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CF advertising at school

Aislinn

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I'm a volunteer on the student union board at my college. I'm also in the process of recruiting in the Canadian army. Because of this, I had some rather interesting issues at my last student union meeting. We have advertising in washrooms on campus (always a controversial issue, for some reason), but the latest is to make this advertising slightly more palatable to the student body. They way the union wants to go about this is by banning some types of advertsing: homophopic, overtly sexist, and anything to do with the Canadian Forces. Can you see how these all go together? Anyways, I asked for good solid reasons why we shouldn't have CF advertising. It sounds like too many of my fellow students took Michael Moore's Fahrenheit 911 too seriously. The most popular reasoning I got was that advertising by the CF is wrong because in order to get help on paying for schooling, you must be willing to kill someone and that is immoral. Later on in the meeting, someone mentioned that we had to get tough on the administration and may have to go commando. And then she apologized for using a military term! Sometimes I wonder what I'm actually accomplishing on the board. Any thoughts on all this?

Cheers.
 
Enami, I'm afraid this seems to be common place amoung our enlightened post-secondary students these days. Its a real shame that an anti-military sentiment has become seemingly engrained into our post-secondary institutions. I guess all you can really do is grin it and bear it. Hard to do, I know, but you can't change the ignorant.
 
And then she apologized for using a military term! Sometimes I wonder what I'm actually accomplishing on the board. Any thoughts on all this?

Ask her out on a date. Women say they hate something, but you know what they really want.....
 
Sorry! As a female myself, I don't really lean that way...my fiance might enjoy that, though!

Cheers.
 
OOOooohh...give her the Col. Nathan Jessup speech.  Maybe that will put her into tears!
 
Infanteer,

Do you you have a link to this speech?  I would very much like to read it!
 
um...   Have you ever seen "A Few Good Men" with Jack Nicholson? If you have then you've heard the speach.

Here it is any way.

http://www.sccs.swarthmore.edu/users/00/jyang/quotes.html
 
Taking Michael Moore's advice? Anybody with half an IQ would realize that Moore is an obese stupid moron that does nothing but rant aimlessly about any political issue that will help stuff his fat pockets with more $$$. Honestly the stupid fat ##*&^% is getting rich by ranting and raving and not offering any real solutions to problems.

Enami, stay the course. It will pay off in the long run.
 
Remember that they sit in school working on theories of how life should be, taking guidance from people like Mr. Moore.  Most will find that life is very different once they leave school.  I hope that the soldiers who fought and died to provide the life the students now enjoy aren't too ashamed of what we have let their society become.  Remember, freedom isn't bought, it is only rented and the rent has to be paid.
 
Another Recce Guy said:
Remember, freedom isn't bought, it is only rented and the rent has to be paid.

Awesome....that is a really good!!

I would just point out that you are saying that the only reason that some one would join is to get money. I dont know about the rest of you, but I joined to serve my country. Secondly, dont be rude to them, inform them, about how the military REALLY works, we are not ALL killer commandos that go around killing everyone we see.

Also, tell them that the freedom they are using to make a decision like that is paid for in the blood and sweat of many soldiers before them, and more to come. Tell them how they are saying that protecting the freedoms of the civilians is something that has to be done, and why is it a bad thing to recruit in the school.

Like I said, the best way to deal with people like that, is to inform them of the truth.
 
Well..on the one hand, at least your foes recognize something quite a few people in the CF shy away from (including a few who have posted here from time to time...): the ultimate purpose of the military is to use lethal force, and all of us in uniform have a direct or indirect role in that. That is a fact and if you try to avoid it and argue your way around it, you are at risk of tying yourself in intellectual knots and looking like a hypocrite. So, don't bother hiding it: go with it as a strength. Nobody is forced to serve in this country, so only those who can morally accept the use of lethal force will join (or, anyway, should join...).Therefore our advertising is merely the offering of an option. The purpose of the military is not to disadvantage or harm any sector of Canadian society, as homophobes and racists intend to do. Instead we undertake to serve Canadian society as a whole, and we have accepted that at some point this will require the use of lethal force, including in an offensive manner. (Do not advance the wimpy, hypocritical argument that we only use force if somebody shoots at us first).Ask them how the massacres in Rwanda, Cambodia, and elsewhere could have been immediately halted without effective offensive action against the killers? By holding a peace conference?

Therefore IMHO, considering all of the above, we are a public institution, serving the nation at large. Thus, we have as much right to have our advertising displayed as the RCMP, the Coast Guard, or any other arm of government. Given the risks undertaken and lives lost on behalf of Canada, probably more right.

To me, that line of argument counters their moral equation of our recruiting material to the level of hate literature.

Secondly, it always fascinates me that the first impulse of so many university types is to ban speech or ideas that they do not like. This is a bit odd, considering that (IMHO) one of the great gifts and purposes of a university education should be the ability to appreciate, consider and tolerate other points of view. Instead, we often see the opposite. I suggest to these people that if they dislike military recruiting posters in their schools, that the correct approach is not to ban the material, but to let it be posted freely, then put up material challenging it. (That should be worth a chuckle-such stuff is usually not known for having much factual basis...).

These individuals might consider the outcome, and how they might like it, if someone in power was to ban their posters or stop their speeches, rallies, etc. because people didn't "like" them. They always imagine that they and their opinions will forever be in the majority and in power. IMHO true free speech is not ensuring that the ideas you like are heard over all others-it is, instead, to ensure that all ideas are heard. Once they have been heard, they can be attacked or defended or dismissed on their own merits. Unless an idea is clearly intended to urge hatred and harm to a group in such a manner as to cause criminal acts in our society, then I would not be in favour of "banning" any expression.

