Should Canada pay the United States to defend us?

[McG]

Globe & Mail Poll:
Canada's vice-chief of defence staff has admitted the military cannot afford to house, train and equip the extra troops due to join its ranks. Meanwhile, our CF-18s are coming up for a major refit and our submarines leak. This prompts us to ask: Should Canada give up on its failing Forces and pay the United States to defend us?

Vote here:  http://www.theglobeandmail.com/

So far the results are:

Yes:  393 votes  (15 %)
No:  2147 votes  (85 %)

 

[jmackenzie_15]

why dont we just break the country off into new states while we're at it.

 

[Hansol]

I pledge allegiance to the flag....

 

[a_majoor]

Beef, softwood lumber, steel tarrifs, water exports...I think we are already paying. Cutting a cheque would be a lot simpler.

 

[canuck101]

How do we increase the ability to train soldiers in the short-term. Could we ask the US to help us in the short-term with trainers. If not what do you think we can do.

 

[Peace_Keeper]

Oh great another Idea to waste money on......

 

[Slim]

This thread is in extremely bad taste.

Slim

 

[Foxhound]

Wasn't it Churchill who said, â Å“Every country has an army â “ it's own or somebody else's.â ?

 

[jrhume]

How would we charge?  By the threat?  A flat fee?

What's the rental fee on an armored division?  Are Humvees safe against polar bears?  Can M1A2 Abrahms operate in cold climates?  Would we have to pay for damages to tundra?  Tank engines probably don't meet Kyoto requirements for exhaust emissions.  That could be a problem.

I wonder if Armed Force Rental Officers work on commision?

  Jim

 

[Genetk44]

Quite frankly a country that isn't willing to at least try to defend itself doesn't deserve to be free and independent. Sadly that looks like the way Canada is heading :-[

 

[Pieman]

There is no reason Canada can't afford to maintain it's millitary, we can afford it. Believe it or not, we are quite wealthy. It is a question of where the tax payer wants to put their dollars.

 

[sdimock]

From Old Guy

"Tank engines probably don't meet Kyoto requirements for exhaust emissions." 

Some of our politicians don't meet Kyoto requirements for exhaust emissions.

 

[karl28]

Just when you think that the Canadian Media cant get any lower they find a new way to do it . This poll is in very bad taste  the military needs public support not more bashing from the media so they can  sell more papers .    Very poor taste

 

[CT554]

I think the government should actually privatise health care and then maybe have a huge dump of money in the military, some people go to the hospital just for a headache, and then they complain that health care is no good.......well i think that makes a point.

forever...

 

[Kirkhill]

Maybe the US could turn the USMC into its version of the Foreign Legion and we could re-role the CF as its 5th Division.  Equipment compatibility, used to working with less, greater opportunities for advancement, might even get to wear a maple leaf as a divisional patch. :rage:

 

[Big Foot]

Kirkhill, if that happened, I'd VR. I signed up as a Canadian soldier, and thats all I want to be. No offence to any Americans on this site but, I just could not fight for an American President. I am a proud Canadian and feel the CF is important to our identity as a nation. I would not serve if it became American, that simple.

 

[Kirkhill]

Big Foot

I would hope that most would do as you would.  It's just the frustration getting the better or me.

Cheers.

 

[Edward Campbell]

This thread is in extremely bad taste.

Slim

Sorry, I cannot agree.   Look at these two items from today's papers:

National Post http://www.canada.com/national/nationalpost/news/story.html?id=66b5d39d-8cd8-4e63-8d61-878c0c0bcaed
The next medicare?
Peter Shawn Taylor
National Post

On social policy and a great many other matters, Canadians are frequently reminded that they occupy some middle ground between the cloistered statism of Europe and the free wheelin' market mentality of the United States. If this is true, then Canada is about to take one giant step further out into the Atlantic Ocean.

After several false promises from the Chretien government, Paul Martin's Liberals appear determined to build a new national daycare program. When such a system is complete, it is expected to be far more European in style and practice than anything North America has yet seen in child care, outside of Quebec.

Federal Social Development Minister Ken Dryden is being given $5-billion over the next five years to create this national system, although Finance Minister Ralph Goodale has hinted he is prepared to spend much more than that. With plenty of money in the pipeline, the topic has considerable momentum.

Ottawa Citizen   http://www.canada.com/ottawa/ottawacitizen/news/story.html?id=54ffbfd3-925b-44d0-a1b5-3f279ba0bcb8
Troop boost 'will take five years'
No money to keep election promise, stunned defence committee told

Mike Blanchfield
The Ottawa Citizen

After a thorough grilling by senators, Vice-Admiral Buck made clear the Forces would not be able to make good on that election promise unless defence spending is increased. He would not say how much more money the Forces need in next year's federal budget.

"It actually will not be possible to grow by 5,000 or 3,000 in the next three years. It will take a period greater than that," Vice-Admiral Buck testified. "It would be my anticipation that you'd be looking at a five or so years pace."

Several senators, including committee chairman Senator Colin Kenny, a Liberal, appeared stunned by the revelation.

There is a big league social programmes industry out there which, supported by a large minority of Liberal MPs who are, in turn, backed up by almost all of the NDP and BQ MPs, wants all defence spending frozen and then rolled back in order to fund a total nanny state for Canada.   Canadians have decided, consistently, ever since St Laurent retired in the '50s, that they want more and more and more social services and that they can and should come at the expense of national security.   The Liberal Party of Canada has adopted the tried and true political tactic of determining where the people want to go just before they rush to the front of the mob and lead it there.

The question in the Globe's poll is pertinent because there is a price to be paid.

 

[Scratch_043]

IMHO, this is the biggest possible insult to the CF. The Govt cuts spending on our military, and later decides that "oh, maybe we do need to defend ourselves" and instead take money that could go to our own forces, and spend it on 'renting' forces from the states. This does not make sense to me, let me put it this way; say you are living in a house for 20 odd years, and renting the house costs $800 a month, while it costs $900 a month to pay a 20 year mortgage, why would you rent the house, when you can pay the mortgage, and own the house after the 20 years is up. (A car could also be used for this example, in a shorter time frame of course)The same applies to the allotment of defense funding.

 

[CT554]

IMHO, this is the biggest possible insult to the CF. The Govt cuts spending on our military, and later decides that "oh, maybe we do need to defend ourselves" and instead take money that could go to our own forces, and spend it on 'renting' forces from the states. This does not make sense to me, let me put it this way; say you are living in a house for 20 odd years, and renting the house costs $800 a month, while it costs $900 a month to pay a 20 year mortgage, why would you rent the house, when you can pay the mortgage, and own the house after the 20 years is up. (A car could also be used for this example, in a shorter time frame of course)The same applies to the allotment of defense funding.

that's an exelent example man, totally agree