anyone have a "wandering zero" prob with a No 5?

[gun plumber]

Any theories  as to why this is?Any experiences or gunsmith fixes?

 

[Navalsnpr]

What Calibre is it? The original British .303 or was it re-barrelled to .308?

 

[gun plumber]

completely original(except the scope and mount),1945 No 5 Mk 1.Bore sighted yesterday(DAP),confirmed today.Shot like a dream.Ringing the gong at 100 yds.
only complaint..it's loud and kicks like a mule!

 

[Navalsnpr]

what is the group size on paper at 100?  There isn't anything you can do for the recoil unless you shoot on a sand bag!

 

[gun plumber]

I was surprised.I can group 1.5 at 100 yds.never bothered at 200.Hopefully I won't be that far away from Bambie!(or his father!)
And that is supported on sandbags!

 

[Navalsnpr]

Sounds like it is performing pretty well then. I would have expected it to group around 2 MOA (2 " @ 100m). If its shooting at 1.5" @ 100, then I would say you have a good rifle.

The majority of hunters make their shot at less than 200m, therfore any rifle that shoots around 3 MOA or less would be more than adequate.

 

[kato]

Apparently the wandering zero was always a problem with the no.5 the Brits spent considerable time and money but were never able to correct it, eventually they withdrew it from service. That being said however I have never had that problem with my no.5 although I only fire it maybe three times a year for a total of about 100 rds.Hope this helps.

Kato

 

[redleafjumper]

I don't have any trouble with the zero on my No. 5.  When I am shooting well, it'll do near moa groups, when I am not doing so well, then the groups aren't near moa.  ;D

 

[Michael Dorosh]

I never even considered a grouping with my own No. 5 - kinda thought they took it out of service because no one could get a decent one.    Who goes hunting with a carbine anyway?  ???

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Who goes hunting with a carbine anyway?   ???

Michael,

A lot of game in North America has fallen to carbines, not just the No 5. Most game is taken at less than 100 yds, at which range, a carbine is perfectly suitable.

 

[kato]

I never even considered a grouping with my own No. 5 - kinda thought they took it out of service because no one could get a decent one.  

The problem wasn't grouping ( mine groups about 2.5 moa ) it was wandering zero ie. groups in 10 ring one day 5 ring the next day but group size remains consistant.

out Kato

 

[redleafjumper]

Kato,

What sort of sight do you have on the rear of your number five?  I have not found that the MPI of my No.5's groups wander.  The sight on mine is the click adjusting leaf sight (might be the millet pattern... have to check). 

 

[kato]

  Redleafjumper,
    My rear site is the standard late model no.5 two position flip apature( battle site down, click apature out to 800 up ). Reference my earlier post , my mpi dosn't wander but this is apparently  an inherent design flaw in the no.5  to quote Robert T. Shimek "With a significant number of the carbines, zero tended to wander, the gun shifting point-of-aim/point-of-impact relationship spontaneously.Extensive investigation was undertaken into the cause-stocks were recured,barrlel banding was changed ,the flash suppressor was deleted the stock was redsigned.Nothing helped. A final report issued after years of frustrating investigation, concluded the diffuclty unresolveable "

hope this helps Kato

 

[Michael Dorosh]

Michael,

A lot of game in North America has fallen to carbines, not just the No 5. Most game is taken at less than 100 yds, at which range, a carbine is perfectly suitable.

My humour is too subtle yet again...(!)  When I worked for a gun store we sold lots of SKS to hunters IIRC - not a hunter myself so I may be wrong on that, it was 15 years ago.

Not kidding so much on the No.5 - as much as I hated the FN being a small guy, thought it was fun to shoot my No. 5 mostly because no one was expecting me to hit anything with it!  I would be a lousy breadwinner if that was the case...

 

[redleafjumper]

Thanks Kato, I guess I was one of the lucky ones.  Perhaps this movement of zero is related to the heavy recoil and the use of a rubber recoil pad; it may also be related to the shorter barrel and build up of heat in firing.  Have you tried the rifle in a machine rest to eliminate any possibility of shooter error or reaction to the design of the rifle?  My suspicion is that a shifting zero has to do with some sort of change, either in the rifle or in how the shooter is holding or sighting with the rifle.  A machine rest should be able to show, in a few strings, where the problem arises.  Good luck.  Perhaps there is a solution to this problem that was overlooked several years ago.

 

[NavyShooter]

Please recall that in the time that the Wandering Zero problem was most evident, the military in the UK were looking at a large warstock of No4 and No5 rifles that were likely to be onhand for a while as current issue....while the rest of the world was advancing to using Self Loading and Automatic rifles.

The Wandering Zero may have been part of the reason that the No5 was dropped and the Enfield replaced with the SLR (FN)

Just stories I've heard from some Brits I've met over the years.

NS

 

[gun plumber]

Well,went out yesterday to have a few shots and just to see if this "wandering zero" is bunk or not.Had no problems at all. ;D
Looking forward to dropping a deer this season with it,then come spring,doing a little work on it,mostly restsoring the wood,touching up the blue,polishing trigger components and removing the mount and scope.So far I have to say I'm happy with my "blacklisted" little gun.

 

[kato]

Hey redleafjumper I've benched my no.5 and it groups 2.5 Mao consistently mine doesn't wander either ,so I guess we both lucked out.

 

[redleafjumper]

Sounds good Kato.  I quite like the No. 5 as a light and handy rifle.  I have not experienced any problem with a wandering zero with mine or any of the other ones that I have used over the years, though I have certainly encountered a few that shot poor groups with factory or loaded ammo, even when benched or rested.  A wandering zero indicates to me a lack of consistency or change in the rifle or ammunition, the actions of the shooter, or some changed environmental condition that affects the others.

 

[YukonJack]

Sounds to me like pressure point problem. Still have the wood stock? Check to see if there is one high point in the forestock. As humidity changes from day to day, the wood will swell and push on the barrel at this point, shifting point of impact. Other than that, I'm stumped.