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Public Funds to Pay for PT

Lumber

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Looking for actual fact, but I'm willing to accept informed opinion.

Yay or Nay, use of public funds with the unit acquisition card to pay for the following activities (for the entire full time staff):

1. Paying the entry fee to conduct Pool PT at a local rec centre;

2. Paying the registration fee to participate in a charity run;

3. Paying the single-class fee to conduct a cross-fit class at a local cross-fit gym;

4. Paying an instructor's fee to bring in a civilian grappling instructor for a one time in-unit lesson on unarmed combat.

 
Lumber said:
Looking for actual fact, but I'm willing to accept informed opinion.

Yay or Nay, use of public funds with the unit acquisition card to pay for the following activities (for the entire full time staff

4. Paying an instructor's fee to bring in a civilian grappling instructor for a one time in-unit lesson on unarmed combat.

I expect the pushback on this would “why donmt your source a close quarters combat instructor?” It’s a CAF specially with a better and approved curriculum. I would also suggest that a single session of grappling is not going to offer much value, nor will an external instructor likely be thinking of it from the standpoint of military use of force, the equipment we wear, etc. though if it’s more purely for some fun PT, then sure a few hours of basic BJJ could be a good time. Maybe look into whether you base has an existing BJJ/MMA club with anyone of high enough experience who could be loaned to you for a half day?
 
Lumber said:
Looking for actual fact, but I'm willing to accept informed opinion.

Yay or Nay, use of public funds with the unit acquisition card to pay for the following activities (for the entire full time staff):

1. Paying the entry fee to conduct Pool PT at a local rec centre;

2. Paying the registration fee to participate in a charity run;

3. Paying the single-class fee to conduct a cross-fit class at a local cross-fit gym;

4. Paying an instructor's fee to bring in a civilian grappling instructor for a one time in-unit lesson on unarmed combat.

CAF Sports Program is managed by PSP. Essentially, if you liaise with them and say "we wanna do pool PT" but it's determined you have no CAF resources to do so, you'll have the top cover you need to pay the entry fee at a local centre. PSP will likely have resources avialable from Ottawa to fund the purchase. Similar with cross-fit classes although that's a harder sell since it's hard to say you don't have the capability to do it.

For the registration fee to participate in a charity run, I'd submit an event request. The new limits are not restrictive, and they're not that hard to submit. I can't see why that would be denied. Your unit uses it's own money, the event request just gives top cover.

For grappling... the verdict is in, I have the emails to prove it, that grappling arts (BJJ, Judo, wrestling, etc) are all good to conduct under the CAF sports program. Technically that means you should go through PSP to pay for it, since you don't have any capability to do it yourself (aka no adequate instruction) and most staff at most PSP locations don't either. Therefore, there are grounds to outsource it. There's nothing wrong with public funds to pay for it, although technically that's supposed to be managed through PSP... it often isn't and when it comes to grappling, particularly BJJ, I tend to avoid PSP because they don't understand it.

Brihard said:
I expect the pushback on this would “why donmt your source a close quarters combat instructor?” It’s a CAF specially with a better and approved curriculum. I would also suggest that a single session of grappling is not going to offer much value, nor will an external instructor likely be thinking of it from the standpoint of military use of force, the equipment we wear, etc. though if it’s more purely for some fun PT, then sure a few hours of basic BJJ could be a good time. Maybe look into whether you base has an existing BJJ/MMA club with anyone of high enough experience who could be loaned to you for a half day?

Oh boy, here we go... :stirpot:

The CQC program unfortunately just cannot provide professional-level instruction, particularly on any kind of consistent basis... And the curriculum is not great even if it were taught on a consistently professional basis, and it also isn't very great at working with "the equipment we wear." (For example, according to the CQC PAM you're not allowed to do grappling with FFO on.... so that kinda defeats that idea). I'm not sure an external instructor is less capable of thinking about it from a military standpoint... it's not like our CQC program does a very good job at that.

A single session won't offer much value for actual skill development. But it can be useful for other reasons...
 
If told to pay at unit level out of PF then the card can be used but to be honest it looks a wee bit like you are doing a full-time staff outing that should be covered out of the unit NPF they receive for just such an event and probably don't use like most units.
 
CountDC said:
If told to pay at unit level out of PF then the card can be used but to be honest it looks a wee bit like you are doing a full-time staff outing that should be covered out of the unit NPF they receive for just such an event and probably don't use like most units.

I wouldn't call it a unit outing.

PT in the gym or going for runs gets boring. I love swimming, and want to run my team through a swim class (and not an easy one either). We're no where near an actual base, let alone a base with a pool, so the only option is a civilian pool.
 
Lumber said:
Looking for actual fact, but I'm willing to accept informed opinion.

Yay or Nay, use of public funds with the unit acquisition card to pay for the following activities (for the entire full time staff):

1. Paying the entry fee to conduct Pool PT at a local rec centre;

2. Paying the registration fee to participate in a charity run;

3. Paying the single-class fee to conduct a cross-fit class at a local cross-fit gym;

4. Paying an instructor's fee to bring in a civilian grappling instructor for a one time in-unit lesson on unarmed combat.

Try an exchange of services.

Run a 'soldier for a day' event for the fitness crew in return for them taking you on the events you want to do.
 
CountDC said:
to be honest it looks a wee bit like you are doing a full-time staff outing that should be covered out of the unit NPF

Event requests can be used to get approval to use public funds to pay for staff retreats, etc. I don't know the specifics of the plan but you shouldn't be using NPF funds for something like this if it's not something that is available for everyone to participate in (aka only full-time staff).
 
As far as I've been told you can't use NPF funds for an activity that's not open to all members- ie paying for X at a welcome home party for members on tour since its for someone specific.

Trying to get reserved to spend money on pt oriented things? Good luck.
 
Jarnhamar said:
As far as I've been told you can't use NPF funds for an activity that's not open to all members- ie paying for X at a welcome home party for members on tour since its for someone specific.

Trying to get reserved to spend money on pt oriented things? Good luck.

NPF != public funds, or am I missing something...
 
Brashendeavours said:
NPF != public funds, or am I missing something...

Non-Public Funds ( NPF )
https://milnet.ca/wiki/index.php/Canadian_Military_Acronyms#N
 
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