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Changes to the training plan for LOG O

Jodie

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Recently I was made aware that there are going to be changes made to the training for LOG O.  A letter was sent out from the Log branch stating that things were changing, but offering no real information.

I am in my second year of the UTPNCM program and will eventually be a LOG O, so I am curious about the upcoming changes, but cannot seem to find any real information.

Just wondering how or if these changes will come into effect while I am still in the training system and how they might affect myself.  I have completed BOTP, so I still have CAP and the LOG courses left to do.

Does anyone know anything about this?
 
Alot of trades are reviewing and updating their Qualification stadards and training plans these days. None of this will affect you until you go on your LogO course. This is most likely not something for you to worry about.
 
I will second what CDN Aviator has stated first get through your CAP then worry about the LOG O course.
 
Jodie said:
Recently I was made aware that there are going to be changes made to the training for LOG O.  A letter was sent out from the Log branch stating that things were changing, but offering no real information.

I've heard rumours to the same effect, but have not seen anything official.  The last Occupational Analysis (OA) got us what we have today, which is officers who are promotable to Captain without any specialty training.  Obviously there needs to be a change.  As a matter of fact I wrote a service paper on this back in 2001.  What shape the new OA will take, I'm unsure, but if I hear and/or see anything I'll post a link.  Log Branch site is down today though...
 
There is a certain member of this site that is on the writing board and from what I have heard lots of changes are in the pipes for this course.
 
As a (albeit late) addition to this topic, many changes are indeed coming for Log Officer training, both for LOCC and the respective environmental course (especially Sea Log, which appears to be undergoing a rather drastic change in their training courses, and it's not becoming any easier...).

The revised Land Log course appears to be including more 'modern' logisitics content in addition to being more 'army' (i.e. more substancial stuff then just bashing around Borden in Jeep Grand Cherokees).

All in all, the changes to the training are, IMHO, going to be a good thing for the Log branch.
 
I'm LOG (Air) myself, any word on changes to that end of the business?

Also, any information as to when then next Air LOG environmental course will be running would be appreciated.
 
Piper said:
The revised Land Log course appears to be including more 'modern' logisitics content in addition to being more 'army' (i.e. more substancial stuff then just bashing around Borden in Jeep Grand Cherokees).

Long overdue-the Army course was "tired" to put it mildly when I taught on it as an augmentee instructor in the mid 90s. In fact little had changed from the mid 80s. Part of the problem is that the School was never staffed or equiped to run true "Army" courses.

Sending all Army Log Officers to Gagetown for a common course was a good start.
 
NFLD Sapper said:
There is a certain member of this site that is on the writing board and from what I have heard lots of changes are in the pipes for this course.

Why are you outting me again!!??


All right for the Log O's ...

We are rewriting everything ... and have been doing so since September. The changes/updating of the courses goes from the bottom - right to the top. A complete overhaul if you will.

This includes Air Log, Land Log, Sea Log, Log Common, Tn, Sup, Adm/Fin - everything.

In September, those of us redoing the training packages and programs came up and got our marching orders - spending a week here going through the old & outdated courses. We've now spent the past 3 months back at our own Units redoing portions allocated to to us as individuals. Between myself and two others, we are redoing the LOCL (Army Logistic Officer - Phase IV). Specifically - I've been tasked as the SME for the Road Movement, DPs, Dumping Program, Commodity Points, Convoy Ops, Battle Procedure, Action On Drills, and have dabbled into the NBC/LBDside now as well over the past week.

Last Monday, all of us (for the entire run of Log O courses) gathered back here at CFSAL in Borden with all our work. I can't tell you specifically at what stage of completion any course is other than the one I was sent here to redo. As of Friday morning - 1000hrs - Log Officer Land Phase IV is 100% completed. The three of us have completed all Lesson Plans, all power points, all videos, all homework assignments, all PCs (X2 each), all ECs, all handouts, all Aide Memoires, all scenarios for the PX. All courses were supposed to be at the same state by last Friday morning, but I do not know if that's the case.

I do know this ... even Friday morning, I edited the Master lesson plan and forwarded up for authority to change one of my tasked portions. Seems to me that one should be learning the definitions and responsibilities of "convoy commanders, column commanders, escort commanders, packets etc" etc BEFORE they are learning how to effect their IED drills or get their convoy out of an ambush situation. I believe that changing the MLP will not be an issue in this case - it only makes sense.

This upcoming week - the entire of us all will be pulled together once again - finalizing everything and pulling all areas together into each respective course. I should be out of here by 1000hrs Friday morning and merrily back on my way to Gagetown.

After that, the entire rewrite of each and every course needs to go for official translation before it can even be considered for launch. It all goes to the translators in January - I've heard that March was the "optimistic" date for launch of new Log Officer training program. That remains to be seen and is determined by factors well out of CFSAL's control.

What I can tell you is this, that no matter what Log O course you are coming here for, once the new program is launched --- you can be guaranteed that what you are being taught is current, effective, and incorporates lessons learned from our current area of operations. The new courses are applicable with today's reality on the battlefield (vice the peacekeeping/RV/NATO in Germany doctrine of past courses) - they are incorporative of unconventional warfare vice the linear emphasis of courses that should have been long since past.

With that all being said ... I can say this "have fun in the field!!" and "know your IAs" because you'd best know your battle procedure (all 16 steps of it! ;)) inside out, and what the hell to do when someone says into the radio "CONTACT - WAIT OUT - ...." whether you be tasked as the convoy comd or the CP operator.

