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Sacrifice Medal
Wound Stripe

Author Topic: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread  (Read 218702 times)

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Offline Towards_the_gap

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #800 on: May 07, 2013, 19:06:04 »
Sorry for the necro post, but I am looking for some advice.

Since leaving the service, I've kept in touch with some former tour-mates, for obvious reasons, one of whom was blown up twice (ie <3m from a strike), suffered concussions and persistent symptoms of TBI for over 3 years after the strike. He was never awarded the SM, and although he has never said exactly 'why didn't I get it', it has come up in conversation, and I was wondering, if he wanted to pursue it, could he apply for it as a veteran having left the service? When I was in I never understood the process of application, was it the CO or MO who did the paperwork, all I know is this kid got blown off his feet, got back up and did his job, twice, and because nothing broke skin and he persuaded the medic to leave him on the ground (as we were short dudes already, 3 WIA, 1 KIA), he was never recognised, yet he has suffered far more than some who have this medal.


Offline PuckChaser

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #801 on: May 07, 2013, 19:17:33 »
As long as there are records of him being in the strike, he should be able to apply for it much like a member with an OSI can receive the SM years later when their symptoms persist.

Offline Capt. Happy

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #802 on: May 07, 2013, 19:21:20 »
I believe that after leaving the CF, he can apply for it through VAC, but I am not 100% sure on that. I think, solely by your description, if he has not met the prereqs on the medical side for treatment, he won't be eligible. That being said, if he has been diagnosed with TBI that can be attributed to his tour, he might have an avenue to support it.

The big thing is that he has to have had some type of sustained medical attention after the incident for symptoms presented IAW the prerequisites.

 :2c:

Edit: Let me check with a buddy who works at DH&R tomorrow.  I just checked VAC's website, and it only lists applying for WW and Korea medals. The GG's site doesn't list a whole lot. As noted below, there is an application he could use. The thing that kills me about this medal is that most soldiers are too proud to order it for fear of looking like bling hunters, yet in a lot of cases, units are not ordering them on their behalf either. IMHO, as one of the prereqs for living recipients of this medal is a certain level of med attention, the med side should be the ones ordering it to ensure all those who deserve it receive it and don't have to ask for it.
« Last Edit: May 08, 2013, 06:42:52 by Capt. Happy »

Offline Towards_the_gap

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #803 on: May 07, 2013, 19:33:12 »
As long as there are records of him being in the strike, he should be able to apply for it much like a member with an OSI can receive the SM years later when their symptoms persist.

I like-wise wondered about another member from another regt, suffering a pretty lingering OSI from a different strike. Thanks for the help thus far!

Offline PuckChaser

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #804 on: May 07, 2013, 19:46:40 »
I like-wise wondered about another member from another regt, suffering a pretty lingering OSI from a different strike. Thanks for the help thus far!

Good friend of mine was awarded a Sacrifice Medal for his OSI, one of the first in fact. Mental wounds definitely count, nearest VAC/JPSU would know more.

Offline the 48th regulator

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #805 on: May 07, 2013, 19:57:34 »
He can also use this application;

http://hqrcna.com/files/medal_app_initial_e.pdf

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Offline wildman0101

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #806 on: May 07, 2013, 21:20:40 »
Sorry to bump in ,,but I heard about a cold war medal. Doe's this have to do with 70's 80's.?
And if so where can I apply.  Thank's. Cheer's.coty B
scoty b (aka the brat)
so my sister say's
she would know as she
pointed out ,,,, quote
my lil brother is one bad "mo-fo"
dont f*** with him you'll just get hurt.

Offline mariomike

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #807 on: May 07, 2013, 21:27:31 »
Sorry to bump in ,,but I heard about a cold war medal. Doe's this have to do with 70's 80's.?
And if so where can I apply.  Thank's. Cheer's.coty B

NDP MP introduces bill to create "Defence of Canada Medal (1946-1989)" 
http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php/topic,103502.0.html
"Mr. Speaker, I am proud to be able to reintroduce this bill for the establishment and award of a defence of Canada medal for the men and women who served in the defence of Canada during the cold war."

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #808 on: May 07, 2013, 21:30:09 »
*edit*

mariomike beat me to posting the link
« Last Edit: May 08, 2013, 20:05:07 by -Skeletor- »

Offline Towards_the_gap

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #809 on: November 05, 2015, 20:22:34 »
I believe that after leaving the CF, he can apply for it through VAC, but I am not 100% sure on that. I think, solely by your description, if he has not met the prereqs on the medical side for treatment, he won't be eligible. That being said, if he has been diagnosed with TBI that can be attributed to his tour, he might have an avenue to support it.

The big thing is that he has to have had some type of sustained medical attention after the incident for symptoms presented IAW the prerequisites.

