Marriage Breakdown - pension split

[NorthernHawk]

My very first post ever to the board...

I was medically released from the Forces in 1998, after suffering a serious parachute accident in 1996. My injuries required two surgeries, metal plates and screws to fix. The incident took place approx. one and a half years BEFORE I even met my now ex-wife. I am thoroughly disgusted that her lawyer is going after my Veteran's Affairs monthly award. I guess I am on here for two things- support from my brothers and sisters in arms- UNITED WE STAND. Also, I live in Ontario and I am looking to see if anyone has had any recent similar dealings with the incidents similar to mine.

Thanks, AIRBORNE

 

[prairefire]

I think that you are in receipt of a a VAC pension, not an award. It is very important that you make the distinction. They are not the same in law. Secondly it is up to you to make your family lawyer fully aware of the details within the Pension Act. While you were married and if you had children then you were in receipt of the marriage and child supplements. These child supplements will cease at age 18 or if your are the noncustodial parent. To have the child supplements continue there should be a line within the divorce agreement that says you will still be providing child support or maintenance for your children under 18. DVA will ask for proof of child support. The spousal supplement will stop at the point you are not cohabiting. If you have not reported the change then DVA may claw back the  overpayment and back date the claw back. Do not let this slide they are quite ruthless with overpayments.

The DVA pension is NOT a marital asset. Please review the link I placed previously. Review the case law references and read the whole thread. The case law appears lengthy but READ it. Remember this is just like a reconnaissance mission. Time spent in recce is seldom wasted. Surviving your divorce with your financial, emotional and mental well being is your current mission. You have rights and obligations as well as a duty to yourself.

 

[DovoNewb]

I had asked this question somewhere else, I'm guessing it was merged into this. Regardless, I've taken lots away from this and feel a bit better about the situation; a bit better about the situation.

I'll be passing this along to my lawyer.

 

[HWHarry]

Nearing the tail end of a divorce and my 26+ year pension will be split as will my ex-wife's 17 year nurses pension. Has anybody had any first hand experience on how this will go down ? I was talking to the folks at Pensions Canada and I'm getting mixed explanations. Is there a chance that my share of the ex-wife's pension can be reinvested into my military pension so that instead of losing 50% if could a lesser figure ?

 

[dapaterson]

I am not a lawyer.  Do not take legal advice from non lawyers.  Do not take legal advice from people on the internet.

That said, as a non-lawyer on the internet:  It may (and I stress may) be possible to have your lawyer negotiate an agreement where you surrender any claim to your soon-to-be ex-wife's pension and, in return, her claim against yours is reduced.

Knowing nothing of other assets etc that are involved, I can't suggest whether other options exist (surrendering home equity etc).  But this is a discussion to have with competent legal counsel, not with people on the internet.

Divorce is complex.  Every case is different.  Details that may appear minor to you may well be significant in the overall scheme of things.  Again, internet advice is worth precisely what you pay for it.

You may want to begin by reading the Federal Pension Benefits Division Act and its related regulations at http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/P-6.7/

 

[Occam]

I assume you are retired and are drawing your pension, though it doesn't really matter much.  If the pension division is approved, the actuaries will input some dates into a very convoluted formula, and it will spit out a number.  This amount will be paid to your spouse, and must(!) be deposited to a locked-in RRSP or life annuity.  Locked-in has a very specific meaning in this context; they cannot access the funds under any circumstances other than drawing a pension or annuity from it (after a certain age...55, I think).  The funds will not be turned over until an account number to a locked in RRSP or life annuity account is provided.  You will be expected to do the same thing when her pension is divided.  Your pension will be reduced correspondingly and you cannot buy back anything, either from your own pocket or from funds coming from your ex-wife's pension division. 

From personal experience, avoid pension division if you can at all help it.  Only you know what her pension benefits would be like for her 17 years of service; if the benefits are monetarily the same or close, there is no point to doing the split at all.  If your benefits are greater than hers, you can offer a lump sum out of pocket in exchange for neither of you making a claim against the other's pension.  It's all legal if it's written into the divorce agreement - you can wheel and deal to keep the pensions out of the picture, just make sure the terms get written up in the decree.

Some info on pension division as it pertains to CF Pensions:

Serving members (enrolled before 2007) - https://www.tpsgc-pwgsc.gc.ca/fac-caf/act/vnt-bfr/div-sep-eng.html
Retired members - https://www.tpsgc-pwgsc.gc.ca/fac-caf/rtr/pr-rm-div-sep-eng.html

 

[DovoNewb]

Can someone, with similar experience, tell me if  VAC pension/benefits are considered as "income/assets," and divisible when going thru a divorce ?? (I want to do some legwork before I start paying a lawyer.)  Thanks

My ex wife and her lawyer made a move on my VAC payout, but it didn't happen. At least in Ontario there is ample case law to back up the argument that she was not entitled to it because it is not considered income, it is considered a disability payout. Your estranged spouse will most likely try to get some of it, they all do....

