Improved Combat Uniform

[Rheostatic]

Black is no more "professional" than brown, no matter what Shawn says.

 

[Jimmy_D]

True but i am emplying on how much better a pair of shinny black boots are when they are bloused compaired to when they are not.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

So I have to ask this question. The front of the shirt, instead of buttons there is velcro or will there be a zipper employed? I can see a lot of Fabio (Flabbio in some cases ;D ) moments and a huge PITA situation working out in the field if it is the latter.

IRT the blousing issue/garrison issue, who honestly cares what the uniform design is? There are (C,S,B)SMs and (Area, Base, Bde,TF) RSMs employed for a reason. There will always be a standard enforced that a portion of the troops will complain about. The truth is there has to be a line drawn somewhere so we look like a professional fighting force and not like an African militia where anything goes.

As per the photo:

;D

 

[Hurricane]

I assume where it says that unbloused is an "option" that it will be on the discretion of the CSM probably only in "Field" environment. Just as Swats are.

 

[Teflon]

So I have to ask this question. The front of the shirt, instead of buttons there is velcro or will there be a zipper employed? I can see a lot of Fabio (Flabbio in some cases ;D ) moments and a huge PITA situation working out in the field if it is the latter.

IRT the blousing issue/garrison issue, who honestly cares what the uniform design is? There are (C,S,B)SMs and (Area, Base, Bde,TF) RSMs employed for a reason. There will always be a standard enforced that a portion of the troops will complain about. The truth is there has to be a line drawn somewhere so we look like a professional fighting force and not like an African militia where anything goes.

As per the photo:

LIFE JACKETS SAVE LIVES! DAMIT!
;D

 

[Matt_Fisher]

Hey, I've got an idea.. we could have a dress that we wear in garrison, we could call it "garrison dress".  And then we can wear our combats for the field?

You may not be that far off from what happens in the future regarding garrison/field training uniform vs. a true combat uniform.

FR fabrics would be used for the 'Combat Uniform', i.e. CF Hybrid Shirt, USMC FROG Uniform, or US Army FR ACUs/Army Combat Shirt, etc. 
Shirt would be the 'Hybrid' type design with a knit torso, and woven collar, shoulders, and sleeves, with sleeve pockets and Velcro patches on them.  Collar would be a mandarin stand-up type design, and the sleeves would have the ability to have foam pads put into the reinforcement area of the elbows.
Trousers would be a woven FR fabric, with the ability to have knee pads directly integrated.
This uniform could also do double duty for wildland firefighting duty if required.

Stock would be held at the CF Supply Depots and only issued out for ops as needed due to the higher cost.

For day to day garrison use, field training, and operations where PPE isn't required due to the permissive environment (i.e. Haiti disaster response, Manitoba Floods, etc.) there would be  'G/F' Dress (Garrison/Field) which would essentially be the Improved Combat Uniform.

I personally am not a fan of the ACU style shirt (the breast pockets are next to useless), but would have preferred a Brit Combat 95 style shirt with sleeve pockets, and Velcro instead of buttons, but the improvements to the trousers look decent.

 

[angry1234]

And wind pants rain gear etc should never be bloused. Agreed.

And cleanliness and looking neat is a garrison norm. I think we all know that. I, for one, will not stand for troops looking slovenly in garrison when they have the facilities and time to look their best.

And that includes blousing your pants (not wind pants or rain gear) when required. When CFP 265 says we can walk around with pants unbloused at any time, then its good. Until then, blouse them. Thank you.

So tell me why we should NOT blouse our pants?

You f****** loser!! who cares bloused or not bloused......our military needs to get into the 21st century when it comes to alot of differnet things. One being that there is a plethora of information, advice and so on which come from people who are not MWO and so on. I realize you probably have 11 tours to Bosnia, 4 to Haiti, 10 years in Germany and a Grade 10 education but this does not necessarily make you smart. Our army is tooooo anal....we treat our own like garbage, and this is why the CF has a wicked turnover rate.....because people hate it.

I am first to admit that I am proud of my Afgh deployment (withheld to protect my identity from the Regieme) and what we accomplished. I also will admit that I absolutely hate this institution and the anal retentiveness that accompanies it. We eat our own without due regard for the interests of troops....unless you are csor or jtf of course because they apparently get treated good compared to the morale of others.

Go take your drill cane and shove it you know where!!!!!

 

[aesop081]

You f****** loser!! who cares bloused or not bloused......our military needs to get into the 21st century when it comes to alot of differnet things. One being that there is a plethora of information, advice and so on which come from people who are not MWO and so on. I realize you probably have 11 tours to Bosnia, 4 to Haiti, 10 years in Germany and a Grade 10 education but this does not necessarily make you smart. Our army is tooooo anal....we treat our own like garbage, and this is why the CF has a wicked turnover rate.....because people hate it.