And, if none of that works, bash them with a pick handle, really hard. >:D

Cheers
 
Why not ask these people to come down to an information session at a local armoury, or have a member currently serving in the CF who attends your school and takes advantage of the 2000$ a year bursary and have them discuss with   your fellow board members what infact the CF does and try and find out why exactly they believe that the CF is such a horrible place *in their minds*?

I would love to hear some of the responses of these individuals, if you belong to a school in the GTA please feel free to Private message me, because i would love to take some time out of my busy day as a recruiter to come listen to the views of some of these narrow minded individuals.
 
the worst that can happen is they say no and stick to their opinions, its just a discussion, all it takes is a few points to put them in their places so they understand. I wouldn't even need to come in uniform because that might just make them uncomfortable, but just explaining it in a set of civvies would be more effective then doing it in uniform.
 
I agree with CFN and 2332. Confronting these people head on, with facts, is often a very good way to disarm them. Most of them know absolutely nothing about the military, and have never actually had a conversation with a person in uniform. They also tend to have extremely distorted views of world   events: ie: "US bad, enemies of US good", and again often have no grasp of the facts.

However, some of them (and in particular their faculty supporters...) may be very well informed and able to debate quite well. That is why I recommended that you do not get yourself out on some moral and intellectual limb which they will then saw off behind you. We are who we are, there is a meaningful place and role for lethal force, and we have nothing to be ashamed of.

If you aren't sure of these things in your own mind, you may end up getting eaten for breakfast, or else slipping intro that disgusting "C'mon guys--we're just happy harmless blue peacekeeper folks-give us   break, eh?" that makes me squirm every time I hear it.

Good luck-fight the good fight!

Cheers
 
Correct me if I run off on a tangent.

As a CF member and someone who has had some experience teaching I believe the CF should not be recruiting in schools and colleges. 

Many young people have a really distorted and unreal view of the army.  Posters and some ads can often be misleading and perhaps too tempting for some people, (the immature type).  Often they join and realise the army is nothing like they thought is was going to be.

I've done recruiting at schools and am always blown away by the consistent barage of immaturity, they are kids.  High school, early college, early university....they are kids, most of these people have not really lived and haven't walked the earth. I think the army would be better served by recruiting at job fairs, trade shows, and perhaps gearing recruitment to slightly older groups.  Targeting groups that have skill sets useful to the CF might work.  Target specific programs, (like they do for medic reserve when they target paramedic colleges and nursing schools).  From a reserve standpoint I've seen young kids who have never had a job, never lived away from home, some of them are just walking into puberty.  These kids show up and are wreck in days. 

Maybe this is a selection issue and the recruiting office needs to deal with it.  I'm sure advertising plays a role in all this as well. 

just my two cents,

DSB

 
DSB said:
Correct me if I run off on a tangent.

As a CF member and someone who has had some experience teaching I believe the CF should not be recruiting in schools and colleges.  

IMHO, schools and colleges are a prime source of recruits for reservists. Most people in my unit attend or attended in the past college or university, and if it wasn't for units recruiting in schools they never would have thought of joining the CF. I know this was the case with me, my unit came to recruit at my high school and that was why I joined. I hadn't even considered the military as a job option before this. 
 
"IMHO, schools and colleges are a prime source of recruits for reservists. Most people in my unit attend or attended in the past college or university, and if it wasn't for units recruiting in schools they never would have thought of joining the CF. I know this was the case with me, my unit came to recruit at my high school and that was why I joined. I hadn't even considered the military as a job option before this. "


I know tonnes of people get in via highschool recruitment, co-ops and such.  I still feel targeting young sheep can be problematic.  Why not target upperclassmen?  People with the maturity and life experience to really understand the importance of their roles? 

I joined young, I joined for all the wrong reasons...thankfully fate was nice to me and I ended up in a great unit, doing a great job.  I just think that a lot of young people, (high school ,early uni and college), don't even know who they are and what they want.  (I say a lot and not all mind you)  Look at the police, they look for a lot more than warm bodies and aptitude tests.  I don't know very many cops who get in fresh outta highschool.  Its all about walking the earth.  Just something to consider.



DSB
 
DSB said:
"IMHO, schools and colleges are a prime source of recruits for reservists. Most people in my unit attend or attended in the past college or university, and if it wasn't for units recruiting in schools they never would have thought of joining the CF. I know this was the case with me, my unit came to recruit at my high school and that was why I joined. I hadn't even considered the military as a job option before this. "


I know tonnes of people get in via highschool recruitment, co-ops and such.   I still feel targeting young sheep can be problematic.   Why not target upperclassmen?   People with the maturity and life experience to really understand the importance of their roles?  

I joined young, I joined for all the wrong reasons...thankfully fate was nice to me and I ended up in a great unit, doing a great job.   I just think that a lot of young people, (high school ,early uni and college), don't even know who they are and what they want.   (I say a lot and not all mind you)   Look at the police, they look for a lot more than warm bodies and aptitude tests.   I don't know very many cops who get in fresh outta highschool.   Its all about walking the earth.   Just something to consider.



DSB


I know some 30 somethings who don't know that yet either so.....there is also the Reserves which is a little less demanding (what i mean by that is that you don't have to sign a 20 year contract or anything) they can join the reserves, go to school and figure out what else they want to do in the long run. The military can be a great career!

Jane
 
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