Baby Killer

[Foxman]

Last weekend I was out with some buddies, drinking and carrying on. One of the guys I was out with has been a buddy for 10+ years. He's a bit of a lefty but we get a long fine. He was chatting with another one of our friends and I wasn't really paying attention to their conversation. He looks at me, his demeanor changes to his best threatening look and he says: "at least I'm not a baby killer"

I couldn't believe it, I was completely dumbfounded. Normally I'm a smart ass but I couldn't think of anything to say. I "remembered" suddenly that I needed to be somewhere and bailed.

For context, this is one of the guys I went fishing with for years, our kids play together. This is the guy I call to go to Montreal for debauchery weekends.

When it's just some hippy at the corner store or some knob on the street, it's easy. It's been a week, we haven't spoken and it still makes me really mad, hurt and a little sad that I may have lost a friend. And then on the side, there are all the things I wished I had the presence of mind to have said.

Anyways, not sure why I'm posting this. Maybe it'll be therapeutic.

(On a side note - as soon as I left the bar, I ran into some guys from the unit and had a crazy-fun night nonetheless)

 

[PMedMoe]

I personally think saying nothing was better anyway, why justify that kind of remark with a reply?
As far as losing a friend, that always sucks but sounds like maybe he wasn't that good of a friend.  Or maybe he'll come to his senses and apologize.  :
Hopefully posting was therapeutic for you.

 

[TN2IC]

I would of called him a pot head...  opps did I say that out side of my head again...rats..



Don't sweat it bud. It's just words. At less he didn't hit you. That would of been of a show.

 

[Roy Harding]

Last weekend I was out with some buddies, drinking and carrying on. ...

No you weren't - you were out with some old acquaintances.

This type of thing is sad - but it's part of developing as you grow.  You're developing into water, they are developing into oil.  You can force the two together, but not for long, and never successfully.

I have three old civilian friends (who still are friends) left from my childhood days.  I know that they will never understand what being in the military is like - and they listen to my (very occasional around them) stories with respect.  Then we move on to whatever is at hand (fishing, beer, hiking, beer, building a garage, beer - you get the picture).  It's not that they don't want to hear my stories, it's just that they don't understand them.  I don't understand their tales of civilian work hardships either - but I listen with respect (usually while sipping my beer.)

We used to have a fairly large circle of friends when we were in high school - only those three are left - the remainder grow in an opposite direction than I.  C'est le guerre.

(On a side note - as soon as I left the bar, I ran into some guys from the unit and had a crazy-fun night nonetheless)

Ah - you found some more "water" to mix it up with!!  And so it will always be.  Military guys will ALWAYS understand you - even if they disagree with you on some detail or other (even if you engage in drunken fisticuffs with each other!)  Some of these guys from the unit will be your life-long friends. 

I have MANY friends from my service days.  We lose contact with each other, sometimes for years - when we eventually hook up again, we pick up right where we left off - as if the intervening years didn't exist - and we STILL understand each other (even if we engage in drunken arguments (none of us are into fisticuffs anymore) occasionally.)

Why did you post this here?  I'm no Psychologist or head-shrinker - but my bet is that you instinctively knew that in THIS virtual space, you'd be surrounded by military guys, who would understand what you were talking about.  And look what happened - you ARE!!

Good luck to you - and try not to lose too much sleep over the "oil" that you've left behind.


Roy

Edit:  added a forgotten word

 

[SoF]

This is the guy I call to go to Montreal for debauchery weekends.

Lets not be too graphic...there are women and children on this forum ;D

 

[InfantryGrrl]

Foxman,

I know you feel betrayed by what your "friend" said, but I'd suggest not simply walking away from a 10 year friendship.  

In his defence, while what he said was incredibly wrong, he might not have realised the effect of what he said.  I'd suggest telling him how you feel so you're both on the same page.  If you decide you still have to walk away from it, then do it after you're both clear on the situation.  You two might be able to sort it out, or perhaps you will decide that it can't be fixed.  Either way, closure will put your mind at ease and do those 10 years justice.  

I know how you feel though - I had a similar situation with an old friend of mine (one of my best friends actually, which was crushing at the time).  Its difficult when people can't accept it or don't even try to understand.  We talked about it and decided that it just wouldn't be the same any more.  It's still amicable, but we've gone our separate ways for the best.  Like Roy said, its like water and oil.  

