Author Topic: General Election: Oct 21, 2019  (Read 39381 times)

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Offline dapaterson

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #375 on: October 07, 2019, 21:02:24 »
My impression is that Trudeau is running against Harper, and Scheer is running against Trudeau but not running for himself & his party.

Singh made a comment about it earlier tonight - something along the lines of "You're spending all your time on why people shouldn't vote for the other guy, instead of giving them reasons why they should vote for you".

It's been posted to Singh's Twitter account:

Quote
What we're seeing tonight is Mr. Trudeau and Mr. Scheer arguing over what is worse for Canada.

I believe we need to be fighting for what will be best for Canada. We need to demand more – not be scared into settling for less.
https://twitter.com/theJagmeetSingh/status/1181356724541968385
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Online Remius

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #376 on: October 07, 2019, 21:06:19 »
That debate format was terrible.
+100
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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #377 on: October 07, 2019, 21:10:07 »
I'm a political geek and I couldn't stand watching this "debate."  :boring:
I 'll see how the "after party" summary goes.

Watched a few minutes and changed channels. Might have watched more,
but ran out of beer.
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Offline MilEME09

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #378 on: October 07, 2019, 22:18:01 »
It was more like watching children bickering
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Offline stellarpanther

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #379 on: October 07, 2019, 22:20:56 »
My impression is that Trudeau is running against Harper, and Scheer is running against Trudeau but not running for himself & his party.

Singh made a comment about it earlier tonight - something along the lines of "You're spending all your time on why people shouldn't vote for the other guy, instead of giving them reasons why they should vote for you".

I think it seems like Trudeau is running against Harper because when you really look at what the CPC are promising, it's just sounds like a repeat of what Harper ran on.  Nothing really new that I see. 


Offline Hamish Seggie

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #380 on: October 07, 2019, 23:07:22 »
These aren’t debates. It’s a bull crap 💩 way of making themselves look good.
Political theatre.
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Offline Halifax Tar

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #381 on: October 08, 2019, 06:49:42 »
Yankees beat the Twins last night to take the ALDS...
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Offline milnews.ca

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #382 on: October 08, 2019, 07:20:08 »
Political theatre.
:nod: - and not just the debates.
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Offline Journeyman

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #383 on: October 08, 2019, 07:21:38 »
Watched a few minutes and changed channels. Might have watched more, but ran out of beer.
Yet some people still ignore the importance of logistics.   :nod:

Online Remius

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #384 on: October 08, 2019, 08:09:44 »
Yankees beat the Twins last night to take the ALDS...

The debate gave me ALDS
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Offline GR66

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #385 on: October 08, 2019, 10:52:48 »
Painfully watched the gong show with my 23 year old son.  Afterward he said he'll have to look over the NDP platform in more detail as Jagmeet Singh was the only leader he didn't want to strangle after it was done.

That could potentially be a bid sign for the Liberals if a significant number of people on the left wing of the party's supporters bleed away to the NDP.

Online Remius

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #386 on: October 08, 2019, 10:55:57 »
To be honest I have never voted NDP.  But that may become a real choice for me if this keeps up. 
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Offline MilEME09

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #387 on: October 08, 2019, 11:33:44 »
After last night, Orange Crush round two would be great to see. Say a CPC minority with the NDP in opposition
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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #388 on: October 08, 2019, 11:49:10 »
Shakespeare had it right:

"It is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.”
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Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #389 on: October 08, 2019, 12:23:00 »
I think it seems like Trudeau is running against Harper because when you really look at what the CPC are promising, it's just sounds like a repeat of what Harper ran on.  Nothing really new that I see.

Trudeau is running against the provinces and seems to be an agent of the United Nations or, more likely, bucking for 'Secretary General'.

I'd be happy to send him on his way via magic carpet, which would be culturally appropriate for a cultural appropriator :)
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Offline MilEME09

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #390 on: October 08, 2019, 12:29:27 »
Trudeau is running against the provinces and seems to be an agent of the United Nations or, more likely, bucking for 'Secretary General'.

I'd be happy to send him on his way via magic carpet, which would be culturally appropriate for a cultural appropriator :)

The fact he is fighting the provinces shows he doesn't have the backing of the Canadian people, which divides the country further. We need a leader who tries to bridge the gap and communicate and work with the provinces.
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Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #391 on: October 08, 2019, 12:32:43 »
Trudeau is running against the provinces and seems to be an agent of the United Nations or, more likely, bucking for 'Secretary General'.

I'd be happy to send him on his way via magic carpet, which would be culturally appropriate for a cultural appropriator :)

Yes, lets promote him out of his position. I'd buy him a nice blue beret as a parting gift for him to play dress up.
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Offline AlDazz

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #392 on: October 08, 2019, 13:07:30 »
The most alarming part of this whole process is the total absence of any policy on defence or international affairs.  Where is Canada going in the world?
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Offline MilEME09

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #393 on: October 08, 2019, 13:50:40 »
The most alarming part of this whole process is the total absence of any policy on defence or international affairs.  Where is Canada going in the world?