All the best!

 

[Triforce]

I currently receive a 17 year medical pension. I'm on sisip ltd and cpp disability as well as vac elb for 90% of pre release salary. I will be losing half my caf pension to my ex because we seperated. My question is does any of the organizations I listed make up for the money I lose to pension splitting? Thanks

 

[mariomike]

I will be losing half my caf pension to my ex because we seperated.

For reference to the discussion,

Marriage Breakdown 
https://navy.ca/forums/threads/114479.0
2 pages.

 

[Triforce]

Thanks for the reply. Some interesting cases

 

[mariomike]

Thanks for the reply. Some interesting cases

You are welcome. Good luck.

 

[vet44]

I started receiving pain and suffering compensation after I divorced.

She doesn’t know I receive it.  I have two questions, if she looks into VAC programs she may catch wind that I may be getting PSC, how do I disprove her in that event, or how do I prevent her from finding out?  Also, if she did finding out, is that shareable or seen as income??

 

[garb811]

You could be playing a dangerous game depending on how your divorce settlement/order is worded.  If you are making any kind of support payments that are based off of your total income there is typically a requirement to report any and all sources of income. If yours says that and you fail to comply with it, it could be looked on very unfavorably by a judge if she finds out and takes you to court.  If you aren't paying support, there may still be potential for her to have a claim on some of it if it was back-dated to pre-divorce in certain circumstances.

If there is doubt, consult a lawyer who specializes in family law and get them to review the terms of your divorce settlement/order. You might think it is expensive now but it will be worse if you suddenly get hit with a judgement for arrears 5-10 years from now.

As always, the best source of information is from a specialist, not some random folks on the internet...

 

[vet44]

Definitely appreciate your comment.  I started getting it after our divorce.  How can she prove that I get anything at all?  That’s what I am asking.

 

[garb811]

Simple, she goes to family court, makes her case to a judge that you are concealing income contrary to the divorce order/agreement and gets a disclosure order.  She doesn't even need a lawyer to do that, she can represent herself.

Seriously though, go see a lawyer. You're playing with fire.

 

[brihard]

Definitely appreciate your comment.  I started getting it after our divorce.  How can she prove that I get anything at all?  That’s what I am asking.

You’re basically asking people to potentially help you evade the law.

PSC in most jurisdictions shouldn’t be subject to support payments to an ex, but it may vary by province. Don’t be an idiot, don’t try to game or beat the system. Learn the rules and stick with them- because when you don’t play ball with family court, the consequence can be a judge kindly helping the bat up your ass- sideways. Eating a retro payment because you thought you could hide income can be painful.

Talk to a family lawyer experienced in encountering veterans’ benefits; there should be several such near any major base. You’re probably alright on this, but you don’t want to chance it and be wrong.

 

[Sub_Guy]

I wouldn’t worry about her getting anything from you, since it was after the divorce.  However if you are paying child support, then I’d expect that to go up.

See a lawyer, eat the costs now, because the last thing you need is to be hammered with a big bill in a few years.

 

[B64_yq]

Hi everyone,
I need some help please,
In the process of getting a divorce, need to do the financial disclosure.
I have received a few disability awards from  VAC

Can people please clarify for me, what the actual rules and regulations in Ontario are?!? Please.

Do I need to disclose all information regarding my VAC awards? If so up to which point? Before seperation, date of seperation? Now?
Does my ex have a legal entitlement to my awards?

Do I need to disclose this information, and what I've done with my awards, ie, the accounts the money now sits on my disclosure? Because my ex's lawyer is asking for it.

I have many other questions, and I understand that some of these might have bee. Answered here already, but I am looking for upto date relevant information.

Thank you,

 

[garb811]

Hi everyone,
I need some help please,
In the process of getting a divorce, need to do the financial disclosure.
I have received a few disability awards from  VAC

Can people please clarify for me, what the actual rules and regulations in Ontario are?!? Please.

Do I need to disclose all information regarding my VAC awards? If so up to which point? Before seperation, date of seperation? Now?
Does my ex have a legal entitlement to my awards?

Do I need to disclose this information, and what I've done with my awards, ie, the accounts the money now sits on my disclosure? Because my ex's lawyer is asking for it.

I have many other questions, and I understand that some of these might have bee. Answered here already, but I am looking for upto date relevant information.

Thank you,

General rule of thumb is, it depends. There are a ton of variables at play, particularly if kids are involved.

You need to talk to your lawyer about this...if you don't have a lawyer, you need to seriously consider getting one, ideally one who has experience with dealing with your particular issues.

 

[OldSolduer]

I've never been divorced but I have a close family member who was married to a military person.

Get a lawyer.

From what I gather any VAC payouts cannot be grabbed by the spouse. Check it out though.