter Van Loan said any security breach would have taken place under a Liberal government.

Couillard accompanied Bernier to his swearing-in ceremony as foreign affairs minister in August 2007. The first-term Quebec MP had been serving as industry minister before Harper shuffled his cabinet. She also travelled with the minister on some sensitive foreign trips.

A private matter

The Conservative government has maintained that Bernier's and Couillard's relationship is a private matter and that no threat to national security ever existed.

"The Liberal party is doing its best to turn question period into the Jerry Springer show," Van Loan said, referring to the once hugely-popular downmarket talk show.

The government has never addressed the question of whether a security check was done on Couillard. Harper again refused to address the question on Monday.

Couillard was to appear tonight on Quebec's TVA French-language network.

Bernier has been in hot water over other issues.

Last week, he promised the use of a Canadian Forces C-17 heavy-lift aircraft to take helicopters to Thailand for use in Burma cyclone relief. However, none of the four aircraft were available, and the government was forced to spend almost $1 million to rent an aircraft to fulfil the promise.

In April, Bernier came under heavy criticism near the end of a trip to Afghanistan after he told reporters during a scrum that Asadullah Khalid, the governor of Kandahar province, should be replaced.

With files from The Canadian Press and CTV's Graham Richardson

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20080526/harper_bernier_080526/20080526?hub=TopStories
 
I read this news story earlier and it looks like the opposition was going to ask for his resignation anyway.

Bernier's record of gaffes indefensible: Ignatieff

Updated Sun. May. 25 2008 9:35 PM ET

CTV.ca News Staff

Canada's Foreign Affairs Minister Maxime Bernier has embarrassed this country and it should be for the last time, says Deputy Liberal Leader Michael Ignatieff.

The House of Commons resumes Monday after a week-long break. The official opposition is expected to ask Bernier to resign from his cabinet post after the minister made an empty-handed promise to an aid agency.

More on link.
 
At least he has resigned, not hung around leaving a shyteload full of lies and excuses.

A good decision to make.

When you fuck-up pay the piper and soldier on.
 
Ok, so he fallen on his sword.

Seems to have some personality though ...

Not afraid to say what he thinks ...
The Lady as Canada's answer to Mrs Sarkozy??  :D

Next leader of the Liberals???  >:D




 
Kalatzi said:
Seems to have some personality though ...

Not afraid to say what he thinks ...

Is that what you define as personality ?
 
Sad story.  When the Libs and Bloc were pulling the Jerry-Springer high school "you are dating someone who dated someone gingy" I took great pleasure in that I didn't know a single person who thought it was appropriate for them to do so.  (I even asked strangers on the subway, and people I knew were card carrying Liberals)

And then.... there actually turned out to be a legitimate issue around security.

dang nabbit. 

I just hope this isn't used as an excuse to erode the legitimate rights of public office holders to a private life.
 
Many weeks ago Bob Rae asked the government a simple question :

"Liberal MP Bob Rae respectfully asked Van Loan to simply confirm that the government has ensured there is no security problem.

"I am sure that would go a long way to satisfying members of the House that in fact the appropriate steps have been taken," said Rae.

Van Loan said the government takes national security very seriously, adding: "We do not see that asking questions about the private lives of ministers in the fashion that the opposition has fits that bill."

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Politics/2008/05/09/5522251-cp.html


 
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