Do have fun ---- I'm hoping now that they do NOT bring me back here to instruct on the pilot.  >:D
 
Piper said:
As a (albeit late) addition to this topic, many changes are indeed coming for Log Officer training, both for LOCC and the respective environmental course (especially Sea Log, which appears to be undergoing a rather drastic change in their training courses, and it's not becoming any easier...).

The revised Land Log course appears to be including more 'modern' logisitics content in addition to being more 'army' (i.e. more substancial stuff then just bashing around Borden in Jeep Grand Cherokees).

All in all, the changes to the training are, IMHO, going to be a good thing for the Log branch.

Believe you me, EVERY one of them is undergoing radical change - and NONE of them are becomming any easier.

As for your comments about the Land Log ... go figure ... I'm ARMY eh!!  >:D Who needs to drive a cherokee these days? It's just NOT for me.  ;) (Now that I'm dating a bonified black-hatter and all that stuff). I love the field. I especially loved writing all the new scenarios  ... PCs etc ...

... Contact - wait out -


 
This is all good to hear.  In addition to that, I grabbed this out of the Career Manager's briefing.  The proposed flow of DP 1 for Log (Land) is as fols:

BOTP

CAP

D&M on common log vehs

LOC-C
With initial intro to fin mgt, procurement and contracting (Quartermaster's edit - current Ph III)

LOC-L
To include tac trg IAW estb replen doctrine and the addition of crew commanding of an AFV (TLAV or FFCV) and convoy ops in a high threat area (Quartermaster's edit - current Ph IV)

Specialty training
SCM or Tn disciplines

End of DP 1. Mbr to unit by Dec of that year

6 months OJT package
Fin, Sup, Tn, Mov, Foods

Advanced trg
Fin Mgt, QM, Mov, ATO, Fuels, postal


This looks to me like we will be in better shape due to the fact that they are trying to get back to training first, employment second.  It should allow for the new officers to at least have some grounding in theory prior to arrival in the platoons/units.  What I've been seeing for the last few years was young officers going to the units with very little training, then being shipped back to Borden with unit "quirks" or worse yet, being promoted to Capt on the strength of the Phase IV only with no specialty.

Let's hope this follows through, and thanks for the info ref the writing board!
 
Quartermaster said:
LOC-L
To include tac trg IAW estb replen doctrine and the addition of crew commanding of an AFV (TLAV or FFCV) and convoy ops in a high threat area (Quartermaster's edit - current Ph IV)

Doesn't it just all sound like so much fun!!  :)
 
[quote author=

This looks to me like we will be in better shape due to the fact that they are trying to get back to training first, employment second.  It should allow for the new officers to at least have some grounding in theory prior to arrival in the platoons/units.  What I've been seeing for the last few years was young officers going to the units with very little training, then being shipped back to Borden with unit "quirks" or worse yet, being promoted to Capt on the strength of the Phase IV only with no specialty.

Let's hope this follows through, and thanks for the info ref the writing board!

[/quote]

My experience was more than 2.5 years in first and second line field units including an RV , before I was finally sent on what was then LFFL-kind of late IMHO. Needless to say I did quite well on it. Then the career manager loaded me on a QM course after I had been a QM for almost a year and was prepping to deploy to Cyprus.......needless to say my CO thought I had more pressing matters to attend to.

The proposed changes sound like good news. Thanks for your input Vern, I was CD for a Reserve course one summer in at the school and it was a highight of my career, so not all augmentee taskings are bad (the second time around ten years later was another matter).
 
a78jumper said:
The proposed changes sound like good news. Thanks for your input Vern, I was CD for a Reserve course one summer in at the school and it was a highight of my career, so not all augmentee taskings are bad (the second time around ten years later was another matter).

Really, it's not so bad ... and I actually am really enjoying it. Making the course is one thing ... back as staff is another though ... ;) Actually, I'm sure I'd have a blast out in the field on this one ... I love this kind of crap!  Its the only reason I'm still in. :)

Today ... today I re-did all the Aeriel Resupply in sp of Land Ops ... tomorrow ... back to LBD NBC CRBN - Lesson Plans on op decon & formation level decon still need to be done.

 
Well doesn't that all sound like a hoot.

Now, where are all my notes from CAP on battle procedure et al... :P
 
Piper said:
Well doesn't that all sound like a hoot.

Now, where are all my notes from CAP on battle procedure et al... :P

No worries ... I've got a nice 'lil Aide Memoire included in their package.
 
ArmyVern said:
No worries ... I've got a nice 'lil Aide Memoire included in their package.

Thank goodness.

So how does it work then, with things like IA's, refresher training on the C7, C9 etc? Actually, what 'tools' are used on this course (I've heard training on the C6, 203, Carl G etc will be covered on this new LOC-L)? I ask because there will (potentially) be people coming onto these courses (at least for the first few) after a school year/OJT where weapons skills may have deteriorated (I know I'm currently a little shaky on C9 drills and IAs, it'll be 2 years since I touched a C9 by the time I go on LOC-L). Even with basic C7 IA's and such, people tend to forget such things while at school (I know the first few days of CAP involved re-doing C7 classes to get everyone up to speed).   
 
Sounds like some units are slacking off in the ELOC standards
 
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