Those are topics in the french debate
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Offline stellarpanther

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #394 on: October 08, 2019, 15:35:34 »
Yankees beat the Twins last night to take the ALDS...

I should have watched that instead, it would of been much more enjoyable.  I feel like I wasted 2 hours of my life last night.




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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #395 on: October 08, 2019, 20:25:23 »
There appears to be something of a fire developing on Twitter vis-a-vis the LPC and an injunction against the Globe and Mail.  :pop:
The latest, from a media criticism/critique site which will not be taking advantage of the big print media tax breaks:
Quote
...  journalists there had been looking into the reasons behind Trudeau’s departure from the school. But they didn’t find anything nefarious.

Reporters at the paper have been confused, for weeks, about this rumoured story.

At a press conference late last week, Globe reporter Marieke Walsh asked Trudeau about what she described as “unfounded rumours” about why he left. “I moved on,” Trudeau said. He was also asked about whether he signed a non-disclosure agreement. His answer, simply, was “no.”

Two well-placed sources at the paper tell Canadaland that, yes, there was an investigation into why he left the school — but that it failed to turn up any evidence of an alleged affair. There was no court injunction, no gag order.

Even the premise of the idea that the courts got involved is wild — while a judge could, in theory, bar a newspaper from reporting such a story, it couldn’t make secret the fact that it heard the case. Trudeau v. The Globe and Mail would be on the court dockets. It isn’t.

The Liberal Party has also told Canadaland categorically, no, there is no court action of any kind against the Globe ...
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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #396 on: October 08, 2019, 20:39:01 »
From Politico, an American view of the debates:

Quote
'You are a phony, you are a fraud': 5 takeaways from the Canadian debate
Canadian party leaders


By RYAN HEATH, ALEXANDER PANETTA and LAUREN GARDNER

10/07/2019 11:57 PM EDT

Justin Trudeau survived, Andrew Scheer went there on the blackface scandal and populists courted north-of-the-border Trump fans with a "Canada First” promise.

Two weeks before Oct. 21 elections, Canada's six party leaders took the stage at the National History Museum in Gatineau, Quebec on Monday night — and with only one official English language debate scheduled, none of them could afford to misfire. Canadians may be a polite bunch, but this was a raucous, squabbling debate.

All eyes were on the once-ascendant Trudeau; only recently an icon of global liberals, he’s been hobbled by a series of scandals and came in with much to lose, including his majority government. For Conservative opposition leader Scheer, it was a final chance to overtake Trudeau’s Liberals in a race that's neck-and-neck, according to national polls. Feeding into that cacophony were regional and fringe parties, including the People’s Party and the Bloc Quebecois, which could play a huge role as spoilers and swing the election to Trudeau’s Liberals — or condemn them to a minority government in a few short weeks. Early voting in the election starts Friday.

Here are five key takeaways from POLITICO's reporting team in Gatineau and Washington, D.C.:

Trudeau didn’t lose — but he didn’t win

Justin Trudeau had the most to lose; he's had a bad few weeks since photos were released of him in racist makeup, and that came after a bad few months of revelations about the SNC-Lavalin scandal. So Trudeau played defense most of Monday night, as rivals on the left and right tried to tackle him. It was always going to be hard for him to assert his prime ministerial authority. He could either wrestle with his five noisy opponents or look on passively from a distance. His efforts to do both made him look average, not unstoppable. After initially holding back from the fray, in the second half of the debate Trudeau tried to turn provincial issues — like Quebec’s Bill 21 on religious headwear in government workplaces and the unpopularity of Ontario Premier Doug Ford — into national ones. It’s not clear it worked. Trudeau’s strongest moments came in explaining his “ambitious but feasible” climate policies. They were attacked relentlessly, and sometimes reasonably, but his opponents didn’t demonstrate their own plans were more workable.

Andrew Scheer passed the prime minister plausibility test

Conservative opposition leader Andrew Scheer — largely unknown internationally — succeeded on two fronts, which delivers him a points victory rather than a knockout blow against Trudeau. First, Scheer proved he can play a moderate when he wants to — something that is essential for him to win over suburban voters around Toronto. Canada's Liberals, after all, want voters to lump Scheer together with Donald Trump. But Scheer was able to brush past Trudeau’s efforts to hammer him for his conservative past and present views on social hot-buttons like abortion. Scheer was also aggressive and successful in confronting Trudeau on his ethical and climate contradictions. He set up several exchanges that allowed voters to look at him and think “there’s my next prime minister.”

