Canada's military is broke ... again

[AIC_2K5]

http://www.rbcinvest.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/PEstory/LAC/20070926/COLANG26/Comment/comment/comment/1/1/2/

Don't really know how much merrit it holds considering its written by the former Chief of Staff of Ministers McCallum and Graham.

 

[retiredgrunt45]

Whats new?

 

[Greymatters]

Whats new?

When has the military NOT been broke? It seemed like every year we didnt have enough money to get vital things done - not enough money for courses, trips, liaison, ammo, exercises, food for troops during exercises, etc. (although there always seemed to be some slush money left over at the end of the FY for new computers and equipment).

 

[Spartan]

I wonder how much money could be found if we (collective) didn't waste so much.
We've all seen the waste that occurs when a course is ran - all the excess food wastage, office supplies etc.

I also wonder if budgets did not have to be used completely to receive the next budget. It's always interesting come year end where budgets have to be used up that large ticket items like furniture, computers are replaced - even when the existing fixtures are new.

I wonder if there was a way that the collective budget could be managed if there is surplus budget dollars per year in one area to be reutilized and shifted to an area that has encountered shortfalls (like ammo). All while still utilizing the allocated year budget for the CF (thus not getting affected by the use it or lose it mentality of federal dollar budgeting.).

 

[geo]

Err .... have we ever been awash in cash?

Units believe (wrongly?) that, should they not use up the $$ they were alloted, then they will be penalized the following year when the new budget comes out.

If a unit, by sound financial management, managed to end up with a surplus (be it for the cancellation of training ex, or just good sound decisions) the higher HQ should reward the unit in some way, shape or form.  Let the unit "indent" for a project that was deferred for lack of cash (or whatever).... give em a reason to show the surplus.

 

[Harry Potter]

Guys, we are talking undreds of millions of dollars here.  Re-using pencil stubs and re-heating soup in hay-boxes isn't going to change our cash flow.  C-17s, Leo2, Chinnooks, RG-31, etc...  this kit isn't cheap to buy or maintain.  And there is a war going on too.  No reason to leave money in the bank at the end of the fiscal year, and like my old boss used to say, let's keep going while the going is good.  While the stars are all lined up to give us more money, let's spend as much of it as we can.   

 

[Spanky]

"Let's spend as much of it as we can."..... sure but spend it on what is needed, not just to get rid of it.

 

[TCBF]

How to become a millionaire:

1.  Buy a broken commercial aircraft.
2.  Sell the engines.
3.  Bid on DND movement charters.
4.  Insert cancellation penalties into the contracts.
5.  Every time DND cancells or postpones, hammer them with the cancellation fees.
6.  Use money from 5 (above) to lease a commercial aircraft.
7.  Bid on more charters...

 

[armyvern]

How to become a millionaire:

1.  Buy a broken commercial aircraft.
2.  Sell the engines.
3.  Bid on DND movement charters.
4.  Insert cancellation penalties into the contracts.
5.  Every time DND cancells or postpones, hammer them with the cancellation fees.
6.  Use money from 5 (above) to lease a commercial aircraft.
7.  Bid on more charters...

So scary; yet so accurate!! 

 

[xo31@711ret]

Just my humble opinion, but gee, if we weren't cut to the freakin' bone in the 70's, 80's and on, maybe the situation wouldn't have been 'as bad' as it were.

Anyone remember doing an advance to contact on exercise having to say 'budget cut...budget cut...' everytime you squeezed the trigger on the C1 because there were no blanks to be had? 

 

[bilton090]

  Yeah I remember that, was on my C.L.C. in 88, We lost our voices from yealing budget cut....budget cut
          can LOL now !

 

[Harris]

I also wonder if budgets did not have to be used completely to receive the next budget. It's always interesting come year end where budgets have to be used up that large ticket items like furniture, computers are replaced - even when the existing fixtures are new.

The above is poor leadership and fiscal management.  I too see the buy, buy, buy in Mar, but I guarantee that at my Unit, we're buying items that we've not have the money to purchase otherwise.  For example some of the full time staff got new desks and as a result I got a hand me down (which I appreciate) to replace my 20+ year old desk (I know it's at least 20 as it is the exact same desk I used when I joined the Unit).  If Units are just spending money to buy new items just because the cash is there, and not because there is a requirement, then that is not on.

 

[GAP]

Complaining about how the budget surplus is expended at Fiscal year end is fine, but did you realize in a lot of cases, if the $$ are NOT spent, the budget is reduced by that amount for the next year on the assumption that you did not need it this year, so you won't need it next year.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

I don't know if its a fallacy or not but I have been told many times that if we don't spend our existing budget, the following one will be ammended to what we spent the previous year.  We always tried buying required items mind you.

 

[geo]

Hmph...
Fiscal year goes from April to March
If you have additional cash left over at the beginning of March, your new budget will not have been affected - the funding level having been established / finalized in the Dec/Jan time frame - after your unit CO has submitted his training plan for the coming year...

If your budget is cut, your CO didn't do a good job of selling his training plan & explaining WHY he's still got lots of $$ just prior to year end. 

Let's face it, if an internal unit course or a Brigade exercise was cancelled & there wasn't any time or resources available to reallocate, there is good reason to justify why the cookie jar was still half full.

 

[Greymatters]

I don't know if its a fallacy or not but I have been told many times that if we don't spend our existing budget, the following one will be ammended to what we spent the previous year.  We always tried buying required items mind you.

Having had to plan with that in mind, I always thought it was a ridiculous policy.  There are some items you need on a regular basis (i.e. PPNS) and other items that need to be replaced every few years (i.e. computer improvements and additions), and then other very important items that are one-shot purchases as they are required (i.e. wide-screen projector system).  We should have been able to save money from one year and have it put forward as credit for next year's use, not taken away and the budget reduced just because we didnt need it that year.  As previous posters pointed out, it only promotes wasteful speding and fear of a lower budget in the next year.

 

[c_canuk]

I've seen the march madness many times, I've also seen what happens when a unit spends everything before march... they get asked to substantiate why they need more money... then suprise suprise they get more money, march madness is a waste of resources.

sure everyone likes new keyboards and office chairs but you add that up across the board and it's a lot of money spent on luxuries when it should have been spent on training if the units weren't trying to hold back a bit of surplus to make sure they don't overspend the budget.

maintaining an inflated budget is wasteful when there is no need for it.

It's the same as units burning off all their ammo at the end of an exercise instead of turning it back in... wasteful, turn it back in so someone else can use it, that stuff is expensive, not to mention it wears the weapons out  and provides no training value.

that said the amount of fat to be cut by being a bit more frugal is just a drop in the bucket compared to what the CF needs to revitalize... but it still angers me when training suffers due to short sightedness

 

[geo]

canuk
I have witnessed many instances when it isn't the unit that isn't returning unexpended ammo, it is the stores that won't take leftovers AND credit the unit's allotment for what was returned.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

There is definitely a disconnect here because I too have been told that returned ammo doesn't go back into the unit allotment but back in the pool.

 

[geo]

loose ammo is not returned to the unit cause it has to be returned to someone where it will be inspected and repackaged.

For all intents and purposes, it's lost to the unit's allocation.... which is why some units were creating ammo stashes where they could get "at their ammo".