Hope it works out for you.  

InfantryGrrl
 

 

[Devlin]

Roy very well said...don't think I could explain it any better if I spent all night in front of this keyboard.

Foxman...I know what your thinking I've been in the same spot as yourself. I have some buddies who are really good and respectful about things and they have questions from time to time, I do my best to answer them and move on.

On the other side of the coin I've had a few what I would consider good buddies just turn on a dime like what you described. We don't talk and don't hang out anymore and it's a real shame cause deep down they are good guys. At the same time I won't tolerate their disrespect and demeaning comments.

 

[Yrys]

Lets not be too graphic...there are women and children on this forum ;D

As if women don't have debauchery week-end too , pfft  : 

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

I agree with Infantrygrrl you need to let this guy know that he hurt you. He may not even realize it. He may have thought he was being funny. You may be surprised he may say something like, "Oh my God I'm so sorry...I was just being a wise ***...man let me buy you a beer!"
If you get an answer that is unapologetic or something like "well that's the way I think of what you do for a living" Then I'd say it's time to find a new fishing and "other things" buddy.
right now you're letting this eat you up....get it out in the open with him and then you can put it to rest.

 

[Loachman]

As if women don't have debauchery week-end too , pfft  :   

Next time you're having one, let us know.

 

[orange.paint]

I have to agree with Roy.I have been in the military a mere 7 years.Every year I go "home" and the phone call's get less and less to invite me out to go drinking etc.Having said that I have about 3 people that I can call true friends that grew up with me from birth on.However those highschool friends starting the day after leaving for basic slowly drifted away.

Now these are not bad people per say,but they are living their own life.Trying to figure out who they are in the world and what their roles are.Sometime's I'll bump into someone and chat for a little bit but really I usually don't have anything to say to them anymore.As besides going to the cabin,fishing or going partying our personalities have nothing in common.It was more or less our actions we engage in together (drinking,girl chasing)kept us acquaintances if that makes sense.

I also find army guys tend to sometimes talk TOO much army at civi party's.You always get the reserve guy back home shooting off his mouth about how crazy the 84mm range was to all his civi friends.A lot of the time they don't understand,and in turn don't really care.Me and a retired RCR Mcpl were at such party that guy was shooting his mouth off at.We just smiled at each other.

HOWEVER.I had never met this guy before (RCR guy).We had talked briefly and that was it.All of a sudden this guy comes out of no where punches me in the back and says "I heard your a f-in zipperhead,I use to live across the road from your hanger."in response"Ahh you must be a chicken..."Anyway that turned into me and him separated in the back (with the nicest lawn chairs and portable cooler full of beer)shooting the shit until the party was pretty well over.

I found the success to keeping those few friends is if they were true friends or just party Buddy's.As when we are young they are hard to distinguish.As I said I have 3 real friends.The rest have changed.....and more so myself.And really losing touch with the 32 year old playing guitar with a bottom E missing in daddy's basement isn't such a big deal anyway is it?Wasn't for me.

As for the guy calling you a baby killer,he's a civilian.Hence why I will never retire as I would be forced to have to hate myself.

 

[Roy Harding]

... ,he's a civilian.Hence why I will never retire as I would be forced to have to hate myself.

That's what I thought - now I are one - but not really.  My wife and I still shake our heads over "stupid civvies".

You can take the boy out of the Army - you can't take the Army out of the boy.

Roy

 

[1feral1]

No you weren't - you were out with some old acquaintances.

This is true. People change, and you'll just have to accept his stance. write him off if you must.

This happend to me on this tour.

I had a good friend named Scott, formerly a 3 PPCLI NCO, and before that a member of the RRR. I had known Scott since he was 14, when he was in Cadets, passed into the Militia, and then went on to the Reg F. He did a Snowgoose Roto in 1988, and did UNPROFOR in 1992. He stayed in the Regs for several years before getting out, trying on the Militia for a while, and then becoming an electrician in BC.

He was the best friend one could ever ask for, and when I had layovers in Vancouver (on my way to Australia), we would get togther, and he'd show me around town. We had kept in touch often, but the past few yrs, the emails died down, and with the odd exception, they stopped. I never heard from him, and when I did he was so anti-US, I first thought he was joking.