I am first to admit that I am proud of my Afgh deployment (withheld to protect my identity from the Regieme) and what we accomplished. I also will admit that I absolutely hate this institution and the anal retentiveness that accompanies it. We eat our own without due regard for the interests of troops....unless you are csor or jtf of course because they apparently get treated good compared to the morale of others.

Go take your drill cane and shove it you know where!!!!!

Nice first post. Your release date is tomorrow ?

 

[Pusser]

You f****** loser!! who cares bloused or not bloused......our military needs to get into the 21st century when it comes to alot of differnet things. One being that there is a plethora of information, advice and so on which come from people who are not MWO and so on. I realize you probably have 11 tours to Bosnia, 4 to Haiti, 10 years in Germany and a Grade 10 education but this does not necessarily make you smart. Our army is tooooo anal....we treat our own like garbage, and this is why the CF has a wicked turnover rate.....because people hate it.

I am first to admit that I am proud of my Afgh deployment (withheld to protect my identity from the Regieme) and what we accomplished. I also will admit that I absolutely hate this institution and the anal retentiveness that accompanies it. We eat our own without due regard for the interests of troops....unless you are csor or jtf of course because they apparently get treated good compared to the morale of others.

Go take your drill cane and shove it you know where!!!!!

Just not feeling the love here...

 

[PPCLI Guy]

Ah.  Another satisfied Royal (based on your timezone...)

 

[marshall sl]

Got the parts to say that to the man's face?? hmmm I bet not

 

[Tow Tripod]

I think buddy might want to join CSOR or JTF.Time for buddy to get out. Personally I would have had a better career with 10 years in Germany instead of two tours to Afghanistan. I mean at least we won the Cold War and the last time I checked the history books it was confirmed. Afghanistan I'm not so sure.Fulda Gap Secure Over!

 

[ouyin2000]

Wow. Someone certainly hates the Sgt Majs. Got jacked up one too many times for not listening to "the man's" rules?

 

[Snaketnk]

Unfortunately, his opionion is shared by a lot of people I know; the majority of the Pte/Cpls I know actually. It has less to do with people being anal and everyone from the rank of sargeant up treating us like children most of the time. Some of the most hardcore "I love the army!" types are VR-ing so they can go work in mines because they're tired of being degraded. There's the feeling that initiative is unwelcome, that questions aren't tolerated, you're ineffective without supervision, and thinking for yourself is a waste of time. It's totally off topic but I agree with him for the most part. We've had sections where 8/10 people have VR'd/not renewed their contracts in the last year or so.

As for the ICU, I'm not a fan of zippers, but we'll see. There's a few features I'm looking forward to, especially the new shoulder design.

 

[vonGarvin]

I think we should let the privates and career-corporals run the army, and do what they want to do, when they want.



:rofl:

Sorry, I almost kept a straight face on that one.  I'm trying to rationalise what the calendar date means when people say "it's the 21st Century".  Are people really such relativists?  But, face it, we of us in the army do as we're told, and we try to use a bit of common sense.  Sometimes. 

 

[Jammer]

Yeah, why not? Most already have an undeserved sense of entitlement already.

 

[OldSolduer]

You f****** loser!! who cares bloused or not bloused......our military needs to get into the 21st century when it comes to alot of differnet things. One being that there is a plethora of information, advice and so on which come from people who are not MWO and so on. I realize you probably have 11 tours to Bosnia, 4 to Haiti, 10 years in Germany and a Grade 10 education but this does not necessarily make you smart. Our army is tooooo anal....we treat our own like garbage, and this is why the CF has a wicked turnover rate.....because people hate it.

I am first to admit that I am proud of my Afgh deployment (withheld to protect my identity from the Regieme) and what we accomplished. I also will admit that I absolutely hate this institution and the anal retentiveness that accompanies it. We eat our own without due regard for the interests of troops....unless you are csor or jtf of course because they apparently get treated good compared to the morale of others.

Go take your drill cane and shove it you know where!!!!!

Thank you very much. I guess that maybe you know better about how The Canadian Army should work than I or any of my esteemed colleagues. I will tell you this - I treat my troops like adults and I expect them to act like adults in return - and that includes dress and deportment, which in case YOU forgot is one of the Sergeant Major's duties to attend to. If you don't like it - tough.
As for the 21st Century crack - I am there and was there in the 20th century.
You didn't read my post - I expect as the DSM of the Winnipeg Infantry Tactical Group - troops to be properly dressed. In GARRISON - in case you missed it - that means BLOUSING your combat pants.

The crack about education  - hmmmm - Grade 12 with some college courses taken. Not called for. You have NO idea who I am.

Two tours Cyprus, Croatia 93 (Medak) and Bosnia 97 are the only tours I have.

I am glad that you are proud of your service in Afghanistan. Good for you - standing up to bad people is what we do. I am not one of them.

Taking my drill cane and....well you know....I carry a pace stick now.

Now take a look at my icon and google the name "Mike Seggie".

