Starting a Career as an ATIS Tech

[CDN Monkeyman]

Hello All

I am remustering to ATIS Tech and will be heading to POET in Aug 2011 and I have some questians do we get posted after POET or after our 3's.  How long between the two courses do we have to wait or is that just up to the school.  Is Greenwood a good place for a first posting or should I try to stay in Ottawa? 

thank you

 

[Sigger]

Coming from an ATIS Tech, your posting will be after your 3's. The wait between POET and 3's depends obviously on crse availability. Your posting will be what you make it. Some love it some hate it.

 

[Bert]

The ATIS trade has many posting opportunities coast to coast.  Not
sure how easy it may be to get your posting of choice.  Greenwood
is a nice spot in the Annapolis Valley dotted with little towns.  Close
to coast and Fundy, lots of yard sales, New Minas is 25 mins away
for shopping, and Halifax about an hour and a half away.  ATIS techs
mainly work at 14 Wing Telecommunications and Support Squadron
(WTIS) on base supporting radios, coastal radar, IT, networks,
crypto, and airfield. 

 

[Nim]

Not to mention, that if you hit the jackpot, you can be an OUTCAN ATIS, like the two of them that are here in Elmendorf AFB, Alaska.  Welcome to the trade. 

 

[226r]

Hello All

I am remustering to ATIS Tech and will be heading to POET in Aug 2011 and I have some questians do we get posted after POET or after our 3's.  How long between the two courses do we have to wait or is that just up to the school.  Is Greenwood a good place for a first posting or should I try to stay in Ottawa? 

thank you

First off, welcome to the trade. I made my quick escape from Kingston after I graduated my 3's there almost a year ago. Being so fresh from the system and young I know alot of people that are still kicking around there. Alot of them have experienced waits as long as 8 months to get on their 3's. On the bright side of that though, PAT platoon is doing what they can to send people expecting long waits on OJT to bases close to home, or what works out best. I did 3 months at ATESS in Trenton while waiting for my 3's, another friend of mine did 6 months at WTIS in Winnipeg, by choice.

As for your first posting, I went to a very very small place in Nova Scotia and the CM realized that it is no good for PTEs after i arrived. Mind you, I enjoy it very much. Any base would be a very good first posting, for the first year or two you will probably get thrown around to different shops so you can see what each of the units does.

 

[JBP]

Howdy ATIS folks!

I'm currently a Sig Op but labelled as a new 'IST'... I'm curious about the idea of OT'ing to your trade. I'm wondering if it would end up being worth it or not, as in, is the grass actually greener on the other side or not? Spec pay obviously is nice, but money isn't everything so I'm wondering how overall job satisfaction is. Furthermore, I'm currently an LCSS Administrator and would like to stay in the computerish realm of things. Would that be a possibility with the military and civilian IS/IT training I have? Or is it like the LCIS and Sig Op trades where it's a total crap shoot as to what end of the job spectrum you'll end up doing?

Also, how's career progression and/or promotion opportunity? I"m guessing you guys are mostly a full trade generally.

Thanks ahead of time for the thoughts/comments/bashing!

 

[Occam]

You wouldn't be able to avoid doing non-IT stuff (Navaids, Airfield comms, etc) for very long.  IT is but a small portion of the ATIS world.  There are postings that are entirely IT-related, but they're in the minority.

Progression is pretty good, if you can manage to stay working for ATIS Techs and avoid falling into the chain of command of Sig Ops/LCIS Techs.

 

[Motaba]

Howdy ATIS folks!

I'm currently a Sig Op but labelled as a new 'IST'... I'm curious about the idea of OT'ing to your trade. I'm wondering if it would end up being worth it or not, as in, is the grass actually greener on the other side or not? Spec pay obviously is nice, but money isn't everything so I'm wondering how overall job satisfaction is. Furthermore, I'm currently an LCSS Administrator and would like to stay in the computerish realm of things. Would that be a possibility with the military and civilian IS/IT training I have? Or is it like the LCIS and Sig Op trades where it's a total crap shoot as to what end of the job spectrum you'll end up doing?

Also, how's career progression and/or promotion opportunity? I"m guessing you guys are mostly a full trade generally.