About 1/3 into this tour, I accidently included him on a group email. He did not know I was deployed. I got a rude response from him, and he went off! He called me a WAR CRIMINAL and a MURDERER, and he was serious. He ranted on for a few paragraphs, and told me he never wanted to hear from me again, and peace was the answer to everything. Sadly if only it was that simple, he would not get an argument from me, or any other real soldier, but we all know that wish will never come.

So, after almost 25 yrs of knowing this man, and being friends, we are no longer. I had to write him off. I guess I see it as his loss, and I accept him for who he is, and in reality, I wish him well, but living a lie, hiding one's head in the sand is not going to stop the war, or foreigners pushing their extreme revenge on the west, including Canada.

A few months on, this still bothers me, but life goes on, both his and mine.

Regards from Baghdad,

Wes

 

[midget-boyd91]

So, after almost 25 yrs of knowing this man, and being friends, we are no longer.

Hard to hear Wes.. I forsee a similar problem upcoming with myself. Each member of the family has a different politcal stance, and stance on the wars. The sister and I have already had a number of heated arguements about the "war mongers" as they were called. 

But I agree with what you said. Keeping your head in the sand will help nothing. This is what the world is like, it is the only one that we have and it is a responsibility to know what the situation on our little home really is.

PS.  How much longer is it until your sitting on the back deck with a beer now?  :cheers:

 

[1feral1]

It does get much shorter than this! ;D

I can now measure it in hours, although still in the hundreds, it counts down every day now.

Can't wait for the great escape of 2007!

Cheers,

Wes

 

[rosco]

Cu dos for keeping your head!
I truly can't relate yet but as a new recruit two questions have been reoccurring.
One, "but your not going to the Stan?"
Two "so do you want to be shot?"
My responce has not been as meetered as yours.
I have been replying with:
One "I hope if I'm needed I will be there to serve."
Two "I'm sure I will be better at my job then that. Here's hoping I'm a better shot then them!"

I salute your service "don't let the bastards grind you down"
I'm from BC... a lot of bong smoking hippies giving "us" advice here!
I trust in our training. I know your better then those coments.
Hope a newbe's coments can help
:cheers: it's Saturday!

 

[TCBF]

Why is it that every year, most soldiers seem to get smarter and most civies seem to get dumber?



We are on our way to becoming an Army without a country.

 

[FastEddy]

Last weekend I was out with some buddies, drinking and carrying on. One of the guys I was out with has been a buddy for 10+ years. He's a bit of a lefty but we get a long fine. He was chatting with another one of our friends and I wasn't really paying attention to their conversation. He looks at me, his demeanor changes to his best threatening look and he says: "at least I'm not a baby killer"



Well "Foxman", live and learn. You'll get used to being on the Short List. Even as a Police Officer there are certain people that Hate, Mistrust, avoid you and most certainally would not sit down and have a Beer with you. Also Childhood and School Friends seem to avoid and are suspicious of you. You should try being a MP or LEO or better still Internal Affairs, you'll see how short that lists gets. Just for doing your job and duty.

Like everybody here has said, for what ever reason, you are disrespected or insulted, get new friends, and don't be troubled by their lack of approval of your profession.

If they can't take you as is, then their not worth having as friends.

Just remember that there are a lot more of us who would be glad to sit down with you and have a Beer than those who would fault you.

Cheers.

 

[Yrys]

Hum, question : If someone is suspicious of LEO, shouldn't he be NOT suspicious
of Internal Affairs , since for a civi that the police of police ?

 

[FastEddy]

Hum, question : If someone is suspicious of LEO, shouldn't he be NOT suspicious
of Internal Affairs , since for a civi that the police of police ?

With regard to Old or School Friends being suspicious, its them wondering why you are asking this or that and why are you being so friendly and taking an interest in them. I think you get my drift.

As far as the IA Squad goes, its been my experience that LEO's drink and socialize with other LEO's.
However, IA Members are not officially excluded from that general group, but like the Provost of old, fraternization is generally avoided, hence even a shorter Social List.

Since the IA are watching the Police, they are not generally watching the public, the public would have no reason to be concerned. Now (if we had) a Secret Police, that might be a different storey.  :

Cheers.