Have a nice day.

 

[Spooks]

You f****** loser!! who cares bloused or not bloused......our military needs to get into the 21st century when it comes to alot of differnet things. One being that there is a plethora of information, advice and so on which come from people who are not MWO and so on. I realize you probably have 11 tours to Bosnia, 4 to Haiti, 10 years in Germany and a Grade 10 education but this does not necessarily make you smart. Our army is tooooo anal....we treat our own like garbage, and this is why the CF has a wicked turnover rate.....because people hate it.

I am first to admit that I am proud of my Afgh deployment (withheld to protect my identity from the Regieme) and what we accomplished. I also will admit that I absolutely hate this institution and the anal retentiveness that accompanies it. We eat our own without due regard for the interests of troops....unless you are csor or jtf of course because they apparently get treated good compared to the morale of others.

Go take your drill cane and shove it you know where!!!!!

Wow...

[sarcastic rant]

Yeah, Dress + Deportment sucks, but it instills discipline. By this whiney tone, perhaps we should all have optional shaving too. Since this is the 21st century, as you so aptly pointed out, we are a multi-cultural world. Therefore, let us bring in the 1st Canadian Foreign Legion (1CFL). Since we treat our own like garbage, and you obviously know the problems with the C7 and C9, perhaps you should move that we should allow all members a $3000 allowance to purchase whatever weapon we want too so you can buy the P90 w/ red dot sight that you use in MW2.

Ever thought that the reason we have 'a high turnover rate' is b/c that is the nature of the army? We have young lads watch Black Hawk Down, go 'that's so cool!' and join. Then they find out that most of their time is spent standing in a dug-out hole, freezing their arse off in the arctic on a SovOp, getting chronic gastro problems from eating at a DFAC overseas, or so on. They realise the army isn't all the door-kicking glory they thought it would be. Even those high-speed troops in the JTF and CSOR still need to be shaven and have bloused boots when their enter their base proper rather than be in their areas. Funny how I do not read them complaining. If there wasn't a high turnover rate, then Corporal would be a competitive rank and with the attitude you have displayed, PLQ wouldn't even be considered an option for you.

It is very unwise to knock someone else's deployment history in the military. Assuming what a member on this board has for experience followed with mocking said assumption is dangerous and genuinely immature. How will you feel in 25yrs if a young troop comes up to you explaining how his single tour of Iran 2035 was so much better and exponentially difficult compared to your deployment to the Gan when in fact you know all that was done was him staying in Canada controlling a robot-soldier. You may have spent a few weeks in Panjwai or Maywand 'clearing out badguys' where troops in WW1 spent months gainining a few hundred meters of the line only to lose it the day after. Should I expect to hear how much more efficient you and your unit was versus the troops from WW1? Perhaps the army back then should have got with the 20th century and used plastic eyelets on their webbing instead of 'wasting time' to polish the brass ones.

If you and all your pride believe that our army is too anal, that we treat our own like garbage, that we eat our own, or that it is proper for a troop with hurt eFeelings to tell someone online to take a drill cane and shove it; if you think so poorly of the institution that pays you, then I might suggest you leave and get out. We don't need you in the army and I am embarrassed to know that such a spoiled, whiney brat made it through battle school. What you have illustrated is that you clearly want to be a long-hair, dope-smoking hippie and people like Mr Seggie have given you the right to express that freedom. By all means, take it.

[/sarcastic rant]

 

[McG]

I think the message has been sent.  It is time to leave that little rant behind in this discussion, and to get back on topic.

Cheers,
The Staff.

 

[George Wallace]

Unfortunately, his opionion is shared by a lot of people I know; the majority of the Pte/Cpls I know actually. It has less to do with people being anal and everyone from the rank of sargeant up treating us like children most of the time. Some of the most hardcore "I love the army!" types are VR-ing so they can go work in mines because they're tired of being degraded. There's the feeling that initiative is unwelcome, that questions aren't tolerated, you're ineffective without supervision, and thinking for yourself is a waste of time. It's totally off topic but I agree with him for the most part. We've had sections where 8/10 people have VR'd/not renewed their contracts in the last year or so.

As for the ICU, I'm not a fan of zippers, but we'll see. There's a few features I'm looking forward to, especially the new shoulder design.

Funny thing about that; in a years time many of them are walking back in the front gate in uniform as they found out that life isn't so great working for some civvie.  "Today you are a labourer who will train the  Boss' son.  Tomorrow you are subordinate to the Boss' son."  If you really think things are bad in the military, try a civvie job.  Even if you work for many of the Chain Franchises out there, you are often working for someone right out of High School with absolutely no life experience.  But hey; the CF sucks....Right?

So many have written on this site about their leaving the CF and missing the camaraderie.  I have seen many leave, only to return as the "Grass really wasn't greener on the other side". 

Remember: Never burn your bridges.  You may have to cross them again.