 :2c:

Edit: Let me check with a buddy who works at DH&R tomorrow.  I just checked VAC's website, and it only lists applying for WW and Korea medals. The GG's site doesn't list a whole lot. As noted below, there is an application he could use. The thing that kills me about this medal is that most soldiers are too proud to order it for fear of looking like bling hunters, yet in a lot of cases, units are not ordering them on their behalf either. IMHO, as one of the prereqs for living recipients of this medal is a certain level of med attention, the med side should be the ones ordering it to ensure all those who deserve it receive it and don't have to ask for it.


So.. sorry for the necropost but I thought I would update it and seek the opinion of the masses.

Bumped into said former colleague a few weeks ago, and over a coffee asked 'hey did you ever send off for the SM like I said you should' he said he hummed and hawed about it for a while but finally did, sending in the application with details about how he has required sustained medical care ever since (psych's, MD's and neurologist trying to attenuate the symptoms).

He gets a letter back saying that since he didn't suffer a traumatic injury requiring immediate medevac and treatment, he was ineligible. In disgust he threw the letter away.

Thoughts? Appears that old '2 classes of wounded' syndrome still persists (visible and non-visible).


Offline Schindler's Lift

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #810 on: November 05, 2015, 20:49:14 »
Even Frank Burns got a Purple Heart for a shell fragment in the eye.  Egg shell fragment mind you but it as a result of an air raid at breakfast. time.

Offline mariomike

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #811 on: November 05, 2015, 21:34:08 »
Even Frank Burns got a Purple Heart for a shell fragment in the eye.  Egg shell fragment mind you but it as a result of an air raid at breakfast. time.

If I recall correctly, he got another for throwing his back out while dancing with Major Houlihan.

Offline Schindler's Lift

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #812 on: November 05, 2015, 21:38:37 »
If I recall correctly, he got another for throwing his back out while dancing with Major Houlihan.

Yeah but who can blame him on that one?  lol

Offline Towards_the_gap

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #813 on: November 05, 2015, 23:09:50 »
I'm sorry, are you guys being facetious? A TBI is the same as eggshell in the eye in a comical, fictional TV show?

Offline Schindler's Lift

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #814 on: November 05, 2015, 23:45:21 »
Of course not.  Nobody is making light of TBI, PTSD or any medical issue (seen or unseen).  My intention was to point out the absurdity of our overly stringent guidelines contrasted to the overly lax standard in the show.

Offline Teager

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #815 on: November 06, 2015, 10:45:42 »
TTG I find it odd your friend was denied.

Here is the criteria for the SM.

Quote
ELIGIBILITY & CRITERIA

The Medal may be awarded to members of the Canadian Forces, members of an allied force working as an integral part of the Canadian Forces such as exchange personnel, civilian employees of the Government of Canada or Canadian citizens under contract with the Government of Canada, on the condition that they were deployed as part of a military mission under the authority of the Canadian Forces, that have, on or after October 7, 2001, died or been wounded under honourable circumstances as a direct result of hostile action on the condition that the wounds that were sustained required treatment by a physician and the treatment has been documented.

The Medal may also be awarded posthumously to any member of the Canadian Forces who served on or after 7 October 2001 in the Regular Force, Primary Reserve, Cadet Organizations Administration and Training Service or Canadian Rangers, or any member of the Supplementary Reserve who served in or with one of the components aforementioned on or after 7 October 2001, and died under honourable circumstances as a result of an injury or disease related to military service.

When a death is obviously related to service, the SM will be issued immediately. When the cause of death is not clear, the SM will only be issued once Veterans Affairs Canada (VAC) has officially determined that the death was related to military service, in such a case, delays are to be expected before the SM can be awarded.

http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dhr-ddhr/chc-tdh/chart-tableau-eng.asp?ref=SM

And here is examples of elegiable cases forthe medal.

Quote
Examples for the Sacrifice Medal - Eligible Cases

This list is not all inclusive and should only be used as a guide when considering eligibility.
Last updated 27 January 2010

ELIGIBLE CASES

Died under honourable conditions on or after 7 October 2001:

as a direct result of hostile action;
as a direct result of military service including:
death during training or operations, following a vehicle accident, plane crash, shipwreck, parachute or diving accident, loss at sea, an accidental discharge of weapons, an ammunition handling accident, a fire or explosion, fatal fall, heart attack or as a result of a heat stroke, physical exhaustion or stress during mandated training;
accidental death when travelling on duty;
death as a result of mental disorders that are, based on the review by a qualified mental health care practitioner, directly attributable to military service.
Wounded under honourable circumstances as a direct result of hostile action:

Enemy gunshot wound in action
Improvised Explosive Device (IED) strike against a vehicle
Explosion of a pressure-triggered anti-personnel mine
Aircraft shot down or ship sunk or damaged by hostile fire
Rocket attack inside the wire
Explosion while removing or neutralizing land mines or bombs (due to mine or bomb disposal duty)
Building collapse while attempting to rescue individuals trapped following an enemy air strike or terrorist attack (due to rescue duty)
Vehicle-borne suicide attack against a convoy or ship
Terrorist attack against an embassy or government building in Canada or elsewhere
collision of an aircraft, vehicle or vessel, on the condition that the occurrence is directly related to a hostile action
Wounded as a result of fire aimed at a hostile force or what is or was thought to be a hostile force (due to friendly fire):

Hit by bombs dropped by our own or allied forces planes
Hit by misdirected naval missile, artillery or riffle fire by our own or allied forces
Wounds that require not less than seven (7) days of treatment in hospital or equivalent treatment that were caused by:

Exposure to the elements as a result of aircraft, vehicle or vessel being destroyed or disabled by hostile action :
Aircraft shot down by enemy anti-aircraft weapon, uninjured survivors hold out for several days in the desert and are subsequently hospitalized or die as a result of exposure (dehydration, sunburn, heatstroke)
Exposure while at sea following sinking of a ship or destruction of a plane by enemy fire
Harsh treatment or neglect while a captive of a hostile force
Use of nuclear, biological or chemical agents by a hostile force
Mental disorder diagnosed by qualified mental health practitioner and directly attributable to hostile action (a review of the medical file is necessary to confirm the link between the disorder and hostile action):

Operational Stress Injury (OSI) resulting from enemy action or suicide caused by such mental disorders related to hostile action

http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dhr-ddhr/chc-tdh/smec-msce-eng.asp

And ineligible cases.

Quote
Examples for the Sacrifice Medal - Ineligible Cases

This list is not all inclusive and should only be used as a guide when considering eligibility.
Last updated 27 January 2010

INELIGIBLE CASES (non-qualifying)

Wounds due to accidents in theatre but not directly attributable to a hostile action:

Falling from a building or other structure
Vehicle roll-over caused by road conditions while on patrol
Wounds due to other circumstances and not caused by hostile action:

Vehicle accident, plane crash or shipwreck
Vehicle accident while traveling to or from place of duty
Natural occurrences such as lightning strikes, tornadoes, floods, earthquakes (acts of God)
Explosion in a well-marked mine field where the victim ventured to retrieve a war souvenir
Negligent discharge of weapon
Self-inflicted
Death by suicide not related to a mental disorder caused by hostile action nor directly attributable to service.

Death of natural causes not directly related to service.

http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dhr-ddhr/chc-tdh/smic-msci-eng.asp

To me he was treated by a physician has an injury. The criteria doesn't say it has to require immediate treatment and to be medevac.

Offline Towards_the_gap

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #816 on: November 06, 2015, 14:08:06 »
Of course not.  Nobody is making light of TBI, PTSD or any medical issue (seen or unseen).  My intention was to point out the absurdity of our overly stringent guidelines contrasted to the overly lax standard in the show.

I did figure as much. Text doesn't convey tone very well. Apologies for any offense!

Offline Towards_the_gap

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #817 on: November 06, 2015, 14:16:32 »
TTG I find it odd your friend was denied.

To me he was treated by a physician has an injury. The criteria doesn't say it has to require immediate treatment and to be medevac.

I guess to some mandarin in DHH that criteria is open to quite liberal interpretation.


Offline Teager

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #818 on: November 06, 2015, 19:20:04 »
I'm wondering if there was wording that made them think something else. I assume your friend suffered a TBI due to a blast. If that's the case then it should be straight forward. He suffered an injury (TBI) as a direct result from hostile action. I don't see how that can be rejected but apparently someone was able to reject it.

Offline Towards_the_gap

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #819 on: November 06, 2015, 19:24:47 »
I don't know what process they go through in Ottawa to confirm such things. He had a number of CF98's with 'injuries were a result of hostile action in a Special Duty Area' and witness statements declaring 'Spr XX was xx ft from the blast seat as the IED went off'.

As far as I know there were now blue on blue IED incidents so they really don't have a leg to stand on regarding wording, but alas. I will see if he wants to reapply and if so, have him FOI all his med docs and send copies of everything TBI related along with his application.

Offline captloadie

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Re: Sacrifice Medal Mega Thread
« Reply #820 on: December 23, 2016, 11:11:35 »
From anyone that has either submitted, or reviewed a submission, I could use some assistance. Several submissions have arrived on my desk for review and furtherance where the member has suffered from PTSD attributable to incidents in Afghanistan. The details are very generic and don't give specific details. I want to ensure that if these files go forward, there can be no refuting the entitlement. Is the Dr's signoff enough?