Thanks ahead of time for the thoughts/comments/bashing!

I've been an ATIS for about 6 yrs. Last 4.5 yrs purely IT. There are more and more IT positions going to civies. I'm doing my first deployment in a couple of months, then OTing....this trade isn't for me.

 

[Bert]

Sig Joeschmo
The ATIS trade as well as other trades are in transition challenged
by the "black hole" in demographics and technology evolution. 
If considering an OT, ask alot of questions before the big jump.

If to over-generalize, the LCIS trade is/was about 85% the same
the ATIS.  We both deal with IT systems, mobile radio, various
bands of RF eqt, telecom, cable plant, PCs, sys admin, in many
settings deployed, on tasking, or on base.  The difference is
mainly with element specific systems and settings, fixed versus
mobile, radar, UAV, and airfield/ATC support systems as Occam
noted. 

Legacy systems in the air force are more and more being replaced
or updated with IT based or controlled systems and its common to
log into a computer before you can do anything.

Is the grass greener over here?  Its all perspective I guess.  The
ATIS trade will remain highly diverse from a technical viewpoint,
the Wings and other units are scattered across Canada providing
a change of location, the CM moves members around and you
should see different corners of the trade, promotion is good
because of and no thanks to the black hole.  There is the good
mixed with the not so good like everything else. 

So far, I like the trade and got to travel around like the
advertisement said.

 

[RDY2SRV12]

Greetings,

I currently have ATIS selected as my first trade choice. I came across this thread and was hoping to get some more insight into the life of an ATIS Tech.

In addition to any information you care to share can you tell me;

1) Is this trade suitable for a married person, when compared to other Air Force trades such as AVN; what % of time would one spend away from home on TD etc.

2) What is the best thing about this trade (generally) and the worst.

3) All things being equal is this the best trade in the Air Force for career progression and opportunity.

4) Anything I should know before signing up for this trade.

Regards,

 

[Occam]

Most of your questions can't be answered.  There are too many variables.

Some positions are going to have more time away from home than others.  There's nothing you can do about that.  All you can do is consider that whatever position you're in will likely change every 3-4 years at most, so even a difficult position will have a light at the end of the tunnel.  Every job in the CF is suited to a married person - if your spouse is willing to be reasonable.

As far as career progression goes, it's what you make it.  If you volunteer for deployments and taskings, you're going to shine brighter than the guy on cruise control who does his work and goes home at the end of the day.  There's a saying that goes "You're your own best career manager" - that means you have the most control over your own career by seeking out opportunities.  It doesn't matter what trade you're in, if you sit back and be the average guy, you'll likely end up with average opportunity for advancement.  There will always be promotions, some more years than others.

ATIS Tech is a pretty decent trade.  You'll have marketable skills with direct transferability to civvie street when you make the transition someday.

 

[RDY2SRV12]

Thanks makes sense.

I am actually planning on staying in this time around, at 36 years old the only thing I want to transition to is a pension and weekend BBQ's after my 20 is up. I am just nervous about making the right choice, for me and my wife. She is totally on board, but everyone has their limits.

 

[Occam]

You know that it's 25 years for a pension now, right?  I don't know the details of how split time plays into it, but anyone joining now has to do 25 years, not 20.  Of course, you'd hit CRA at 24, so I don't think that'll matter much.

 

[RDY2SRV12]

As it was explained to me I can still qualify for 40% after 20, or if I stay the 24 it would be 46%. Maybe by 2038 things will change in my favor or I can argue a case to let me finish the 25. Also not sure how my reserve time would work into it, probably not at all.

This is also the root of my other question in another post RE: staying in Ontario as long as possible (not including deployments or TD) my wife has 22 years in her job with 8 more to go for her full pension, I can not, and will not ask her to give that up because I get stationed in Comox or Greenwood etc.

I am reading through the MOC Task statements and I found it interesting that for ATIS it defines up to CWO but for AVN it stops at SGT. Is SGT. the end of the road for an AVN or do they change MOC after promotion to WO?

