Packing for Basic [MERGED]

[Gunner98]

Oh believe me, there are ways to "cheat", or use all of your ressources to put it in a more "PC" way.  As long as you play by the rules (and obviously, you better know the rules if you want to do that), it shows that you think outside the box and use all the ressources available to you.  AFAIK, there was no rules saying you cannot use 2 sets of things on Basic Training.

Call me old fashioned in my thnking. When I was a Company Commander at the Recruit School in Cornwallis, you had one personal box (your oxford shoe box in fact) in your barrack box and you no access to your personal kit except on weekends when you had earned a pass.  Now if everyone is doing it and the staff permit it then it is not really cheating.  We cut to the chase at the Battle School in Shilo your drawer layout was comprised of nothing but dummy kit and included a condom for all students regardless of gender.

As far as time being the most critical resource, I think prioritization is - your inbox will never be empty for long, your learning never ends and whether it is your brain, your heart or your lungs that quits first we will all die one day.  So I concede, we are not doing basic training in Cornwallis any more and if the only cheating your doing is having dummy kit, sleeping on top your bed in your PT gear and using shampoo instead of soap. Then you are not really cutting corner you are placing time as a higher priority than comfort and hygiene.  In my experience that extra time is spent sleeping, smoking and joking rather than on team work tasks such as helping others struggling with their studies, kit and quarters.

 

[Loachman]

You have what is it now, six million posts on this website? And you never even finished BMOQ.

Judging by your empty profile and certain posts of yours, it is apparent that she has got further than you.

And you decided that instead of learning the values of discipline, it was a far better option to cheat and lie your way to being an officer. I am actually glad you didn't make it. I do not want you as a fellow officer, because I can never trust you to not lie/cheat or slime your way around.

Here's something for you to consider: You haven't made it yet, either.

Should you not, don't look to me for sympathy. I'll actually be chuckling, with the occasional guffaw tossed in for good measure.

I'm not seeing you as somebody that I would want as a fellow officer with the attitude that you are displaying.

And while I am here, I noted that you said you could not keep up with the training and your weight loss, and decided to eat extra desserts to stay above water. Think about that again: they have all kinds of meals with nutritional value, and you (as an officer candidate, who is supposed to make smart decisions in the field) chose desserts over full courses. Of course it's not going to work.

Try reading what she ACTUALLY wrote, which she subsequently explained further. "Think about that again:" ("as an officer candidate, who is supposed to" be able to COMMUNICATE clearly - which includes RECEPTION as well as transmission...). Also, going back to your reference to lying above, provide me, please, an example wherein Celticgirl lied about anything.

Fellas, don't cheat okay? You are going into the CF hopefully wanting this to be your #&#&@^ career! If they are paying you to iron your clothes and keep your room clean and everything in it clean, why wouldn't you?

The last time that I checked, Maid was not a trade.

On BMOQ, one is learning to be an effective leader. That includes such things as time management, prioritization of effort, and imaginative solutions to problems.

If candidates were simply being paid to iron clothes and maintain rooms and equipment, a lot of time and effort money could be saved by cutting out the stuff of lesser importance.

And the physical ability to store a few non-use inspection-only items would be completely non-existant. If staff wanted to, they could easily ensure that nobody had an extra bar of soap or can of shaving cream. Think about it.

Yes, I said "think".

Believe me, the best militaries in the world have always been the most disciplined. Don't lie, don't cheat, just do what they say.

Blind discipline will not win anything, but there have been some excellent cheaters who have won some significant and well-known battles through the ages.

I think that Celticgirl has far more going for her than you have, unless you wake up.

Enjoy your shortcut-less BMOQ, and your eventual but obviously-guaranteed sainthood.

Oh - and anybody here who might be a course-mate of his: Let us know how long he lasts before breaking down and "cheating", in even the most minor of ways.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

WOW!

I can't believe something as simple as a 'shadow shave kit' has stirred up this hornets nest. 

I better go to Supply and get issued some safety goggles; the amount of mud being thrown around by some people is amazing.

I noticed that most some of the mud-slinging is coming from people who have less TI (thats Time-In for you newbies...) than the friggin' socks I am wearing today.

