CF Short Service Medals

[George Wallace]

The Americans do have a lot of medals and ribbons, but at least they have to do something to merit every award, however seemingly insignificant.  Ask a guy what he did to get a 125 or QGJ.

Umm?  Brushing your teeth in the Field.  Passing your pers wpn test on Basic.  Are we going to go that route too, and create a Ribbon System (without medal) just like theirs?

 

[Teddy Ruxpin]

The Aussies no longer have separate medals.

Seen, thanks.  I was stale-dated, obviously.  The Reserve Force Medal and Decoration still appear on the Aussie website, but I didn't bother clicking the links - where it clearly states that the medals are now obsolete.

 

[riggermade]

I know DP was just trying to make some humor on the subject. As for the 125/QGJ/et al I never liked the paper, rock, just f**king give me it/ who did you brown nose to get it way.

My 2 rupees take it for what its worth.

I agree Sapper should have been all or nobody receive...I was at a unit that got rwo of the 125 and the fat cO at the time gave himself one...

 

[1feral1]

It's a copy of what the Aussies did.  The goal would be to reward 4 years of service.

My observation:  If someone is going to pull pin and decides to stick for one more year merely to collect a bauble, we probably don't want them to stay anyways.

I had a feeling one day that this would come.

Google Australian Defence Medal (EDIT:  Isee this has ben done), and see the qualifications and criteria. It has been well received by most.

Its a medal for doing your 4 yr bit, it originally was 6 yrs, but the RSL (our Legion) washed it down to 4yrs.

For those that are medically discharged or die before the four yrs is up, they get it. The Aussie gong's ribbon is similar to the CD.

Ours goes back to reg/res from 1946 onwards, so it was a huge project.

 

[SweetNavyJustice]

I think the idea of a new 'gimme' medal is ridiculous.  There is nothing that I think looks more stupid than when you see a guy who has a chest full of armour and has never left the country!  (Can 125, Queens Jub, St. John's, CD, etc...).  I don't say this to disrespect people who have those awards because I'm sure some of them received them for their service as opposed to those who played the 'nominate me, I'll nominate you' game. 

We have a service medal to demonstrate dedicated service, and we don't need one for those who served one year over the minimum NCM contract.  Can you imagine, it would mean that all of the officers coming out of RMC would get their commission and a medal on parade right before walking under the arch. 

Just my thoughts.

 

[1feral1]

Another reason, to my mind, why we should (as the Aussies have done) have separate LS medals for Regulars and Reservists.

As for this one, methinks that this may partially be driven by a desire amongst some (Honoraries?) to have confetti on their uniforms where there would otherwise be none.  Then again, maybe it's just me... >

Hey Black, you've done your homework. Good on ya!

Back in the 90's the two different medals stopped being issued, and the new ADFLSM came in. Now one medal for  both ARA/AGR.

For the AGR, with the ADM, you can have 10 yrs in, but if you are not 'efficient' with parading a mininum set of days each year (includes a 16 day ex (like a MILCON) and not meeting other criteria, you don't get it, same goes with the ADFLSM, you must be 'efficient' for 15 yrs to get it. If not you don't. So, you just don't get one given for being in. Its earned. In the AGR, you must apply through your BOR, they do the legwork on seeing if you qualify for both the ADM and the ADFLSM medals. In the ARA, the medals come automatically, and you get a suprise on a morning parade. We have a a big parade this Thursday, and have been warned to drink plenty of water before hand, meaning it will be a long one.

Teddy has posted the ADM criteria, and if you go to that site, search for the Australian Defence Force Long Service Medal and have a look.

These are medals, awards given to those who earn them, ya we can joke around sure, but at the end of the day, its something to pass on to your kids, and should be appreciated. All my gongs, even my 125, I apprecaite, and I am proud of very much, as I am with my Iraq campaign medal and AASM w/bar.

Should this new CF medal come to fruition, yes I will apply for it. Yes I will have it court mounted with the others.