Scheer can also consider himself lucky that People's Party leader Maxime Bernier was fairly ineffectual in attacking him from the right, given that his moderate pitch left him exposed on that flank. For all that work and good fortune, Scheer did not deliver a knock-out blow: in fact, he was weakest during what should have been his strong suit, the debate section on pocketbook issues. It's still Trudeau’s election to lose.

Scheer weaponizes the blackface scandal

Scheer brought up Trudeau’s blackface scandal as Exhibit A of his broader case against the prime minister. While the controversy, amazingly, did not come up in the first French-language debate last week, Scheer used the Monday exchange to call Trudeau a phony who’s alienated the voters who believed in him. Remember: For Scheer to prevail Oct. 21 he needs progressives to abandon Trudeau for the NDP and Greens, splitting the vote on the left. So Scheer turned the blackface scandal into an assault. “He can’t even remember how many times he put blackface on. Because the fact of the matter is he’s always wearing a mask,” Scheer said, alluding to how Trudeau, the self-proclaimed feminist, dumped female Cabinet members who crossed him. “Mr. Trudeau, you are a phony, you are a fraud, and you do not deserve to govern this country.” It’s notable that Scheer delivered his toughest shot right off the top; last week in the French debate, pundits concluded he’d had a weak start, when the most viewers are tuned it. Scheer’s poll numbers subsequently sagged in Quebec.

Populism is now part of Canadian politics

For decades, Canadian political parties have embraced multiculturalism, yet on Monday night People's Party leader Maxime Bernier directly bemoaned current immigration levels. He said Canada adds “the equivalent of one Nova Scotia every three years.” He also winked at pro-Trump Canadians with an early reference to “Canada First.” But it’s unclear how much of a dent he truly made. Bernier’s national poll numbers are atrocious, and, speaking in his second language, English, he wasn’t nearly as polished as the mainstream Conservative, Scheer, whom he’s hoping to challenge. Scheer almost certainly got the better of their exchanges. And he raised real doubts about the authenticity of Bernier’s Canadian populist turn. Sheer alluded to Bernier once having been a Quebec separatist, and to his past as a small-government libertarian in a mainstream Conservative Cabinet before his recent, and sudden, mimicking of Trump. “I’m not sure which Maxime Bernier I’m debating tonight,” Scheer said.

Left-wingers won the battle of the minor parties.


New Democratic Party leader Jagmeet Singh and Green Party leader Elizabeth May landed more solid jabs against Trudeau, from whom they need to steal votes, than Bernier did in targeting Scheer. The debates hold outsize importance for minor parties because they're rare opportunities to get in front of millions of voters on an equal footing as the major parties. On the left, Singh made sure to set himself apart from Trudeau on everything from taxes to indigenous relations. He also went in on the Liberals’ climate record and the Conservatives’ plan simultaneously, telling the voters they “do not need to choose between Mr. Delay and Mr. Deny.” Having had the worst year of all the minor parties in national opinion polls, Singh had the most room for improvement and he used it.

May took all other leaders to task on their climate plans — a Green Party leader would do that — but she made sure to turn directly to Trudeau to register her disappointment with his climate record, noting that Canada is far from achieving the carbon emission reductions scientists say are necessary to avert the worst warming of the planet. Her main point: Trudeau does not deserve to govern alone in a second term, and the Greens deserve to be the junior partner holding him to account. Her killer line: “Voting for Green MPs is your very best guarantee, Canada, that you don’t get the government you least want.”

Scheer did a better job pushing back his fringe threat. In an early exchange on immigration, he dropped one of several allusions to Bernier being a fraud. “You have changed,” Scheer told the self-styled populist. “Now you are making your policy based on trying to get Likes and Retweets from the darkest parts of Twitter.”

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #397 on: October 09, 2019, 08:41:46 »
Where is Canada going in the world?
The second part of the question would be ".....and why am I in this hand basket?"   :pop:

Offline ModlrMike

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #398 on: October 09, 2019, 15:18:35 »
We're clearly approaching peak stupid; although I acknowledge that there's probably no such thing:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/sgro-blackface-comments-singh-1.5314744

The look on the interviewer's face as she tried to process what she was being told is priceless. She'll probably still win her seat though  :facepalm:
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Offline mariomike

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Re: General Election: Oct 21, 2019
« Reply #399 on: October 09, 2019, 15:55:24 »
The Doug factor,

Quote
Global News

October 9, 2019

Doug Ford factor looms large in election as Liberals seize on premier’s tanking popularity

Doug Ford may have kept his promise to stay out of the federal election spotlight, but it was inevitable that he would be front and centre anyway.

Liberal Leader Justin Trudeau has seized onto the Ontario premier’s tanking popularity and tried to anchor it to federal Conservative Leader Andrew Scheer, invoking Ford’s name at every turn as a harbinger of Conservative doom and gloom.
https://globalnews.ca/news/6010782/doug-ford-factor-federal-election/