Tac Vest does not make the grade.

[blacktriangle]

We shoot ourselves in the foot by always buying Canadian.

If they are already more then likely to recieve business from the DND, Canadian companies have no reason to be innovative and spend money improving their products, as it will lessen their bottom line profits.

There are some companies that might be Canadian and pride themselves on their products, but I don't think any of them had the contract to make my issued boots or tac vest.

 

[Loachman]

We do not always buy Canadian. I was surprised to learn a few days ago that our sandbags are made in Communist China.

Regardless of nationality, companies bid on CF projects according to established rules and have to meet the criteria established for production of the items being produced.

They all have to compete with each other, and there are probably enough to provide sufficient competition on the aftermarket side. Having the capability to produce in sufficient quantity to outfit thousands in short order is another matter. I don't know what else Fellfab produces, but they most likely got the Tac Vest contract because they were capable of meeting production timelines, were able to satisfy stated quality requirements, and bid the lowest. CP Gear, DZ, and ICE etcetera probably could not match them in meeting production timelines because of their size.

Innovation, as far as the current Tac Vest is concerned, is not an industry issue as it was not an industrial design.

I still have yet to hear any complaints of production quality regardiing the Tac Vest, which is an industry issue. Have they been failing structurally in large numbers?

 

[Farmboy]

Standard MOLLE pouches will attach to the DZ vest.

Any MOLLE pouches over 3 wide will not fit the DZ MULES.  Anything 3 and under will fit.

Or buy a selection of Canadian-made commercial rigs that have already had the bugs worked out and have been found acceptable by troops in active combat and validate them officially in trials.

There are lots of US made ones that are working extremely well for our troops as well. I know of a few TAG rigs that are going back for their 3rd tour, one of which survived an IED.

 

 

[Old and Tired]

I don't know about any one else, I only have my TV and my wife's to judge by as far as durability.  Hers is fine, but she works in an Orderly Room/Hospital setting and very rarely gets out in the field right now.  Mine on the other hand is in a S*** state and I'm on my way to swap it for a new one.  That will make three in five years since I got the first one on ROTO 13.

I've put in UCR's for the Velcro attachments at the shoulders, the tensioning straps on the sides, and the front closure Velcro/snaps.  I've never heard anything back from the the folks at CLS so either they didn't get them or didn't read them.  Too much bad news can be depressing I guess.

I only use it now for the Battle Fitness workups and the actual march.  For real work I have a modified High Speed Gear Warlord that does what I need it to do.

 

[McG]

I've never heard anything back from the the folks at CLS so either they didn't get them or didn't read them. 

It's not their ["folks at CLS"] job.  UCRs go to ADM(Mat).  Have you followed up on any of your UCRs online?  Confirmed that they made it past Bde?

 

[Old and Tired]

For the first UCR submitted, I know it went to them, because a bunch of us that used them for the first time on ROTO 13 were interviewed about them by CLS and ADM (Mat) when we got home to Pet.  From anecdotal info it seems a fairly large percentage of us were less than impressed by it.  Some troops even request that the old LBV be reissued in lieu of the TV until some of the material and design deficiencies were fixed.  No luck so far but it's only been 41/2 years.

For the other two that I sent up, one went threw Adm IMG chain and one went up via the Army route.

 

[armyvern]

For the first UCR submitted, I know it went to them, because a bunch of us that used them for the first time on ROTO 13 were interviewed about them by CLS and ADM (Mat) when we got home to Pet.  From anecdotal info it seems a fairly large percentage of us were less than impressed by it.  Some troops even request that the old LBV be reissued in lieu of the TV until some of the material and design deficiencies were fixed.  No luck so far but it's only been 41/2 years.

For the other two that I sent up, one went threw Adm IMG chain and one went up via the Army route.

Geez, all that and you could have just handed it to me at the Mess during lunch hour last week.  >

 

[Old and Tired]

If only I'd I'd had one to give you Vern.  These were done a while ago.  Mine you, I might submit another abouthe Velcro because it just doesn't seem to hld put with everything else piled on top of it.

 

[medaid]

As for a better pocket system I don't really think the answer is placing them on the uniform itself, a better tac vest should be designed to accommodate anything extra you need to carry IMO. I hate having stuffed pockets as everything is loose and unsecured and bounces around when you run or march, least in a tac vest it is a bit more secure.

Screw the TV, and screw any 80% solution LBEs. I don't get why people keep wanting a "better" TV?! The TV was a failure for anything except guard duty, that's what it was designed for. It's great for that role, hell it's wonderful for that role. It is however, not a fighting rig. Some people are happy with it some are not, like any issued kit.

I preach the approved list method of doing things. You still get the issued allotment of standardized kit, but after that you have an approved list to shop from. Every copany that wants to get on that list bids for it every year to have their stuff re-evaluated and tested. Anything new that a company want to put on the list goes through a complete T&E by a group of individuals who have served in combat areas, and in front-line duty positions only. Now, people are going to argue "why only combat arms guys? blah blah blah blah blah" No. The only gear that will be looked at in the future as far as LBE goes shall be modular in nature ONLY.

None of this sewn down crap anymore. What people will be T&E will be MOLLE rigs or similar items along with their MOLLE counter parts in pouches from companies X,Y,Z. Away with dinos and their "garrison" mentalities, because no matter what the Vancouver Canucks looks like the Canucks even though they all wear different helmets, skates, gloves, hockey sticks etc. A Canadian soldier will LOOK like a Canadian soldier even if everyone uses a different rig, a different pouch or wears different boots or gloves.