Regards,

Wes

Cheers,

Wes

 

[George Wallace]

I think the idea of a new 'gimme' medal is ridiculous.  There is nothing that I think looks more stupid than when you see a guy who has a chest full of armour and has never left the country! ..............................................  Can you imagine, it would mean that all of the officers coming out of RMC would get their commission and a medal on parade right before walking under the arch. 

Just my thoughts.

Not to mention Cpls.  We can call it the "Cpl's Medal".

          Four years and you get two chevrons and a medal to put on your DEUs.

 

[1feral1]

However, in typically Canadian fashion, we must ensure that no regulation, order or directive is interpreted or applied to treat the Regular and Reserve Force equally and fairly.  Therefore, I ask:

Now, how do we define 4 "years" of service?  Do we award this for four calendar years of service or four cumulative years of service?

A Class "A" Reservists is typically authorized to parade 37.5 days per year.  If he maxes out attendance, he could potentially earn this medal with:

a. 150 days of cumulative days service over four calendar years; or
b. Four cumulative years of service (365 X 4) over 38.5 calendar years?

Before anyone dogpiles on me and if you think I'm being faceitious whit this, I am not.  This very question has been floating around NDHQ the last few months regarding the calculation of Reserve Class "A" time towards CD eligibility.  One school of thought says 12 "calendar years" of service.  Another says 12 "cumulative years of full time equivalent" service , wherein Class "A" time is valued in the same manner as for Class "C" IPC, Reg F TCP and RFPP eligibility at 1/4 time.  Based on the latter, a Class A Reservist who parades diligently, 37.5 days per year, every year, could take up to 467.2 years to accrue 12 "cumulative" years of "full time equivalent" service.

I wonder if the enabling regulations have been drafted yet????

Is there anyone who ever did the mininum and got anywhere? He would be released on an admin burden ticket.

What about promotion and trades courses, plus summer service etc. If a guy did the mininum, he would never get a hook, or get past OCDT. I don't buy that for a second.

 

[1feral1]

Does anyone have a link for more info on this medal. I can't find one.

Cheers,

Wes

 

[dapaterson]

Wes:

It doesn't exist - it's the hobby-horse of some Honoraries; they have been pursuing it for a number of years.  They saw the spike in releases at the three-year point and decided this would make a fine retention tool.

What they ignore is that the Reg Force initial engagement was for 3 years (now moving to variable length IEs) - so naturally attrition was high at the 3 year mark - it's when the contracts run out.

 

[Royal]

I think that the main focus should not be on the medal, but on the criteria for who gets it.  There should be no serving member receiving this.  Those four years go towards the CD.  This should be a retiremnt medal for those who do not stay in long-enough.  It would improve the Depart with Dignity program and be a way of saying thank-you.

As for the PRes component, I am a proponent of the Aussi method, you need to have a set minimum number of days and exercises befor you get the entitlement.  For some it could be 4 calendar years because they love that s&%t, and for others it could take longer as they mark time.  The CD entitlement would then need to be re-alligned for the Short Svc Med (what do you call it, we already have an SSM?) so that you get one or the other, but not both until you had done the time for both.

Last point, how many clasps could you get on the Short Svc Medal??

 

[Sub_Guy]

Good Lord people, its a good thing I have shares with Scott paper products, with the amount of moaning and dripping that is taking place on this thread my dividends are sure to be huge this year.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with a 4 year service medal, there is nothing wrong with being recognized for something you have accomplished.  If they want to hand out 4 year medals then go for it!  It's just something to pass down to my kids when I punch out.

Now handing out medals to a selected few (125, QGJ medals), either all serving members get them, or no one gets them.

 

[George Wallace]

Good Lord people, its a good thing I have shares with Scott paper products, with the amount of moaning and dripping that is taking place on this thread my dividends are sure to be huge this year.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with a 4 year service medal, there is nothing wrong with being recognized for something you have accomplished.  If they want to hand out 4 year medals then go for it!   It's just something to pass down to my kids when I punch out.

Now handing out medals to a selected few (125, QGJ medals), either all serving members get them, or no one gets them.

 

Seems to me that the only reason all serving members did not get the 125, QGJ, etc. was because it was too expensive.  Now we want to give out a medal for four years, a medal for being wounded, a CIB, and how many other bobbles because a younger generation now merits a person's worth on the salad on their uniform.  My how times have changed.  Where has all the money come from?