Regards,

 

[Occam]

I'm not sure about the pension.  It would definitely be something I would get researched in depth before signing on the dotted line to ensure you don't get any surprises.  One thing is clear though - you'd probably want to buy back your PRes time so that it contributes to your pension, and you want to do that immediately on enrolment as I think the cost goes up if you delay starting the repayment (I think you need to start paying it back within one year or it starts to cost you more).

As for AVN Tech career progression, I'm pretty sure you've nailed it.  They Occupation Transfer (OT) as part of their normal career progression.

 

[RDY2SRV12]

From what I have found the CF Pension is regulated pretty much the same as the Public service pension, and that if you pay into the pension you are entitled to something after Two years of pensionable service. http://laws.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/C.R.C.,_c._396/index.html

The difference being your age factor wheras if you retire after 25 years you can recieve your pension at 55. Less than 25 years would add a year to the wait by each year short, IE if you retire with 24 years you do not recieve pension payment until 56 years of age (up to 60). It also appears to be relatively easy to transfer to a public service position and continue paying in where you left off up to a maximum of 35 years worth of public service.

As for my case, depending on how much credit I recieve for Reserve time I may be just under the wire for 25 years service, or short less than a year which may work in my favor, IE if I have 24 years and 8 months service would they really kick me out 4 months short?

Just to be sure I am going to contact the administration on this and I am sharing the email here in case anyone else comes across this issue and needs to investigate. PensiondesForces.ForcesPension@tpsgc-pwgsc.gc.ca

RE: the buy back, that is on my list of things to do as soon as I can. We are doing the same for my wife as she has a number of years working for the city as a teenager before she became full time, which should reduce the number of years that we will be separated on my enrolment.

RE: AVN, well that helps make my choice easier I am hoping to become an expert in one trade and with luck and grit retire with a heavy sleeve cuff!

 

[Occam]

You seem to have done your homework...definitely confirm it though.

As for the "would they really kick me out 4 months short" question - yes, the hard ceiling for CRA is 60.  I would say it's moot to you as you become immediately eligible for a pension at age 60 regardless of years of service, and your pension is actually calculated using days of service not years, so every single day counts.  Retirement age is actually 55 and you can apply for one year extensions there onwards to age 60.  I've heard that most extension requests are granted but I would fully expect that to change in the current fiscal environment.  You're actually looking a couple of decades down the road though, so who knows?

I meant to ask - your wife has 8 more years to a full pension.  Your chances are pretty good to get at least one posting to Trenton if you ask for it, simply based on the number of positions there.  Have you considered how things will play out if you're posted to more distant locations?  I've been out since September last year, but I know a lot of things have changed since then, including the policy on IR.  Can you even do multi-year IRs anymore?  Anyone?  Bueller?

 

[aesop081]

RE: AVN, well that helps make my choice easier I am hoping to become an expert in one trade and with luck and grit retire with a heavy sleeve cuff!

You're not quite understanding what happens to an AVN after promotion to WO so i wouldn't make a decision just yet.

The aircraft technician trades, along with flight engineers, all become AM SUP upon promotion to WO. They stay in the aircraft maintenance world, continue to work in flying Sqns, but are now "in charge" of supervising unit maintenance functions.

It's not like you start your career all over agin in something completely different. It is just part of the career progression.

Be careful making career decisions based on assumptions.

 

[aesop081]

  I've heard that most extension requests are granted but I would fully expect that to change in the current fiscal environment. 

The arrival this year of 35/55 guarantees that CRA 60 will be the exception.

 

[RDY2SRV12]

My plan goes something like this; (My service)-(Wife time to pension)

Year 1 and most of year 2 training St. Jean and Kingston - 6 years
During this time we will make arrangements to see each other on weekends. As it works out she has family in Montreal and loves to drive!
First Posting Trenton (Hopefully) Avg 3 years (I assume)  - 3 years
Purchase house in Cobourg or Port Hope with permission (<40KM Geographic boundary) both commute daily.
Second posting ? Any Ontario  Avg 3 years (I assume)      - 0 years problem solved

If I can manage to stay in Trenton for 6 years all is good. If not we will cross that when we come to it. During any posting that we are forced to be separated I will volunteer for everything that comes down the pipe to A) make the time go faster B) should be good to get career off the ground.

RE: homework; if University has taught me anything it is how to research!