Pockets are important on the shirts, and they should be changed. We don't carry FN C-1 mags anymore... get rid of them. FOr those who'd like to argue "what if my rig's broken or blown up or what ever blah blah blaah"  Sorry mate, if your rig's blown up you'd be dead. You won't need those fracking chest pockets anymore. Do you really think you'll be able to access them underneath your body armour anyways?

Want more carrying ability? Get a Battle Belt and put your First Line stuff on it. Really want to carry more things? Get a good pack from ATS, Black Hawk, ICE, CP Gear or where ever. It'll take time... but that's the way to go.


Sorry another pet peeve.... why do you need to carry an entire store with you in your LBE? That's NOT what it's for. It's meant for your essentials: NVG, IR Markers, IFAK, AMMO, AMMO, AMMO, AMMO, AMMO, AMMO, AMMO, water, gloves, BEW and a stripped IMP. That sounds about right no? If that's all you should be bringing, your rig shouldn't be this monstrous thing that would make anyone who looks at it faint. Everythign else goes in a pack, that's what it's designed for.

 

[prarie chimo]

britney, we cant attach pouches to our plate carriers because we wouldnt fit in the turret, or do any uxo disposal, or a lot of other things.  maybe if they had a molle patch that velcroed or molled on to the plate carrier we could pull it off


chimo

 

[KevinB]

I dont buy that as the IOTV and IBA have used attached patched and I see US Army EOD wearing them in their vehicles, as well as Stryker personnel.
A 1 mag thick pouch in front does not add a lot of bulk.

 

[Bzzliteyr]

I personally wore a single depth chest rig over my frag vest with plates for the beginning of my tour.  I fit in the turret with no issues and I used the old "tuck the pistol in a spare mag pouch" move for my 9mm.

This allowed me to dismount quickly and have access to 5 spare mags and my sidearm with a single spare.  I would have a Israeli bandage in my pant leg with a tourniquet so I had my first aid stuff as well.  nothing to zip on or off.. while vulnerably standing on a turret and I was always ready to go.

 

[Matt_Fisher]

I personally wore a single depth chest rig over my frag vest with plates for the beginning of my tour.  I fit in the turret with no issues and I used the old "tuck the pistol in a spare mag pouch" move for my 9mm.

This allowed me to dismount quickly and have access to 5 spare mags and my sidearm with a single spare.  I would have a Israeli bandage in my pant leg with a tourniquet so I had my first aid stuff as well.  nothing to zip on or off.. while vulnerably standing on a turret and I was always ready to go.

While that setup worked for you, but knowing how big, rather, small you are, I don't think that option is going to work for the larger framed guys who have to operate in a LAV turret.

 

[Ham Sandwich]

I for one went online after Texas and ordered an Eagle plate carrier/cummerbund (non releasable variety) and various pouches from DS tactical. I'm very happy with it. I decided that i didn't like the Idea of all of my weight hanging from the front and little or nothing on the back as seems to be the case with the HSGI chest rigs and such. Seems awkward to me. I prefer to have everything fit snugly all around. Plus a plate carrier/cummerbund affords you a lot more molle space. Just my $0.02.

Example:

 

[Fusaki]

You're going to have trouble wearing that for turret shifts with all your pouches and stuff on it...

 

[medaid]

Wait out for a Canadian manufacturer's releasable armour system.

Seriously... wait for it, it's quite cool. In fact it's soooo cool I have the prototype sitting in my lap. Mmmmm releasable MOLLE armour goodnesss....

 

[Ham Sandwich]

You're going to have trouble wearing that for turret shifts with all your pouches and stuff on it...

No i won't, because i won't be wearing it in the turret. Load carrying equipment goes in the bustle racks. Only frag vests/plates are worn in the turret.

Wait out for a Canadian manufacturer's releasable armour system.

Seriously... wait for it, it's quite cool. In fact it's soooo cool I have the prototype sitting in my lap. Mmmmm releasable MOLLE armour goodnesss....

How about posting a pic??

 

[medaid]

No can do at the moment. The comapny does not want to expose it to the general public just yet.

 

[Fusaki]

No i won't, because i won't be wearing it in the turret. Load carrying equipment goes in the bustle racks. Only frag vests/plates are worn in the turret.

Seen.

I didn't realize you intended to wear the plate carrier over your issued frag vest and plates. Then again, even if your plates were going in the plate carrier, you'd be wearing the frag vest anyways for the kevlar...

I would have gone for a MOLLE vest or MOLLE chest rig that was designed to be worn over the PPE.

 

[Ham Sandwich]

Ah, i can see where the confusion is. Yeah, i should have stated that i intend to keep the plates in the flak vest and just use the plate carrier only as a molle platform over top.

Fortunately this piece of kit actually fits well over my flak vest/plates. It's a good thing too becuase the plates have to be in the flak vest, not only for liability reasons but because first aiders need to be able to remove load carrying equipment from patients while leaving them with their ppe, so having your plates in your load carrying equipment outside of your flak jacket will create many problems there.

And AFAIK, there's no piece of kit out there specifically designed to be worn over a flak vest containing plates that fit my specific needs.