 

[Dirty Patricia]

Good Lord people, its a good thing I have shares with Scott paper products, with the amount of moaning and dripping that is taking place on this thread my dividends are sure to be huge this year.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with a 4 year service medal, there is nothing wrong with being recognized for something you have accomplished.  If they want to hand out 4 year medals then go for it!  It's just something to pass down to my kids when I punch out.

Now handing out medals to a selected few (125, QGJ medals), either all serving members get them, or no one gets them.

My point exactly.

 

[Dirty Patricia]

  a medal for being wounded, a CIB, and how many other bobbles because a younger generation now merits a person's worth on the salad on their uniform.  My how times have changed. 

A bit bitter perhaps?  The "previous" generation received a medal for eating bratwurst and drinking beer, perhaps the "younger" generation should get something for combat.

 

[George Wallace]

A bit bitter perhaps?  The "previous" generation received a medal for eating bratwurst and drinking beer, perhaps the "younger" generation should get something for combat.

:

Yeah!  Right!

 

[Disenchantedsailor]

too many people watching American movies thinking they deserve a medal for 6 months svc without contracting a social disease, come on really, we give out a short svc medal, than what, saved the most money, golf with the career mgr, polish the co's helmet and so on. Canada is one of the last militaries left that don't hand out medals as "sorry you didn't get promoted" consolation prizes. my thoughts

 

[1feral1]

too many people watching American movies thinking they deserve a medal for 6 months svc without contracting a social disease, come on really, we give out a short svc medal, than what, saved the most money, golf with the career mgr, polish the co's helmet and so on. Canada is one of the last militaries left that don't hand out medals as "sorry you didn't get promoted" consolation prizes. my thoughts

Most British Commonweath countries work along the same margines for medals. The UK, Australia, NZ, Canada etc are about the same. It was not that long ago (pre SSM days) that in both Canada and Australia one could do 30 yrs and only have a CD w/clasps.

This new CF medal (if it happens) cheapens nothing. It gives recogniton for those who served in peace and war inside of four years. There is nothing wrong with that.

Does not one still get an SSM with a complete tour of Alert?

The phobia of Canada going the way of our US neighbours is just plain paranoia. The US have a different awards system, and it is part of their military culture. We shoud not knock it or ridicule it. It shows a lack of not only understanding and respect, but lack of professionalism.

Seems many of the uninfomred have a cheap view of the US Purple Heart for example (mislead by movies - left on beds and given for a cut shaving etc). They are not just handed out for anything. I was at a 'orders' PH ceremony at FOB Union III, and how its done, seeing one awarded, made my hair stand on end. It was truly honourable. There is nothing cheap about it for a second. Those that think so should be ashamed. I felt privillaged just to watch this, and I left there feeling rather humble to boot.

This new CF medal is just one medal, not 10, nor will it lead to more similar ones. 

The Australian ADM also works as an incentive for retainment of troops, so it helps keeping the numbers up. For some it matters, others don't really care. 

My 2 cents.

Wes

 

[George Wallace]

True Wes, but with the current Political climate and a younger generation who weren't raised the same with the same morals, ethics, etc. as you, there may be some cause for that paranoia.  Is it really that important?  Will the world end if we do or not?  Nope.  Do we degrade our current Honours System by "cheapening it"?  Perhaps.  Will it change how you look at yourself in the mirror on Nov 11?  Probably not.  Do some people need this to make their opinions of their manhood/womanhood improve?  Perhaps.  I look for honesty and loyalty in people I meet.  What they wear as decoration on a uniform really has little affect on that.  I do despise liars, thieves and posers, though; and this only provides more opportunities for such low life to impersonate 'professionals'.  Those people I have no time for, and I have met one or two in my Service, who have used such devices as Operational Para Wings on their CFs, when they didn't even have Basic Para, to impress others.  Badges and medals don't make the man; the man does.

 

[medaid]

I think the idea is neat. Do I really care if I get one or not? Not really.

Service is service. At the end of the day I have my pride, and honour. That suits me just fine.