:

 

[romeokilo]

Yeah,

I think I will concede this round to all the armchair internet warriors here. I cannot believe so many people defending someone who condones cheating so openly.

Sainthood or not, I am done with these forums.

Armchair-warriors 1, Romeokilo 0. Good luck with your endeavours.

 

[Kat Stevens]

I think my previous post came off all wrong.  What I tried to say was, that instructors expect you to try finding an easier way, and are almost disappointed if you don't at least put in some effort.  It's a cat-and-mouse game, just know that they can pounce at any time if playing with you gets boring.  On my JLC, back in the mists of time, we kept on getting jacked for the washrooms.  When my turn came as course senior, I had the washroom guys spray a mild bleach solution out of a windex bottle in the air 5 mins before inspection... no jacking that day, as the washrooms smelled a lot cleaner than they probably were.  After the inspection my Course WO said to me "I wondered how long it would take for someone to do the ol' bleach spray trick."  I was probably the oldest guy on the course, and came through when inspections were far more, umm, vigorous.  By the way, the real, but unspoken, motto of the engineers is "there must be an easier way."

 

[gcclarke]

Since I was curious, I had a quick look through the CFLRS student standing orders, and wasn't able to find anything that particuraly prohibited the use of ghost kit. Nor anything stating that students shall not sleep above their covers.

Not that I suggest trying to be a rules lawyer with your DS if / when you get caught.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Since I was curious, I had a quick look through the CFLRS student standing orders, and wasn't able to find anything that particuraly prohibited the use of ghost kit. Nor anything stating that students shall not sleep above their covers.

Not that I suggest trying to be a rules lawyer with your DS if / when you get caught.

Quick story.  Basic Trg, '89.  Week 7, CI's (Chief Instructor, a Lt Cmdr who did the inspection in his whites ffs) Inspection.  The night before the inspection, we were told by our Squad NCO in our nightly O Gp "...and you WILL sleep under your blankets tonight!".

So, following orders, we all took turns sleeping on the floors under the bottom bunk (which was *under our blankets*, as per orders) as we were on "shifts" doing kit and quarters the entire night before our Pennant Inspection.

We passed the inspection, and got our Platoon Pennant. 

 

[Journeyman]

Sainthood or not, I am done with these forums.

Armchair-warriors 1, Romeokilo 0. Good luck with your endeavours.

Wow, that was pretty theatrical; I miss you already  :'(

 

[Loachman]

I bet that you haven't really left...

I cannot believe so many people defending someone who condones cheating so openly.

You completely fail to understand.

It's not cheating when it's condoned/expected (to a degree, at least) by course staff.

Any twit can blindly follow rules that may or may not make sense.

Officer candidates are not evaluated on blindly following rules.

If you're unaware who Douglas Bader is, look him up. He said "Rules are for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men".

Sainthood or not, I am done with these forums.

Quitter.

And before you showed me where Celticgirl allegedly lied, too.

Armchair-warriors 1, Romeokilo 0. Good luck with your endeavours.

"Armchair-warriors", eh?

Got a mirror handy?

Some of us not taking your side have actually been doing this for a few years - check our profiles - unlike you. You might want to consider that perhaps, just perhaps, we might have a clue or three about these things that you have yet to learn, and maybe never will.

 

[GAP]

According to Jackie Gleason (aka: Fats Domino) "The past is far better remembered than lived"

that being the case, I distinctly remember Marine Boot Camp (not BMQ!!) as all daisys and roses..(we were the ditzy daisys and the DI's all wore Rose Colored Glasses... ;D )

 

[gaspasser]

I've been keeping an eye on this one since post 1, and did some backtracking to keep up on the conversation.  Obviously, there are some "old times" here with some very good advise on how to get thru life on BMQ; and some not too smart, overly pc airheads who won't listen.  Most of what these guys are telling you is not cheating but how to get thru the day without extra work, drill or further attention from the DS's.  Shadow shaving kits, shadow soap and toothbrush, rubber bands to keep the sheets tight, et al are just ways to keep you out of the main sites of the DS. And make your day a bit more easier. 
Back in the day, when Cornwallis was a Recruit Depot, many of my platoon mates bunks and lockers went flying out the window because their kit was substandard.  My section lucked in because we were on the bottom floor, but you could see it in the MCpl's faces that they wanted to.  This was also the time of starting to be pc and a kinder-gentler way of doing things.  I've seen the face of "I should just punch you and be done with it" many times.  And we all said..."Thank you for improving my slack and idle body and mind, Master Corporal."
Folks, the whole process is a game, play the game and be done with it.  Don't play the game, well, just move on to something else that's less stressful in your life. 
All these games are there to improve your ability to adapt to change, teach you tolerance, and build charactor.  IF you don't want some, WalMart is hiring    :threat: 
BYTD :2c:

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Back in the day, when Cornwallis was a Recruit Depot, many of my platoon mates bunks and lockers went flying out the window because their kit was substandard.

And we all said..."Thank you for improving my slack and idle body and mind, Master Corporal."

Ahh, the memories!  ;D

 

[benny88]

Are we on this ghost kit thing again?

There are many persons on this site who are riding quite a high horse about "cheating" (even in the face of comments from people with more experience by an order of magnitude) , and to those people, take notice:

The attitude that you will try your best will get you far, but not as far as a little common sense. If you think an extra bar of soap is cheating, you have none. I suggest you pick it up before CFLRS, they don't sell it in the Canex.

 

[jacksparrow]

But had they asked you, you would have been knee deep in bull dung. And yes, by saying that you are basically telling people, "Hey umm, I cheated mmmkay, and never got caught. But mmm, don't do it mmkay."

You are a nincompoop. Like others have said on here, that is not a big deal, it was just a time saver and one less thing to worry about, when there are more tangible things like studying for a very important PO that you have the next day, when you still have section duty to do and can't go to bed until 11pm and have to wake up at 5am.

 

[romeokilo]

Ok, before we continue bashing me, let me say a fewthings.
1) I do not condone cheating, making it easier on everyone I agree with.
2) I am afraid of cheating for from what I've read here and seen on Basic Up, if one person messes up the entire platoon (often, but not always) pays for it.
3) I have nothing personal against anyone, not SupersonicMax, not even Celticgirl.
4) I am a nincompoop. This I will agree with because I have ZERO experience, and yet I talk the talk.
5) This will be my last post. I will post next in January, (if and) when I have completed my BMOQ. I want to walk the walk now.
To those I offended, I apologize. Never meant to bash either officers or NCMs.

Good day everyone, and good luck.

Now, let's hammer romeokilo some more.

 

[Roy Harding]

OK folks.  That's enough. 

There are differences of opinion here - as well as differences of philosophy, and that's fine.  The personal name calling, however, does not reflect well on ANY of you indulging in it. 

Stop it now.  Failure to do so will result in DS action. 

Roy Harding
Milnet.ca Staff

 

[Celticgirl]

Since I was curious, I had a quick look through the CFLRS student standing orders, and wasn't able to find anything that particuraly prohibited the use of ghost kit. Nor anything stating that students shall not sleep above their covers.

Exactly right. There is no actual stipulation against having a shadow kit. I would never suggest for a moment that our DS were stupid enough to think people didn't have spare soap and shaving cream. As I mentioned previously, they never opened our private cubbies during inspection. They knew what was in them, especially since some of us were dumb enough to leave a lock unlocked at least once before heading downstairs to meet a timing. (They don't throw your stuff out the window anymore, but they do 'fluff it up' for you a bit.  ;D)

Romeo Kilo's comments are harsh, but I have no doubt that his own DS will straighten out any attitude problem shortly after his course commences. Wait for it.

Loachman...cheers. And thank you. :cheers:

 

[Loachman]

Loachman...cheers. And thank you.

You're welcome.

But you can best thank me by succeeding this time, as I know you can.

And it may surprise you to know, Romeokilo, but I wish for the same thing for you - and that you learn something deeper in the process.

 

[Celticgirl]

You're welcome.

But you can best thank me by succeeding this time, as I know you can.

I can and I will.   

 

[chris_log]

I can't believe I missed all that, especially a forum nemesis agreeing with me. 

Good luck Celticgirl, don't let stick-in-the-muds get you down.

And for the record, 48th, I take offence to the Pratt label. Call me anything you wish except for the same name used by that arrogant douche on The Hills (I'm not that bad).